bkphoto Posted July 10, 2023 Share #1621 Posted July 10, 2023 Advertisement (gone after registration) 4 hours ago, lct said: Interesting thank you. Do you mean SD card only was the storage option when the freeze occurred? Just curious. No, IN only when freeze occurred. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted July 10, 2023 Posted July 10, 2023 Hi bkphoto, Take a look here M11 freeze issues [Merged]. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
M11 for me Posted July 10, 2023 Share #1622 Posted July 10, 2023 vor 7 Stunden schrieb bkphoto: I’ve shot thousands of photos on my M11 without issue until today, after taking several photos in succession I go to take another photo and…nothing. No response from the camera. The camera is on/metering and everything. Had to pull the battery. This was the only time I’ve been shooting with internal memory (no SD in the camera). I always use SD card only. I think that what you describe here has little to do with the freezing problem that can really be a big problem for some M11 users. Your case is just a software hanger as it happens with every electronic device in some situations. Think of how often you had to reboot some Software on your PC during the last 12 months. You write it yourself that up to today you shoot tousands of pictures without any problem. So I am sure that you will be happy during some additional thousands of shots. I hope that you agree. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lct Posted July 10, 2023 Share #1623 Posted July 10, 2023 2 hours ago, jakontil said: I never have a sony tough, but yeah it was released way before the tough UHS II, 300mb/s speed Sorry, i misread your post below 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
scott kirkpatrick Posted July 10, 2023 Share #1624 Posted July 10, 2023 12 hours ago, bkphoto said: I’ve shot thousands of photos on my M11 without issue until today, after taking several photos in succession I go to take another photo and…nothing. No response from the camera. The camera is on/metering and everything. Had to pull the battery. This was the only time I’ve been shooting with internal memory (no SD in the camera). I always use SD card only. 8 hours ago, lct said: Interesting thank you. Do you mean SD card only was the storage option when the freeze occurred? Just curious. There are storage options that might cause the camera to get very confused when you shoot with no SD card. For example, if you have set DNG --> SD card, JPEG --> IN, and then shoot DNG only... Were you set to force a write to the missing SD card, without overflow to the IN memory? There is also an option to write ONLY on the SD card, but I am not sure why one would use that. And since there is an error message that shows in the M10s (from the days before the IN memory) when you start up the camera with no SD card, I would expect that message would still be there if you selected the SD ONLY option in the menu but failed to insert an SD card. Just checked. The message appeared when I pressed the shutter with SD only option set but no card present. The camera did not freeze. Then I set DNG --> SD, removed the SD card and shot a few frames. No error message, and the shots went to the IN memory. No freeze. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lct Posted July 10, 2023 Share #1625 Posted July 10, 2023 43 minutes ago, scott kirkpatrick said: There are storage options that might cause the camera to get very confused when you shoot with no SD card. For example, if you have set DNG --> SD card, JPEG --> IN, and then shoot DNG only... Were you set to force a write to the missing SD card, without overflow to the IN memory? There is also an option to write ONLY on the SD card, but I am not sure why one would use that. And since there is an error message that shows in the M10s (from the days before the IN memory) when you start up the camera with no SD card, I would expect that message would still be there if you selected the SD ONLY option in the menu but failed to insert an SD card. Just checked. The message appeared when I pressed the shutter with SD only option set but no card present. The camera did not freeze. Then I set DNG --> SD, removed the SD card and shot a few frames. No error message, and the shots went to the IN memory. No freeze. No freeze here either but i can't seem to find a storage option for all files on IN and zero on SD. Am i missing something? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bkphoto Posted July 10, 2023 Share #1626 Posted July 10, 2023 8 hours ago, M11 for me said: I think that what you describe here has little to do with the freezing problem that can really be a big problem for some M11 users. Your case is just a software hanger as it happens with every electronic device in some situations. Think of how often you had to reboot some Software on your PC during the last 12 months. You write it yourself that up to today you shoot tousands of pictures without any problem. So I am sure that you will be happy during some additional thousands of shots. I hope that you agree. 100% disagree. I’ve never experienced this with a single digital camera in my lifetime - 20+ years across Canon, Fuji and Sony. It’s an unacceptable bug, especially when you factor in the cost of the device. