Leica M Tri-Elmar 16-18-21 out of production?

[HPFM]

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After testing during a Leica-Workshop in the alps (Austria, Dachstein) i decided to purchase the tri-elmar for landscape with my m11. The dealer near Stuttgart (South west Germany) had some problems to get the tri-elmar from Leica and told me, that Leica no longer produces it 😬.  So I got one with the viewfinder as a package although I didn't want the viewfinder (I have the electronic viewfinder) - same price as for the tri-elmar "solo"...  The dealer told me that he only gets the package from Leica - they sell out all items.

I'm happy that I got one of the last items :-)). So if you also like the tri-elmar, don't hesitate.... In Germany there are only a few used 16-18-21 and Leica - according to my information - pursue other plans....

I am sorry for that, the tri-elmar is the only lens with 16 mm.... 

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[SiggiGun]

This lens was build when the M8 with the smaller sensor was launched. It is certainly a good lens for landscape, especially in the mountains. However, like the other Tri-Elmar-M, it's big and complex. Maybe you had 1 from the last batch. Now, the focus is on near field focusing. Manual M lenses as universal addition gor M and SL. 

I hope they will bring back a modern Tri or B-XXX 24 - 50. With the modern sensors, Crop becomes standard. And why not an 16 - 35 as landscape lens. This will be a great travel, allround combo : Super-Vario-Elmar 16-35 and a Apo-Elmarit 24-50.

Thanks to the Marketing to image the market, thanks to Design to imagine the lenses, thanks to Production to build it... 

[lct]

Time to update the WATE indeed. A modern UWA lens should cover 15mm IMO and 0.5m is not closer than a mere CV 15/4.5 MFD. The current WATE still makes for a brilliant 24-32/4 zoom on the digital CL though.

 

[Ecar]

9 hours ago, SiggiGun said:

However, like the other Tri-Elmar-M, it's big and complex.

Not that big compared to some of the recent Leica lenses, if you take hoods into account (the WATE only has a tiny hood). Plus, it's also fairly light for what it has to offer (less than 350g IIRC).

And also way less complex - ie, less prone to getting out of adjustment... - than the MATE. The WATE is essentially a continuous zoom construction, while the MATE is a monument to micro-mechanical complexity, with each stepped setting required to trigger a different set of framelines.  

9 hours ago, SiggiGun said:

And why not an 16 - 35 as landscape lens. 

+1

I guess f/2.8 or f/3.4 is realistic if size matters.

[lct]

6 minutes ago, Ecar said:

And also way less complex - ie, less prone to getting out of adjustment... - than the MATE. The WATE is essentially a continuous zoom construction, while the MATE is a monument to micro-mechanical complexity, with each stepped setting required to trigger a different set of framelines.  

+1

[HPFM]

I think next year Leica will focus on the SL (TC, 100-400, 21...and what else is rumored). I'm not sure whether they will offer a successor to the Tri-Elmar 16-18-21. Don't care about that - now as owner of "one of the last" Tri-Elmar and owner of SL.... :-))

[satijntje]

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The Wate is one of my favourite lenses! 

[Jeff S]

I’d be more interested in an updated, less complex, MATE.  Or some variant, compatible with RF/frame line use. The SL lenses focus closer than even the latest M lenses, although that’s not my priority.

Jeff

[HPFM]

Yes.... out of production...😪

Ordered and got my Tri-Elmar 16-18-21 and was happy until I noticed unsharpness at all boundaries of all photographs taken with the new Tri-Elmar. So after some tests I returned it to the dealer including photographs showing the problem.

Today received the answer from Leica Germany: Yes, the Tri-Elmar is decentered (nevertheless passed the LEICA quality control mechanism....) and will be repaired within a few weeks.

Exchange/ Replacement is not possible - LEICA Germany Wetzlar has NO MORE items of this Tri-Elmar 16-18-21 for selling to customers....

So i´ll wait for my Tri-Elmar -  Customer satisfaction: I get a Tri-Elmar  lens from the German Leica Academy until check and repair of  my own  Tri-Elmar   .-))

 

[Luke_Miller]

B&H shows three TrI-Elmar SKUs in stock and three used lenses if anyone is looking for one..

[Ecar]

On 11/15/2022 at 3:14 PM, HPFM said:

Exchange/ Replacement is not possible - LEICA Germany Wetzlar has NO MORE items of this Tri-Elmar 16-18-21 for selling to customers....

It doesn't necessarily mean that the lens is discontinued.

