50mm Summicron v.5 vs. 50mm Summilux pre-ASPH v.3

[evikne]

Advertisement (gone after registration)

I love my 50mm Summilux pre-ASPH (v.3), and it nicely complements my 35mm Summilux pre-ASPH (v.2). When everything goes well, I can't wish for anything more. However, sometimes it disappoints me with strong, unwanted veiling flare and slightly out of focus images.

Because of that, I am looking for a complementary lens that can give me a little more predictable results. The 50mm Summilux ASPH is the most obvious choice. I have owned it (many times) before, so I know what I get. A disadvantage is that it renders very differently from my older lenses, and of course its high price.

So it is a little tempting that I can buy a brand new 50mm Summicron v.5 from the store for less than the price of a (carefully) used 50mm Summilux ASPH.

But I have never tried it before, so I am unsure if it will provide any noticeable improvement to the 50mm Summilux v.3 in terms of:

• Focus shift?
• Veiling flare?
• Sharpness at f/2?

[wda]

The best solution is to rent one and trust that it matches the performance of  a new one. Then you can see if it meets your requirement. 

[wizard]

vor 48 Minuten schrieb evikne:

... so I am unsure if it will provide any noticeable improvement to the 50mm Summilux v.3 in terms of:

• Focus shift?
• Veiling flare?
• Sharpness at f/2?

Focus shift according to my experience will be less.

Sharpness at f2 will be the same or better in the center, and will be noticeably better in the outer zones (whereas Summilux v3 needs f5.6 or even f8 to be truly sharp to the edges).

Summicron 50 v5 will also show veiling glare on occasion. In that respect, I don't think that it is much better than the Summilux 50 v3.

BTW, I own both lenses.

[wda]

Shooting into a bright sky, or direct sun-source, will give some flare with many lenses. I find it more irksome with bright skies. In those cases, I adjust viewpoint and use my left hand, cupped, as an extended lens hood, usually with pleasing results. If that fails, in my own garden, I position myself under the lower branches of a non-featuring tree for specific garden landscape scenes. That solution is often possible in woodland landscapes. Don't eliminate an otherwise excellent lens just because of that tendency.

[a.noctilux]

@evikne

I'd say same thing as @wizard having and tried out many units of each type.

I can add that in some high light spots, the 8 blades of the Summicron IV/V would be more 'noticeable' than twelve of Summilux II/III , I'm very picky for that.

In most case flare or glare is the same in contre-jour but as those take also aperture form would be nicer with Summilux.

 

As always, each type has advantages/inconvenients to learn to use at best.

In my view each one is to own/use for a while to judge.

[Capuccino-Muffin]

I will be blunt. Savage. I will shatter your falsely preconceived beliefs about how-what-lens-looks-like-under-whatnotlighing.

I am a huge fan of old glass. The Summilux pre-asph (35 and 50) are where it’s at. The summilux 50mm V1 (with exactly the same optical construction as the summarit f1.5) is super Sweet. And I absolutely dislike the summilux 50mm asph: ugly boké shape, no meat around the bone as with older lenses. No meaty images. No MEATY. Very DRY-BONEY. Looks like a cost-cutting lens to me. 

But where I was totally surprised by the Meatiness of the images, combined with sparkle, was from the 50 summicron APO.

You have been searching for the magic bullet far too long, and far too-wide-open-shooting for you to be able to take a step back and actually see. You are too burried deep into a search for a magic bullet.

I suspect your magic bullet is the 50 cron apo. It certainly has been a revelation to me... and I dislike the 50 lux asph.

[evikne]

Advertisement (gone after registration)

Here is a typical example of the veiling flare from my 50mm Summilux pre-ASPH. Very often it just appears without any obvious reason (cloudy day, no filter, stopping down doesn't help), and the pictures can only be rescued by heavy editing. Is this normal behavior of this lens? I can't see anything wrong with it, but do you think a CLA could make any difference?

Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here…

Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!

[lct]

How far was the sun from the frame, do you remember? 

[evikne]

4 minutes ago, lct said:

How far was the sun from the frame, do you remember? 

I can't remember exactly, but the photo was taken in the middle of the day, and I think the sun may have been just to the right of the frame.

[lct]

Just now, evikne said:

I can't remember exactly, but the photo was taken in the middle of the day, and I think the sun may have been just to the right of the frame.

