Leica SL2-S Survey

[LocalHero1953]

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30 minutes ago, Slender said:

How did it go if I may ask? did you get any trade-up/down value back at all?

I'm not going to say, if you don't mind. I understand and respect how retailers (including Leica) offer incentives and deals to customers, depending on a lot of circumstances, including need to shift stock, throughput and margins on trade-in stock, whether the customer is a regular, or likely to spend more in future. So what I was offered may not be offered to everyone - and some might get a better offer. Having worked in private business myself, I know it is irritating when a client tries to use other cases they have heard of (or invented) to leverage the same deal from you; giving in is the fastest way to eliminate your profits. And in covid times with London going into Tier 3, retailers need all the help they can get.

In this case I was told I had a special deal because I was a past customer (as a buyer of kit, and as a user of Leica Akadamie training). They haven't been the only one getting my trade - I prefer to encourage the independent dealer, but my preferred independent dealer doesn't always have the stock when Leica does (and vice versa). On this occasion my preferred independent dealer was not willing to make a good enough offer, so I backed out. Leica UK doesn't usually undercut the independents in my experience, so it was only a casual phone call to the Mayfair shop today that got this response. 

So I suggest it is always worth asking around, and certainly worth asking Leica.

Edited December 15, 2020 by LocalHero1953

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[Kit B]

Really interesting Leica.  I have to agree that the bulk rather puts me off, although obviously a superb camera.  I have recently acquired a Leica Q2 which suits my photography perfectly.  I have used Leicas exclusively for some 50 years, this is the first one without interchangeable lenses!   Delighted with it and even with the 75mm crop, still produces wonderful images.   Most of the time I use it on 35mm.  Enough said!   

[Mick H]

I have the SL and picked up an S1H, about a year ago, as a needed an L-mount backup and a hybrid photo/video camera (my clients want video these days).  The SL2-S looks like an S1H replacement sans the fully articulated screen (which I use for both photo video).  I prefer the Leica color in video and stills.  The uncluttered Industrial Design and UI of Leica is best.  Let's see - maybe I will trade for the SL2-S.  

[jdfloresjr]

6 hours ago, KenTanaka said:

I responded “no” but only because I’ve only recently gotten the SL2 (my kidney excision wound is still healing).  

You'll run out of organs at the rate Leica keeps coming up with planned obsolescence!🤣

[Batman57]

I have a Q2 and a Lumix S1R with 3 Lumix lenses. But I cannot use this camera for indoor sport: AF-C is not performing as some competitors and the fps limited to 6-7 with continuous AF is a great limit. I do need a FF camera with at least 10 fps in jpg with AF on every single frame, not only on the firts one. I hope this can/will be improved in the future on SL2, so I'll buy it!

In the meantime I am using Olympus OM E M1 III... tremendously fast. 

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Edited December 15, 2020 by Batman57

[Tom1234]

The build seems heavy duty enough for professional use since the video guys are reviewing it: https://www.fdtimes.com/2020/12/10/leica-sl2-s/

Full size HDMI port reported:  https://www.dpreview.com/products/leica/compacts/leica_sl2-s

PRICE:  The SL2-S selling at a price of $4,900 out of New York from one online retailer, makes it a more reasonable choice than in the past, since it can be seen as only about twice as expensive as a Nikon.  Previously it was maybe four times the price of cameras with similar features and quality.   I realize the SL was apparently priced off the top camera's from like Nikon, around $7,000 full retail, but they are better compared to the middle of the Nikon, Sony, and Canon lines, and should be priced accordingly.

In the old days of mechanical cameras, Leica's well built cameras could justify their cost, but now that electronics dominate camera design these circuits are all of similar quality level so it is hard to justify higher prices since the technology and build quality are so similar.  Plus like Nikon has a better repair department. So maybe this 2.5 price multiplier, $2,000 (Nikon or Panasonic price) * 2.5 = $5,000 (Leica price) could be good positioning for a camera that has received a second line of engineering improvement over the base camera from Panasonic.

