Confessions of a defector to Sony

[Erato]

Advertisement (gone after registration)

On 9/23/2022 at 12:44 AM, rob_w said:

Well, I would love to post some examples but I don't think that would be appreciated on a Leica forum since no Leica or L mount lens is involved.  In fact, I would be breaking the rules, I think.  This site has some beautiful Batis photos taken with the Sony/Zeiss combination https://www.batisstory.com/.  I think any photographer would enjoy seeing the pictures.  I suspect any Leica photographer could get similar results with the right Leica equipment.  And, of course, the author has chosen to use Sony and Zeiss with a great result.

PS They are not B&W however.  Do hope you enjoyed some of Sean Reid's photos?  I am sure there are some articles on his site which explain his technique for selecting subjects and framing in black and white.

 

 

I like your journal --'a Batis story...' brilliant and profound.

That's the way it is. Focus on the story not the gears.

[lct]

Sure IBIS is necessary handheld at slow shutter speeds but a 24mb camera is not a 60mb camera so if an oldie like truly yours can do it sans IBIS with an M11 it is even easier with a digital CL. All this to say that i'm used to carry 1 CL and 3 M lenses for travels and the whole package weighs hardly more than 1kg. With an AF lens in lieu of my 3 primes it is even lighter.

[rob_w]

7 hours ago, Erato said:

I like your journal --'a Batis story...' brilliant and profound.

Thank you.  I should clarify however it is not my journal.  It is one I came across and really enjoy.  Glad you enjoy it too!

[rob_w]

Hi again.  I do drop by from time to time to see the photos and hear the news from my erstwhile CL community.  Today I just want to mention Sony has released a camera which might have been the CL2 we always longed for.  Here is a short review: https://fstoppers.com/reviews/review-sony-a7cr-compact-full-featured-639496

I hope no-one is offended by my fifth-column activities.  It is clear the CL is still delivering wonderful photos.  I just remember the conversations back in the day and thought that, for some of you, this new model might be a dream come true!

Keep well and happy shooting!

[Indeepthought]

A nicely written Post, in all honesty, it's what suits you... Are you happy? = Yes..   🍷

[rob_w]

Ha, ha!  It's dinner time here in the UK and your suggestion of raising a drink does sound appealing 😀

Photography is such a great hobby!

Cheers

[AdHox]

Advertisement (gone after registration)

On 9/21/2022 at 6:18 PM, rob_w said:

Just an update to this thread in case anyone else is tempted to move to Sony.  If you do move from Leica to Sony do check out the Zeiss Batis range of lenses in particular.  The Sony will take native E-mount lenses from Zeiss, Voigtlander, Sigma, Samyang, Tamron, Tokina, ... etc. with full EXIF and IBIS interaction for all of them.  But in addition, Zeiss make the Batis range of AF E-mount lenses specifically for Sony mirrorless.   They are rather like miniature SL lenses: sleek, rather chubby weather-sealed bodies with no superfluous switches or controls.  The difference is they are shorter, smaller and lighter than the comparable SL versions.  The Zeiss Batis 85mm f1.8 for example weighs 475gm including OIS (which works with the Sony IBIS), compared to the SL90 at around 750gm.  The optical performances are excellent.  The examples I have used all have that added magic that one sometimes gets from specific lens designs that are just right like, say, the TL35.  Aficionados talk about the Zeiss "pop" in a language Leica enthusiasts will recognise.

I mention it here because the Batis range does not get much coverage on the web and I only came across it by accident, really, and wish I had known sooner.  I suspect this is because (a) they have been released for 3-5 years so don't rise to the top for review like new lenses do and (b) they are considered very expensive versus the competition, which is often thought to be even "sharper" or wider aperture or to have some absolutely essential button the reviewer wants.  In case anyone reading this thread would like to make the same journey into exploring Sony, I do recommend you check out the Batis range.  No disrespect to anyone not interested in making that journey!

Cheers, Robert

The Batis 2/40 CF is the lens most commonly attached to my Sony bodies, and I also enjoy using my 2/25, 1.8/85, and 2.8/135 - they all give a look that I like.

So +1 to consider the Batis range if you're considering Sony and like primes.

A year ago, when I last commented in this thread, I said that I still reached for my CL ahead of my Sonys unless I needed something that I couldn't do with the CL That has changed a bit since then as I have collected my set of Batises (Bates?), but more so since I bought the Q3 in June. For my trip to France & Italy this year I considered taking a CL-based kit. Then I considered a Sony/Batis kit. Then a Sony kit with smaller primes. But my Q3 is what I took. So I think that the Q3 has now become the camera I grab unless I need something that I can't do with the Q3.

