About to buy my first M. (M10,M10R or M11)

[sometimesmaybe]

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20 minutes ago, jaapv said:

enjoying the newest lenses (far more important than the box

agreed. save your coin on the body and splurge on glass 💸

[jaapv]

2 minutes ago, RMeier said:

Many thanks for your post. This really helped me a lot to clear my mind.

I do think I`ll get the M10R for now and enjoy what I have with this camera  & safe the money for a future lens or another upgrade.

And maybe when the an M11P comes out.. I can decided wether I do "need" the upgrade path with more MP, Battery, and so on or not.. 

 

I will keep you postet about my journey Thanks guys you helped me a lot!

Have a great day!

Reto

 

You'll be back about  buying lenses...  .   

[Kiwimac]

1 hour ago, jaapv said:

Leica factory guarantee is ALWAYS transferable. In Europe any guarantee is by law.

Ah. That’s good. New Zealand laws aren’t that beneficial. Here, warranties usually apply only to the original buyer unless the manufacturer states specifically otherwise. 

[jaapv]

But if the manufacturer is EU you can claim warranty by the maker. A Leica you can send to wWetzlar. 

[RMeier]

vor 9 Minuten schrieb Musky:

well then you weren’t serious about carrying batteries. If you’re not really serious about it then yes. Save money and the headaches of the M11 and just get an M10R. And get it from a reliable source and even then check it thoroughly before you buy it. A used Leica M can turn into a nightmare. 

Prepare to buy 1 or 2 extra batteries. At least 1 extra if you want all day shooting. 

Well. Let’s say get 2 extra because you’re “spoiled by your Sony” as you say so you’re going to be using the LCD a lot I think. 

Eventually you’ll learn to use the M as a rangefinder and not another mirrorless camera. Hopefully you’ll like the experience. You may hate it. Let’s see. 

 

I usually use my camera while hiking or biking oder traveling. Than the main focus is not photography, therefore I think i never shot 300 or more frames a day. 

I may get one spare but for sure not more. I acctualy never use the Sonys LCD except for Astro. How come you think I use it a lot? (maybe 95% EVF use)..

I absoultly understand what a rangefinder is.. I dont intend to buy "another mirrorles camera" with the Leica. I do have a Bessa which is a rangefinder, and I love to use it as a rangefinder.. 

I think same will apply if I get an M10R. I buy it since it is a rangefinder and thats how i would like to use it..... as a rangefinder.. not as a mirroless camera.. 

 

 

[M Street Photographer]

As far as battery life goes, I averaged 350 shots with the M10 R.
If I adapt a lens and use the LifeView with the Visoflex, there are hardly any fewer shots with one battery. Nevertheless, I have a second battery, purely for security and my peace of mind. But as I said before, I haven't had to use the second battery until today.
The M11 certainly has advantages over the M 10 R, but for me these are not so relevant that I decided on the M10 R.
Take the M10 R and, at some point, treat yourself to a "beautiful" lens that also fills your heart.

As others have already written, if you decide on an M, you often use it for a very long time and do not go along with every version jump.
Of course, it may be that you are enthusiastic about an M12, for whatever reason, and want to upgrade it. But that can also happen to you as the owner of the M11. But once you get to know the M10 R, you will be very happy and want to use it for a long time. Please also consider that Leica still sells the M10 R as a new device.

[LocalHero1953]

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No M10, M10R or M11 experience here (mine is with M9, M240, other Leicas), so all I can say is what I would do in your shoes - and that is what you have done: M10R! I might have gone for the M10, as I am not a megapixel fan, but the M10R sensor brings more qualities than just pixels.

Batteries are light and readily available. You can start with what you have and add more when you decide you need them.

 

16 minutes ago, Musky said:

A used Leica M can turn into a nightmare.

A used anything can turn into a nightmare - it depends if you're a glass-half-full or glass-half-empty person. But a characteristic of all Leicas is that they hold their value more than other brands, so the market expresses its opinion.

[M Street Photographer]

Well, used or new? I bought mine as a demo model with 300 releases from a dealer (a happy coincidence) with a 2 year warranty and after registering with Leica got the 3rd year warranty.
I saved a lot of money compared to the new price and treated myself to the 35 2.4 Summarit ( used by the dealer, also with 1 year guarantee) , which I still have a lot of fun with.

Edited December 27, 2022 by M Street Photographer

[jaapv]

58 minutes ago, Musky said:

There are so many threads about this same thing is ridiculous.

If you don’t want to carry spare batteries then get an M11. That one requirement basically gets any M10 out of the equation. That’s all there is to it. no need to even talk about the M10R.
Good luck. 

There is nothing ridiculous about consulting this forum. This is a community of helpful members. At least the vast majority of them are. 