I hope that a Leica camera based on the smaller Panasonic S5 platform might sell at $3,800 and have a fully articulating screen, dual sd-cards, and something special in simple menus and custom menus and user assignable activation buttons  Time will tell.

[thehopleaves]

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Ordered! This is the SL I’ve been waiting for, as I’m not into the megapixel race and prefer low light performance. I also have an M10 and I’m quite hopeful that my M lenses will perform well on the SL2-s. The only issue is the ongoing delay of the 28/24 SL lenses, I will need to be patient. 😱

Edited December 15, 2020 by thehopleaves

[Tom1234]

5 hours ago, jcatral14 said:

I have an SL and will probably get the SL2-S next year sometime. I want it mainly for the IBIS and higher sensitivity.

I agree... stabilization is a MAJOR step forward for still photography especially for long lenses since it opens up a whole new world of picture taking possibilities. 

[thehopleaves]

2 minutes ago, Steven said:

I've heard there's a new SL lens coming out sooner than these two. And its not the 21. 

Interesting! I’m curious to see what happens in Q1. I would think (read: hope), that we are getting close to some announcements. 

[Tom1234]

19 minutes ago, Batman57 said:

I have a Q2 and a Lumix S1R with 3 Lumix lenses. But I cannot use this camera for indoor sport: AF-C is not performing as some competitors and the fps limited to 6-7 with continuous AF is a great limit. I do need a FF camera with at least 10 fps in jpg with AF on every single frame, not only on the firts one. I hope this can/will be improved in the future on SL2, so I'll buy it!

In the meantime I am using Olympus OM E M1 III... tremendously fast. 

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Impressive color and professional looking IQ.

[Tom1234]

9 minutes ago, Steven said:

I've heard there's a new SL lens coming out sooner than these two. And its not the 21. 

Hey Steve I am back online - I started the 24 vs 40 meg thread a month or so ago .  Hope Cannes went well for you. 

I remember you were going for the M10-r 40meg experience.  So are you thinking the SL2-S 24 meg is still viable?  Or would you wait for higher meg sensor?

I know some will like the 24meg for the low light ability.

[Tom1234]

2 minutes ago, Steven said:

I never ended up liking my M10R, I barely use it. 

I am mad in love with my new SL2-S. Best Leica Camera ive ever owned, and maybe best camera of all time minus a few caveats. But I'll let you know how I feel after honeymoon... 

Yes do report... I value your opinion.  And please also comment more on 4k vs 8k video frames when you decide on that. 

[Shootist]

As usual the choices in the survey aren't Wide enough.

I presently own Fuji gear. Switch to that from Leica M8's. So presently I don't own Leica but have owned leica gear since 1972. M3 through M7 film cameras and then a pair of M8's. Even owned one of the Leica film SLR's.

I am looking at going back to Leica and the SL2-S looks good but in the end I will probably go back to the M style with a M10. I still have 4 M lenses.

Edited December 15, 2020 by Shootist

[wbabbott3]

I have a perfectly good, new, useful CL and some TL lenses, all on L mounts that fit my SL2 too.

I don't need the SL2-S at all.

Bill

[Jeff S]

9 hours ago, Ipanemaguy said:

The format and adaptability of legacy lenses got me to buy the sl601. The additional resolution is unneeded  and price is to high.

 

? ? This thread is for the SL-2-S, which has the same resolution as your SL, and retails at $1100 less than the initial price of both the SL and SL2. And it includes IBIS and many other features not available in the SL.

Jeff

Edited December 15, 2020 by Jeff S

[farnz]

1 hour ago, Shootist said:

So presently I don't own Leica but have owned leica gear since 1972. M3 through M7 film cameras and then a pair of M8's. Even owned one of the Leica film SLR's.

Welcome back, Shootist!  It seems such a long time since you were here.

Pete.