[AdHox]

On 9/23/2022 at 2:44 AM, rob_w said:

Well, I would love to post some examples but I don't think that would be appreciated on a Leica forum since no Leica or L mount lens is involved.  In fact, I would be breaking the rules, I think.  This site has some beautiful Batis photos taken with the Sony/Zeiss combination https://www.batisstory.com/.  I think any photographer would enjoy seeing the pictures.  I suspect any Leica photographer could get similar results with the right Leica equipment.  And, of course, the author has chosen to use Sony and Zeiss with a great result.

It looks like Kalainen has unpublished his Batis Story.

On DPReview, he states that the main purpose of the blog was "to keep me active in my photography, inhale some inspiration and share it with others" and "trying to create some space for photography in my summer and steer away from ‘auto-pilot mode’. " Having completed his extended summer project, he has moved on ...

[rob_w]

It is a shame that Kalainen has taken down his series of articles and many will not be able to see it who might have benefited from it.  But it is also understandable as many of the pictures were intimate moments with his own beloved family.  Let's hope he follows up with a new series.  His reflections on the nature and motivation for making photographs were truly inspirational. 

This example from his response in a discussion at DPReview gives a flavour https://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/66520252

But of course the actual pictures are much more persuasive.

 

[Boojay]

On 10/25/2023 at 3:30 PM, rob_w said:

It is a shame that Kalainen has taken down his series of articles and many will not be able to see it who might have benefited from it.  But it is also understandable as many of the pictures were intimate moments with his own beloved family.  Let's hope he follows up with a new series.  His reflections on the nature and motivation for making photographs were truly inspirational. 

This example from his response in a discussion at DPReview gives a flavour https://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/66520252

But of course the actual pictures are much more persuasive.

 

Some wonderful storytelling in there Rob, thanks for that link.. 👌

[thatkatmat]

Hi, Funny you mentioned the Batis lenses. They and the Loxia's are what I use on my a7rIII. I own both sets. In fact, I don't own 1 Sony lens...lol,  (Not that I haven't tried most and Sony does put out some AMAZING glass) I just enjoy the whole Zeiss experience, light, no buttons to fiddle with, draw is really cool sometimes and they look cool too

I think if you love the Batis line, and you come from Leica, you might enjoy the Loxia's even more. I love the way they draw too but since I'm lucky enough to own an M an SL2 and a CL system, unfortunately the Sony gear doesn't see much light. But those lenses are punchy and wonderful, wish I could adapt them to my SL. 

I wouldn't want to go back to just a Sony body i don't think...But if I did, the Batis and Loxia line might keep me pretty happy.

Edited November 1, 2023 by thatkatmat

[Rick in CO]

Wouldn't it be great if Zeiss offered those lenses in L-mount?  Especially the APS-C range!

[rob_w]

On 11/1/2023 at 4:15 PM, thatkatmat said:

Hi, Funny you mentioned the Batis lenses. They and the Loxia's are what I use on my a7rIII. I own both sets. In fact, I don't own 1 Sony lens...lol,  (Not that I haven't tried most and Sony does put out some AMAZING glass) I just enjoy the whole Zeiss experience, light, no buttons to fiddle with, draw is really cool sometimes and they look cool too

I think if you love the Batis line, and you come from Leica, you might enjoy the Loxia's even more. I love the way they draw too but since I'm lucky enough to own an M an SL2 and a CL system, unfortunately the Sony gear doesn't see much light. But those lenses are punchy and wonderful, wish I could adapt them to my SL. 

I wouldn't want to go back to just a Sony body i don't think...But if I did, the Batis and Loxia line might keep me pretty happy.

Thanks for the tip.  I have looked at the Loxia images on the Sony forum (most often on Fred Miranda) and they are every bit as impressive as you say!  In my case I had to switch from a lifetime of manual focus to autofocus, so unlikely I could get the results I want using MF again.  If it were still subjects like landscapes, maybe, but for candid shots of family members having fun, for example, AF is now essential for me.  That's why I switched to the CL from the M.  On the Sony, the AF is now astonishingly good.

Edited November 30, 2023 by rob_w

[rob_w]

On 11/1/2023 at 5:58 PM, Rick in CO said:

Wouldn't it be great if Zeiss offered those lenses in L-mount?  Especially the APS-C range!