[LocalHero1953]

I bought M9 and TL2 used, M240 and SL2 as a 'Q' versions (i.e. demo or similar, refurbished), and CL and SL2-S as new. In general, if a used version is available from a reputable source (an established dealer) then I would prefer to buy used, avoiding the initial price drop. Unfortunately the CL and SL2-S were just launched when I bought, and used ones were not available.

[jaapv]

I wonder about people who advocate USB charging over carrying a spare battery which is about the same encumbrance as a bar of chocolate- If you are out shooting it is not just the number of images. Just forget to switch the camera off before putting it into the bag causing it to activate and drain itself, for instance.
When out somewhere with an empty camera where are you going to find an USB outlet and are you going to wait for a couple of hours? 

[M Street Photographer]

I avoid unplanned power losses of the batteries (bag) by setting an automatic switch-off after 2 minutes. If this is too short, you can extend the time interval.

[jakontil]

At first was difficult and forget to do, but now my brain has exercised, no cocked when shooting film and stow back in to the bag, and turn dial off when it’s digital lol, im amazed with myself

[Jeff S]

1 hour ago, jaapv said:

I wonder about people who advocate USB charging over carrying a spare battery which is about the same encumbrance as a bar of chocolate- 

Guess these people never carried an extra roll of film, or are just too young for us.

Jeff

[RMeier]

vor 3 Stunden schrieb Musky:

Well. Let’s say get 2 extra because you’re “spoiled by your Sony” as you say so you’re going to be using the LCD a lot I think. Click-check the lcd  click- check the lcd click-check the lcd. That’s going to kill the battery in about 3-4 hours. If you start at 9am by noon is going to be dangerously close to having to change the battery if not dead already.

Once you learn exposure, don’t spray at everything that moves and trust yourself and stop checking the LCD every 2 seconds, if you start at 9am by about noon it’ll be around 50%.

Eventually you’ll learn to use the M as a rangefinder and not another mirrorless camera. Hopefully you’ll like the experience. You may hate it. Let’s see. 

Thank you for your "kind" words.

Let me make this clear. I guess you don't know my style of photography right? you would be surprised how "different" I shoot compared to your guessing of sony photographers (spray, screencheck every other second..)   I traveled for two weeks to the middle east. Used the sony almost daily (but as I said I don't shoot 1000frames a day) and after 2 weeks I still had over 20% left from the first battery and never charged it... Thats what I call spoiled... I never ever needed a second battery with my sony.. and I never ever sprayed since 99% of the time I shoot with MF Voigtländer or Zeiss lenses adapted to my Sony... The other lenses (except the 21mm Loxia for astro and 65mm APO CV for scanning film) collect dust on the shelf. I don't event have a AF lens except the 70-200 (which i use once per year ).

I do think I know exposure pretty well, (even in film), and I trust my finger a lot  

I was just asking since a came from Fuji (X-T1, X-T2, X-T3) before sony, and sony is night and day compared to the battery life of Fuji. 

I think I can easy live one day or two with one battery on the M10R.. but I will get one spare for sure, just in case i need one. 

And I'm 100% sure i will not hate the leica. .. i do enjoy the rangefinder of my bessa a thousand times more than the EVF of the sony... just the Bessa is film and therefor way more expensive in daily use thats why I opt for the sony most of the time.. plus.. thats why I am looking for a digital leica..

 

Anyway many thank for your inputs i really much appreciate it!👍

Reto 

 

 

 

Edited December 27, 2022 by RMeier

[charlesphoto99]

2 hours ago, Jeff S said:

Guess these people never carried an extra roll of film, or are just too young for us.

Jeff

Or an 'extra' hundred rolls. Of 120. The good ol' days....

[charlesphoto99]

1 hour ago, RMeier said:

but as I said I don't shoot 1000frames a day

 

 

 

 

Don't worry, one could still shoot 1000 frames a day and not be 'spraying.' Some Leica users can be a bit full of themselves if you ask me...

[Jeff S]

1 minute ago, charlesphoto99 said:

Or an 'extra' hundred rolls. Of 120. The good ol' days....

Or a 4x5, tripod, a sack of film holders, a light meter, etc.  Now just a phone for most.  I’m officially old.

Jeff

[jaapv]

2 hours ago, Jeff S said:

Guess these people never carried an extra roll of film, or are just too young for us.

Jeff

And they forget that they have to carry an USB cable instead.  

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[Photoworks]

1 hour ago, RMeier said:

Used the sony almost daily (but as I said I don't shoot 1000frames a day) and after 2 weeks I still had over 20% left from the first battery and never charged it... Thats what I call spoiled... I never ever needed a second battery with my sony..

Magical.  Not my experience. I alway take 12 batteries and a charger for a long day shoot with 2 Sony   . Usuale 1-2 still good at the end of the day