Like many Leica lenses the 50/1.4 v3 doesn't like much strong light sources when they are just outside the frame. 3 ways to avoid this AFAIK: put the sun farther from the frame, make some shade with your hand, a hat, etc. or use an EVF or Visoflex. FWIW.

[a.noctilux]

2 hours ago, evikne said:

Here is a typical example of the veiling flare from my 50mm Summilux pre-ASPH. Very often it just appears without any obvious reason (cloudy day, no filter, stopping down doesn't help), and the pictures can only be rescued by heavy editing. Is this normal behavior of this lens? I can't see anything wrong with it, but do you think a CLA could make any difference?

Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here…

Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!

 

Some times, with the lens plus filter (colored for b&w for example), the Lux is flarey with white sky.

Even when the front lens is 'a bit' dirty, lost of contrast can occure.

In these situations, closing the aperture did not help : so I use without filter and/or clean the front lens.

 

If this is full time 'flarey', maybe inside glasses of the lens need some care ?

Shine a light inside the lens to have an idea.

Edited August 18, 2021 by a.noctilux

[me111]

Same mysterious behavior happens with my 50mm Summilux v3,. In the image, the sky was overcast, so no direct sunlight source was to be avoided.

I used to own both lenses. They flare differently. This image and the image provided by evikne, to me, exemplify the flare created by the Summilux. As for my Summicron, I think it hates the situation in which a light source is near the frame. It flares so easily and badly so that I sold it and never regret.

Apart from its lovely rendering when it behaves, maybe I keep the Summilux because I also own 50mm Summilux ASPH (my copy is extremely good at flare control) so if I want a reliable 50mm, I can go with the ASPH.

 

Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here…

Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!

[wizard]

Well, I must say that this is not the type of flare I have encountered with my Summilux 50 v3. Instead, when my copy flares, it produces clearly visible purple ghost images with well defined edges (with the edge showing the shape of the diaphragm). No such diffuse flare as shown above though. Could it be that your lens has some fog on the lens elements?

Andy

[evikne]

1 hour ago, wizard said:

Well, I must say that this is not the type of flare I have encountered with my Summilux 50 v3. Instead, when my copy flares, it produces clearly visible purple ghost images with well defined edges (with the edge showing the shape of the diaphragm). No such diffuse flare as shown above though. Could it be that your lens has some fog on the lens elements?

Andy

The lens looks perfectly clean to me, but I'm no expert. I am considering submitting it to Wetzlar for 6-bit coding, and at the same time they can give it a CLA. It will certainly not hurt.

[UliWer]

It may be worthwile not to look only at the lens when you search for the reasons of veiling flare:

I think there are more reports about the 50mm Summicron which complain about the issue than about the Summilux. 

 

[wizard]

vor 7 Minuten schrieb UliWer:

It may be worthwile not to look only at the lens when you search for the reasons of veiling flare:

Quite correct. I suspect this diffuse kind of flare could result from light reflection off the sensor surface. 

[lct]

Suffice it to make some shade with a hand sometimes. Here on Elmarit 90/2.8 v2. Typical behavior when a strong light source is just outside the frame.

Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here…

Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!

 

 

 

[grahamc]

I've been having a ball with my 50mm Summicron v3 and think it compliments the 35mm pre-asph v2 really well . 

I seem to get really nice results out of it - I had originally planned to also buy the E46 Summilux (pre-asph) but I was just thinking yesterday that I won't bother as I'm really happy with this pair - I seem to get a very similar look from these lenses. 

So whilst it may not be everyone's obvious choice, I think it may be a better match than the more recent 50 crons.  I love mine 

Edited August 18, 2021 by grahamc

[wda]

15 hours ago, evikne said:

Here is a typical example of the veiling flare from my 50mm Summilux pre-ASPH. Very often it just appears without any obvious reason (cloudy day, no filter, stopping down doesn't help), and the pictures can only be rescued by heavy editing. Is this normal behavior of this lens? I can't see anything wrong with it, but do you think a CLA could make any difference?

Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here…

Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!

That is typical of the situation I described. Try my solution. It may not eliminate the effect, but it should help.

[Advertisement]

Hallo,

Look here: Leica M

[Stephen.s1]

It won't fix the problem, but I wonder how LR Dehaze helps it.