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bkphoto Posted July 10, 2023 Share #1627 Posted July 10, 2023 (edited) Advertisement (gone after registration) 2 hours ago, lct said: No freeze here either but i can't seem to find a storage option for all files on IN and zero on SD. Am i missing something? Remove your SD and it will shoot to IN only. I’m just suggesting it’s possible that IN only shooting is more susceptible to crashing, for some unknown reason. Edited July 10, 2023 by bkphoto Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lct Posted July 10, 2023 Share #1628 Posted July 10, 2023 32 minutes ago, bkphoto said: Remove your SD and it will shoot to IN only. [...] Indeed and it is why i asked you if SD card only was the storage option when the freeze occurred. You answered no but i still don't understand what storage option was selected then. Just trying to understand, sorry. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bkphoto Posted July 10, 2023 Share #1629 Posted July 10, 2023 3 minutes ago, lct said: Indeed and it is why i asked you if SD card only was the storage option when the freeze occurred. You answered no but i still don't understand what storage option was selected then. Just trying to understand, sorry. Of course - to clarify I was set to SD -> IN but had no SD card in the device. Honestly I thought my SD was in, I would have appreciated some type of notice that it was missing even if I still am able to shoot to IN. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
scott kirkpatrick Posted July 10, 2023 Share #1630 Posted July 10, 2023 (edited) 1 hour ago, bkphoto said: Of course - to clarify I was set to SD -> IN but had no SD card in the device. Honestly I thought my SD was in, I would have appreciated some type of notice that it was missing even if I still am able to shoot to IN. "SD--> IN" isn't an option. When I set all --> SD (and nothing to IN) and try to shoot without an SD card, I just get an error message and no picture is taken. This happens whether I am shooting DNG, JPEG or both. With my usual setting (DNG + JPG --> SD first, then INT, but leave the SD chip out it writes to the INT memory without any complaint. Which curious, because when I use this setting and have a full SD card, it gives me an error message, and requires a button press to acknowledge, which is an annoying delay. Edited July 10, 2023 by scott kirkpatrick Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bkphoto Posted July 10, 2023 Share #1631 Posted July 10, 2023 9 minutes ago, scott kirkpatrick said: "SD--> IN" isn't an option. When I set all --> SD (and nothing to IN) and try to shoot without an SD card, I just get an error message and no picture is taken. This happens whether I am shooting DNG, JPEG or both. With my usual setting (DNG + JPG --> SD first, then INT, but leave the SD chip out it writes to the INT memory without any complaint. Which curious, because when I use this setting and have a full SD card, it gives me an error message, and requires a button press to acknowledge, which is an annoying delay. Sorry, SD+IN. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jakontil Posted July 11, 2023 Share #1632 Posted July 11, 2023 14 hours ago, M11 for me said: I think that what you describe here has little to do with the freezing problem that can really be a big problem for some M11 users. Your case is just a software hanger as it happens with every electronic device in some situations. Think of how often you had to reboot some Software on your PC during the last 12 months. You write it yourself that up to today you shoot tousands of pictures without any problem. So I am sure that you will be happy during some additional thousands of shots. I hope that you agree. Exactly what i thought, a reboot once in a while might help since M11 users might have the tendency to use usb port to transfer and charge, never take the battery off which would do a hard reboot i presume but that’s my wild thoughts… this only relates to software problem, not solving the more complexed situation Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bkphoto Posted July 11, 2023 Share #1633 Posted July 11, 2023 1 hour ago, jakontil said: Exactly what i thought, a reboot once in a while might help since M11 users might have the tendency to use usb port to transfer and charge, never take the battery off which would do a hard reboot i presume but that’s my wild thoughts… this only relates to software problem, not solving the more complexed situation I’ve never had to do this for any camera in my life, that said battery life is much longer on M11. It definitely could just be another firmware reliability issue. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lct Posted July 11, 2023 Share #1634 Posted July 11, 2023 Or contradictory orders given to the camera. SD+IN = priority to SD vs no card inserted = priority to IN. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