Unless things have changed recently, production at Leica is made in scheduled batches. You'd expect batches for lower-volume items to be less frequent. The consequence is that they may run out of factory stock on occasion.

Also, it's considered good business practice to minimise your working capital and push inventory down to your distributors if you can.😉

[swatch]

Have been looking for super wide angle prime lens ( 14mm or 16mm ) from Leica …. would it be a dream only ?

[01af]

The Leica Tri-Elmar-M 16-18-21 mm Asph is not discontinued.

.

Am 17.11.2022 um 06:03 schrieb Ecar:

... production at Leica is made in scheduled batches. You'd expect batches for lower-volume items to be less frequent. The consequence is that they may run out of factory stock on occasion.

Exactly.

Sooner or later, there will be another batch.

[tsleica]

I like my WATE a lot..

But the Viewfinder crapped out and I probably should get it fixed if it's even possible.

I just got the 67mm filter holder to soften up the image a bit with some SF fliters for different effects esp in video.

The filter doesnt have the cutout anymore which is nice but it is out of stock at most places.

[Gobert]

It is a great lens, somewhat large and heavy although.

[lct]

The WATE has the same size and weight as the MATE more or less. Here on digital CL:

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[budjames]

On 10/14/2022 at 9:32 PM, lct said:

Time to update the WATE indeed. A modern UWA lens should cover 15mm IMO and 0.5m is not closer than a mere CV 15/4.5 MFD. The current WATE still makes for a brilliant 24-32/4 zoom on the digital CL though.

 

I bought the current WATE 16-18-21 think that it would be the great travel lens along with my APO Summicron 35mm for my M11. I gave it a good workout, but sadly, I was very disappointed in the sharpness.

I sent it back to my Leica dealer (Leica Soho, NYC) and purchased the Super Elmar 21mm. It is much smaller, lighter, faster, sharper and better micro-contrast than the WATE. 

For anyone interested in buying the WATE 16-18-21, I know that the Leica Soho NYC store has at least one in stock.

Regards,
Bud James

Please check out my fine art and travel photography at www.budjames.photography.

[budjames]

On 11/15/2022 at 9:42 PM, Luke_Miller said:

B&H shows three TrI-Elmar SKUs in stock and three used lenses if anyone is looking for one..

Based on my experiences with the WATE 16-18-21, B&H Photo has new and used stock because the lens image quality is not that good, IMHO. 

I bought one and returned after a few weeks. I purchased the Super Elmar 21mm which I am very happy with.

Regards,
Bud James

Please check out my fine art and travel photography at www.budjames.photography.

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[lct]

Compared to the WATE, the S-E 21/3.4 asph looks a bit sharper at the corners on my M240. On my Kolari mod A7r2 it shows smeared corners though, contrary to the WATE, and the same was true on the SL last time i discussed the matter with @Tailwagger IIRC. I did not do extensive tests on the M11 but the WATE doesn't show smeared corners on it either. Here WATE at 21mm, f/4 on M11.

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Edited November 20, 2022 by lct

[Tailwagger]

20 minutes ago, lct said:

Compared to the WATE, the S-E 21/3.4 asph looks a bit sharper at the corners on my M240. On my Kolari mod A7r2 it shows smeared corners though, contrary to the WATE, and the same was true on the SL last time i discussed the matter with @Tailwagger IIRC. I did not do extensive tests on the M11 but the WATE doesn't show smeared corners on it either. Here WATE at 21mm, f/4 on M11.

On the M, I'd concur that 21 SEM is indeed noticeably sharper, certainly more contrasty overall than the WATE.  It's been a while since my testing, but the general result was that  I found the 21 SEM unacceptable on the SL2, the WATE was indeed better, at least at 21mm.  IIRC, at 16mm it was much worse and frankly, from an acuity standpoint couldn't hold a candle to the far cheaper Lumix 16-35.  Beyond any corner sharpness issues, I've concluded that M wides on the SL2 are too annoying when trying to focus on a particular point in the scene, at least without taking way too much time. Far easier and more reliable on the M to rely on the RF for focusing accuracy and switch to the EVF for framing.  Here's an example of why that can be important.  For this scene, I wanted max DoF in the relative foreground, but a bit of blur in the distant hills. Shot at F8, the focus point was on the top of the last log in the pile.  To achieve something similar on the SL2 would have been a far more difficult, opening and closing the aperture, zooming in and out etc.  With the M11, focus, frame, click. 

M11 WATE (16mm)

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