setuporg Posted January 3, 2020 Share #221 Posted January 3, 2020 (edited) Advertisement (gone after registration) @Chaemono, you are funny! Folks have different hands, and many reported that X1D fits theirs all day long. The S forum had a thorough discussion about it as the S vs X1D was a more direct choice since 2016, and with the X1D II it became even more so recently. It is not the thumb that fits its grip, but the ball of the hand. In my hand it fits so snugly I don't want to let go. Nothing like that with the SL2. The indent is cute but shallow. It's nice to handle but not all day. Certainly not holding it in my hand all day, and I want to do it with the Hassy. Well at least we got you to handle and use one, hope you'll love both more evenly soon.:) Edited January 3, 2020 by setuporg Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted January 3, 2020 Posted January 3, 2020 Hi setuporg, Take a look here Image quality comparison between Hasselblad X1D II and Leica SL2. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
Chaemono Posted January 3, 2020 Share #222 Posted January 3, 2020 vor 3 Minuten schrieb setuporg: @ChaemonoIt is not the thumb that fits its grip, but the ball of the hand. If one presses the ball of the hand against the grip the palm moves away from it. With the XCD 80/1.9 the combo tilts to the left. vor 5 Minuten schrieb setuporg: @ChaemonoWell at least we got you to handle and use one, hope you'll love both more evenly soon.:) Well, at least we’ll get tons of RAW files to look at over the next couple of months in this thread. 😁 I may spare you the XCD 45 vs. the 35 Sunmicron-SL, though. That lens is simply too soft wide open. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
tom0511 Posted January 3, 2020 Share #223 Posted January 3, 2020 I could not detect that softness in the 45mm so far. Or did you mean the 35mm? 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
IkarusJohn Posted January 3, 2020 Share #224 Posted January 3, 2020 All looks like conclusions looking for justification ... Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tailwagger Posted January 4, 2020 Share #225 Posted January 4, 2020 My biggest criticism of the 45mm is that it exhibits quite a bit of fringing. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlashGordonPhotography Posted January 4, 2020 Share #226 Posted January 4, 2020 IMHO the old X1D handles a bit better than the new one and the new SL2 handles a bit better than the old one. The X1D2 is still miles ahead of the SL2 though and probably every other camera on the market as well. The X1D is the benchmark for ergonomics in a camera body.. The material on the X1DII is a bit less grippy after criticism. Personally I much preferred the old grippy rubber. Combined with the grip shape it is spectacular. The SL2 has added rubber and the finger indent. The X1DII/80mm combo is a bit front heavy. The SL2/50mm Summilx is very front heavy. But I hold my cameras properly so it's not an issue. I would rather carry the X1DII/80 for a day over even the Summicron on the SL2. Gordon 5 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff S Posted January 4, 2020 Share #227 Posted January 4, 2020 Advertisement (gone after registration) 7 minutes ago, FlashGordonPhotography said: I would rather carry the X1DII/80 for a day over even the Summicron on the SL2. No you wouldn't....Chaemono explains why. 😂 Jeff 4 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chaemono Posted January 4, 2020 Share #228 Posted January 4, 2020 vor 5 Stunden schrieb tom0511: I could not detect that softness in the 45mm so far. Or did you mean the 35mm? No, I meant the XCD 45/3.5. I compared it to the 35 Summicron-M a while ago here: https://www.smugmug.com/gallery/n-9FSKSS/i-Qxw7zjd Of course, the M lens was on the 24 MPx M10 but still did better...because I shot it at f/2.8 in order to match the XCD lens wide open. Just imagine the 35 Summicron-SL at f/2.8 vs. XCD 45/3.5 wide open. 😁 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chaemono Posted January 4, 2020 Share #229 Posted January 4, 2020 vor 2 Stunden schrieb Tailwagger: My biggest criticism of the 45mm is that it exhibits quite a bit of fringing. I bet all of the XCD lenses show quite a bit of fringing in situations where the ‘equivalent’ SL lenses don’t. I know Vieri has stated that the XCD 90/3.2 shows none and I’ll try to find it. 😁 This is really the result of wanting to make compact and sharp MF lenses at the same time to match the form factor of the X1D, IMO. This is the trade-off...either that or Nittoh simply doesn’t know how to design lenses without apochromatic aberrations. 😁 By outsourcing lens design and production, Hasselblad loses control over their quality, IMO. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SrMi Posted January 4, 2020 Share #230 Posted January 4, 2020 (edited) 18 minutes ago, Chaemono said: I bet all of the XCD lenses show quite a bit of fringing in situations where the ‘equivalent’ SL lenses don’t. I know Vieri has stated that the XCD 90/3.2 shows none and I’ll try to find it. 😁 This is really the result of wanting to make compact and sharp MF lenses at the same time to match the form factor of the X1D, IMO. This is the trade-off...either that or Nittoh simply doesn’t know how to design lenses without apochromatic aberrations. 