M11 for me Posted July 11, 2023 Share #1635 Posted July 11, 2023 (edited) vor 14 Stunden schrieb lct: Or contradictory orders given to the camera. SD+IN = priority to SD vs no card inserted = priority to IN. However this was not a reason for my camera to fail. I just tested it out. If no SD card is recognised my M11 just goes to internal memory. No freeze 😊 Edited July 11, 2023 by M11 for me Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lct Posted July 11, 2023 Share #1636 Posted July 11, 2023 3 hours ago, M11 for me said: However this was not a reason for my camera to fail. I just tested it out. If no SD card is recognised my M11 just goes to internal memory. No freeze 😊 My M11 doesn't freeze either but i'm not sure all M11 cameras have the exact same response to contradictory orders. Reminds me of uncoded lenses some people try to use with lens detection auto. If the camera were correctly designed, lens detection auto should be disabled or greyed out when an uncoded lens is mounted. Similar issue here. Storage options involving SD should be disabled or greyed out when no SD card is inserted. Fact is this is not the way the M11 is working for now, hence sub-optimal situations where contradictory orders can be given to the camera. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dscdsc Posted July 13, 2023 Share #1637 Posted July 13, 2023 My M11 has been reliable since the newer firmwares. However I started getting a different type of lock up/freeze in the past week. This time the lock ups happen when using live view. The live view image freezes and there is no response to any button. even turning off the switch doesn't close the shutter. I have to pull the battery. This sounds a little crazy but these freezes have coincided with when I got my 35mm FLEv2 a week ago. I've experienced the lock up three times in the last 7 days. anyone else see this? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Qlan Posted July 13, 2023 Share #1638 Posted July 13, 2023 (edited) 5 minutes ago, dscdsc said: My M11 has been reliable since the newer firmwares. However I started getting a different type of lock up/freeze in the past week. This time the lock ups happen when using live view. The live view image freezes and there is no response to any button. even turning off the switch doesn't close the shutter. I have to pull the battery. This sounds a little crazy but these freezes have coincided with when I got my 35mm FLEv2 a week ago. I've experienced the lock up three times in the last 7 days. anyone else see this? When does the freeze happen (startup, after taking a picture, etc)? This is the same symptom as the freeze I had at startup with uncoded lenses. The difference is that the freeze happens at startup, there is no lights in the viewfinder, pressing the shutter doesn't do anything, I can open and navigate in the menu, but as soon as I open live view, I get a black image (with other information on the screen), and then nothing is responsive and I have to pop the battery. If you use live view by default, then maybe it is the same failure mode, but you just skip the previous steps. And this supports the hypothesis we had that it has something to do with lens detection (either hardware or software). Edited July 13, 2023 by Qlan Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dscdsc Posted July 13, 2023 Share #1639 Posted July 13, 2023 5 minutes ago, Qlan said: When does the freeze happen (startup, after taking a picture, etc)? This is the same symptom as the freeze I had at startup with uncoded lenses. The difference is that the freeze happens at startup, there is no lights in the viewfinder, pressing the shutter doesn't do anything, I can open and navigate in the menu, but as soon as I open live view, I get a black image (with other information on the screen), and then nothing is responsive and I have to pop the battery. If you use live view by default, then maybe it is the same failure mode, but you just skip the previous steps. And this supports the hypothesis we had that it has something to do with lens detection (either hardware or software). My freeze sounds different than yours. It happens after I take a photo. The rear LCD stays frozen and I can see the last used shutter speed in the viewfinder and that is stuck as well. I don't use live view by default, only when I need to position myself and it's more comfortable to frame from my chest or waist level. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jakontil Posted July 13, 2023 Share #1640 Posted July 13, 2023 14 hours ago, dscdsc said: My M11 has been reliable since the newer firmwares. However I started getting a different type of lock up/freeze in the past week. This time the lock ups happen when using live view. The live view image freezes and there is no response to any button. even turning off the switch doesn't close the shutter. I have to pull the battery. This sounds a little crazy but these freezes have coincided with when I got my 35mm FLEv2 a week ago. I've experienced the lock up three times in the last 7 days. anyone else see this? mine freezes once when shooting this combination, but that's after some quick succession and when i slowed down a tiny bit, it was oke, i mean like i did it intentionally with quick fire Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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