Hi Rick.  I suspect Zeiss lenses would be loved by Leica shooters -- esp. on the SL where they would be smaller and lighter and still very competitive performers.  It does seem that Zeiss has withdrawn from the stills photography market as they have not released anything new in three years.  They say they haven't, but de facto it looks like they have.  They are massive providers of optics for commercial and engineering purposes, and for film lenses.  The numbers dwarf what they used to earn from retail customers for still photography.

[lct]

Zeiss M-mount lenses work fine on the digital CL with Leica M to L adapter. Especially compact lenses like ZM Biogon 21/4.5 or ZM Biogon 35/2.8. The Planar 50/2 is taller but makes for a superb equiv. 75/2. If they are not too old, ZM lenses have a recessed part in the flange allowing to hand code them, if needed, and they are treated as Leica M lenses by the camera. Snap at 3200 iso with ZM 35/2.8 below.

Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here…

Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!

[rob_w]

Yes -- totally forgot about the ZM range!  Doh!

[lct]

Zeiss ZM lenses work fine on Sony cameras too but better have their sensor modded when using WA or UWA lenses. Here same ZM Biogon 35/2.8 on Kolari mod A7s.

https://photos.smugmug.com/photos/i-4rNxZHs/0/dcad73e1/X4/i-4rNxZHs-X4.jpg

Edited November 30, 2023 by lct

[sere]

Hello, 

landed on this topic today and I must say that it just cheered me up: I have an experience with some points in common with Rob's, so I am selling my Leica CL + lenses for a Sony A7CII. 

I start with the assumption that the CL is my only body (I am not a pro and I can't afford a second one), which I use for everything, however mainly for street and travel, even in climatically unfriendly destinations: while I love CL so much, I have noticed over the years that my photography has changed, it is no longer just relaxed and reasoned photography, but has become more dynamic and challenging. And so, unfortunately, with the CL I found myself missing some shots in more than one situation. 

I no longer find it THE camera that I can use for everything I want: not because it is no longer a wonderful camera, but because my way of taking pictures has changed, and so have my needs. I need a more reliable and faster AF, a tilting screen, and a weather sealed compact body that I can take with me all around the world in (almost) all conditions. 

Nevertheless, I admit that I am very sad to part with my CL, I really love its rendering and colors and its beautiful compact body. I will also miss my tiny 23mm f2. Maybe, if Leica made a CL2 with better AF, tilting screen, weather sealed body and some new lenses... I would think about it.

Edited April 15 by sere

[m.obi255]

Flash back to 2022! Interesting topic.

Back then, I was using the Leica TL2 with the 23mm and 35mm and the Leica Q. Due to circumstances and a bit of boredom (of course!), I moved on from those to the Sony A7C then the Z-EV1, using a combination of lenses. I loved the Sony autofocus and the image quality was there as well as amazing modern conveniences like a tilt screen, but they just didn't fit my workflow (I don't edit in adobe and waiting for Apple to support the latest raw files is an exercise in futility), plus the handling and user experience was a bit frustrating. Last year I switched back to the Leica CL plus the same lens pairing (plus the zooms 18-56mm and 11-23mm) and they're working well. Even compared to Sony Full Frames, I much prefer the rendering, colours and feel of this Leica. Lately, I've been considering purchasing the Q2 to come back full circle to 2022, but plenty happy with the CL in all honesty, just thinking about the shiny new thing.

[Advertisement]

Hallo,

Look here: Leica L-Mount

[elambo]

7 hours ago, m.obi255 said:

Flash back to 2022! Interesting topic.

Back then, I was using the Leica TL2 with the 23mm and 35mm and the Leica Q. Due to circumstances and a bit of boredom (of course!), I moved on from those to the Sony A7C then the Z-EV1, using a combination of lenses. I loved the Sony autofocus and the image quality was there as well as amazing modern conveniences like a tilt screen, but they just didn't fit my workflow (I don't edit in adobe and waiting for Apple to support the latest raw files is an exercise in futility), plus the handling and user experience was a bit frustrating. Last year I switched back to the Leica CL plus the same lens pairing (plus the zooms 18-56mm and 11-23mm) and they're working well. Even compared to Sony Full Frames, I much prefer the rendering, colours and feel of this Leica. Lately, I've been considering purchasing the Q2 to come back full circle to 2022, but plenty happy with the CL in all honesty, just thinking about the shiny new thing.

I've tried VERY hard to move onto a different camera but in each case ended up comfortably back with the CL.