😁 By outsourcing lens design and production, Hasselblad loses control over their quality, IMO. I do not think that Hasselblad outsources lens design. Hasselblad writes that all XCD lenses lenses are designed in Sweden. Nittoh is not a Swedish company ;-). Edited January 4, 2020 by SrMi Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff S Posted January 4, 2020 Share #231 Posted January 4, 2020 15 minutes ago, SrMi said: I do not think that Hasselblad outsources lens design. Hasselblad writes that all XCD lenses lenses are designed in Sweden. Nittoh is not a Swedish company ;-). Exactly... https://www.hasselblad.com/x-system-lenses/ By Chaemono’s criteria, Leica sensors (and other outsourced/partnered components) must be inferior. Gotta love forums. Jeff 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chaemono Posted January 4, 2020 Share #232 Posted January 4, 2020 vor einer Stunde schrieb SrMi: I do not think that Hasselblad outsources lens design. Hasselblad writes that all XCD lenses lenses are designed in Sweden. Nittoh is not a Swedish company ;-). If Nittoh takes out the patents on Hasselblad XCD lenses than it’s Nittoh’s design. https://www.mirrorlessrumors.com/the-hasselblad-xcd-30mm-lens-has-been-actually-designed-by-nittoh/ Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sillbeers15 Posted January 4, 2020 Share #233 Posted January 4, 2020 6 minutes ago, Chaemono said: If Nittoh takes out the patents on Hasselblad XCD lenses than it’s Nittoh’s design. https://www.mirrorlessrumors.com/the-hasselblad-xcd-30mm-lens-has-been-actually-designed-by-nittoh/ In business / manufacturing Nittoh is called ODM (original design manufacturer), while Hasselblad's XCD lenses are called 'private labelling'. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SrMi Posted January 4, 2020 Share #234 Posted January 4, 2020 (edited) 1 hour ago, Chaemono said: If Nittoh takes out the patents on Hasselblad XCD lenses than it’s Nittoh’s design. https://www.mirrorlessrumors.com/the-hasselblad-xcd-30mm-lens-has-been-actually-designed-by-nittoh/ If you look at the Hasselblad XCD 30mm manual and drawings from the patent, you see that they look similar, but are still different. Maybe Hasselblad took a design from Nittoh and adapted it for XCD 30mm? Is Hasselblad licensing parts of lens design? I don't know and do not know enough about lens design to qualify the difference between the two drawings. It is still a stretch to claim that Nittoh designs all XCD lenses. Hasselblad has repeatedly stated that the XCD lenses are designed in Sweden and manufactured by Nittoh. That is all the facts that I know. Edited January 4, 2020 by SrMi Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
setuporg Posted January 4, 2020 Share #235 Posted January 4, 2020 @Chaemono, can you please do the comparison with the Leica S Typ 007?:) Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chaemono Posted January 4, 2020 Share #236 Posted January 4, 2020 vor 28 Minuten schrieb setuporg: @Chaemono, can you please do the comparison with the Leica S Typ 007?:) Why don’t you start a thread on it? This one is called “Image quality comparison between Hasselblad X1D II and Leica SL2,” in case you forgot. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
setuporg Posted January 4, 2020 Share #237 Posted January 4, 2020 Yes but I'd never be as thorough... Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
IkarusJohn Posted January 4, 2020 Share #238 Posted January 4, 2020 57 minutes ago, setuporg said: Yes but I'd never be as thorough... Hmm, let’s not dive down that rabbit hole. One thing you can be sure of is that if you “test” them, you will get the answers you need. Or, if you just use them, and work out when and why you prefer one over the other. Then again, there might not actually be a difference in the images ... 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chaemono Posted January 4, 2020 Share #239 Posted January 4, 2020 vor 2 Stunden schrieb SrMi: If you look at the Hasselblad XCD 30mm manual and drawings from the patent, you see that they look similar, but are still different. Maybe Hasselblad took a design from Nittoh and adapted it for XCD 30mm? Is Hasselblad licensing parts of lens design? I don't know and do not know enough about lens design to qualify the difference between the two drawings. It is still a stretch to claim that Nittoh designs all XCD lenses. Hasselblad has repeatedly stated that the XCD lenses are designed in Sweden and manufactured by Nittoh. That is all the facts that I know. I bet some of the disposable furniture is also not just made in China but also designed in China. This raises all kinds of questions about the Swedish meatballs. 😁 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
thighslapper Posted January 4, 2020 Share #240 Posted January 4, 2020 (edited) 2 hours ago, SrMi said: Hasselblad has repeatedly stated that the XCD lenses are designed in Sweden and manufactured by Nittoh. That is all the facts that I know. 'designed' is a rather elastic term ..... I maintain that I 'designed' our new flat, but the architect produced the detailed drawings/specifications and a number of tradesmen transformed that into reality. Similarly, many high end names in the jewellery world 'design' their creations .... but that rarely goes beyond a sketch and choice of materials. Edited January 4, 2020 by thighslapper 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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