[CaymanS]

Interesting combination of higher ISO/noise capability, IBIS, improved battery power consumption and useful video features over the SL (601) and SL2.

I traded my SL for the SL2 in search of some of the above features. If the "S" model had come out first, I would likely have bought that instead of an SL2. Despite great dynamic range and wonderful 47MP from the SL2 these features actually prove really useful only 20% of the time. Higher ISO work with it could be much better as well. The rest of the time the 24MP of the SL2-S is actually more than enough for very wide ranging subjects and allied to better higher-end ISO, faster shot capability, more compact files with less payload in post and IBIS, it is a much better and more useable combination/package all told. Weight is not an issue. You get used to the mass and balance and not much different from other pro oriented devices.

The SL-2 though suffers heavily on the battery usage front, no doubt a higher processor payload in moving more data around from its sensor. In video use this feels even worse and Leica do not appear to be able to improve the situation with firmware. The SL2 battery design, limited by the battery compartment size (albeit allowing Leica's wonderfully smooth sliding/locking mechanism) may not be able to contain larger more powerful cells. This appears less of an issue on its sister Panasonic S series as these appear to have a slightly bigger and more powerful battery. A solution to the power drain of the SL2 by attaching a V-Lock battery via USB-C would be an inelegant ergonomic nightmare. Perhaps a variation of the HG-SCL6 grip holding a larger cell capacity battery should be considered by Leica for its SL2.

Part exchange value deterioration, aggressively driven at dealer level despite the supposed rarity of these cameras, means the financial loss as a customer in trading to the SL2-S is not inconsiderable. So abandoning the SL2 and moving to the SL2-S is accordingly problematic right now. There is of course the hope that firmware updates from Leica can improve the niggles in SL2 performance giving it a capability to match nearer that of the SL2-S combination of features, but for now that doesn't seem to be high up the Leica management agenda. A pity.

For the avoidance of doubt I also use an M10 and a CL and both have, although bearable, similarly annoying characteristics in use... however the lenses make up for these.

( ...I also have an M6 which stands alone from the above in remaining an unqualified delight! So there is hope if Leica remembers a little more of its roots rather than the impression that its business strategy is increasingly leaning on the need to become an overtly pricey fashion statement. Sad if the latter is true as conventional photography is already being wiped out by alternative image capture devices and software and well thought out seamless in use hardware, that enables decent differentiation in quality from the mass image generation of today, is all most of us really want. )

 

[Tom1234]

From reading early reports on this camera SL2-s, it looks like in the "who has stepped ahead technically" race, Leica has finally edged ahead in some ways by releasing a new camera faster than other manufacturers.   See: 

While it is irritating if you just bought the previous camera, if they offer trade-in then it is not a bad a deal... they are keeping you in new equipment by taking your trade-in and they inch you ahead of other brands.  

And I haven't even mentioned that the Leica color science and 3-d look mentioned by Steve are such a place of excellence for those of as much into art as much as into equipment. 

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[Virob]

I’m a long time Olympus user. Purchased a Q2 not long ago and am totally enthralled with it. Wonderfully camera, that produces outstanding images. So much so, that I’ve actually started looking at the SL2/SL2s. This is partly  because of the uncertainty around Olympus u4/3rds, but there are a number of other issues holding me back. The weight of the camera and lack of wide angle lenses. 21mm is one of my favourite focal lengths. I think a  Q2 with a SL2/s + 21+75, would be an killer combo. I’m still in the honeymoon stage with the Q2 and will not make any changes soon. At a minimum, there needs to be a good 21mm option.

[robadibob]

15 hours ago, LUF Admin said:

Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here…

Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!

Last week Leica Camera introduced the new Leica SL2-S:

• Leica SL2-S: Versatile Alternative with 24MP Sensor
• Jono Slack Review: Leica SL2-S

Our question to you:

Are you interested in buying the Leica SL2-S?

Please vote above und discuss below.

Looking forward to your opinion!

Absolutely not. Still mightily disgruntled with Leica for abandoning the R.