90/2.8 Tele-Elmarit-M vs. 90/4 Macro-Elmar

[luigi bertolotti]

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I've owned four leica 90mm lenses…

 

 

For me, the macro is the better lens, but of all Leica 90s, the TE is my next choice, and a real bargain.

 I agree, after 1 Year with the Macro Elmar M : still use the Summicron when f2 can be of usage (hard to focus anyway) but the mix of quality and size of the Macro is unbeatable : I loved a lot the last Elmarit M 90... but now feel it as damn heavy (… too in accord with my passion, I even took it in chrome…  )

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[tobey bilek]

The 90/4 macro has more acutance than the T-E 90/2.8 and also less flare than the latter so my reasons to keep the T-E are f/2.8 and its smoother rendering on portraits. On landscapes and closeups, the 90/4 macro is my favorite compact 90 by far.

 

 

MEM is full sharp at 4.0 gaining on depth of field only.    2.8 if you need 2.8.

[bocaburger]

I have both the fat and thin T-E, plus a late-model f/4 Elmar in LTM, and a late-model pre-ASPH Summicron.  None of them give me any flare issues if used with their hoods, however my thin T-E I use the deep metal one, not the rubber one it came with.   Hands-down the thin T-E is my travel lens, never let me down.  Some of these were reputed to have an issue with clouding of the rear element group that can't be repaired, so best to check with a flashlight before buying.

That said, IMHO the best bang-for-the-buck in a 90 is the CV APO-Lanthar. As light as the thin T-E, only half a stop slower, sharp, no C/A with digital, and zero flare.

[otto.f]

I couldn’t bear the softness of the TE, in both sharpness and contrast. Might be interesting for dreamy portraits but that’s not my thing. I found the Elmarit 90 a great step forward, but a little bit harsh. So I landed at the SAA 90, after discovering that a crop of a capture with this lens was just as good as a close-up with the 90MEM. The collapsible is a great lens with very wide usability, but as you said the 4.0 itches and is something I would not accept at long term if this was my only 90. I find the 90MEM very expensive for a 4.0 and if you have a 240 or an M10 there better and cheaper ways to make macro, with the Elmarit 60-R for instance.

Edited September 6, 2018 by otto.f

[pgk]

I have a 90 TE. It CAN flare and does sometimes but its not awful - I do use the metal hood for it though which I suspect helps matters quite a lot. Its not a bad lens but my copy is not as 'sharp' as the Elmarit-M which replaced it. Stopped down for landscape work its ok and not as bad as might be thought even wide open. Its real virtue is its weight and cost - light and 'cheap' (a relative term in Leicaspeak). I like the TE despite having 'better' lenses. Objectively I probably shouldn't, but subjectively I do. I used one on a recent 10 day trip and whilst I did lose an odd shot due to flare or softness, these were the awkward shots which its was never going to be at its best with. I'm not sorry I took it and no other 90 though.

[tsleica]

The TE is a good lens..nothing wrong with it unless you are wanting the latest resolution and color parameters..

Nice and small..pretty fast at 2.8..you can control the softness wide open or close for portraits..whats not to like..a real performer in many ways..you may not need another 90..unless you do macro a lot and want max performance in that range..

[cobbu2]

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I really appreciate all the varied comments here; a lot of good things have been said for the 90 MEM and apparently the TE is fine also as long as it’s stopped down some. IQ wise, it seems the differences would only be visible to a keen eye, as it seems the MEM has a slight edge.

 

The only thing nagging at me is the extra stop with the TE; I can foresee situations where I wold use it, i.e., night street scenarios. If at all possible I want to keep it to only one 90mm lens; but I could be persuaded to eventually possess both.

[pgk]

Be aware of one thing with the TE. It can suffer from haze in the back group which may or may not be easy to rectify. Easier to buy an unaffected lens than repair.

[elgenper]

I´ve owned both the Makro Elmar and the ´thin´ Tele Elmarit.  The TE got mothballed because of the flare propensity that Andy described; in fact it lost contrast in almost all situations with enough light plasticity to be worth photographing.  The ME is a spectacular piece of glass tehcnically, and very compact, but had just too much ´bite´ for my taste, so I sold it.

 

Now I own the old Summarit model (the f/2.5 one), and that´s the 90 I use when I need a 90 (which isn´t too often; I also have the 75 Apo, which I prefer for portraits).  It is quite good, without any excessive personality, and they seem to be quite cheap second hand.  Bigger than the two others, but still quite light and compact.

[JDFlood]

I have owned a 90mm T/E for a couple months and been doing photography in the mountains. I am sure all the incredibly subtle nuances that have been brought up are correct... but from a normal outdoors photographer the little light lens is fantastic. Small - light, really sharp and by itself when you see something closer than three feet you can take the photo. To me it is not a macro without the adapter... which I have not felt the need to buy. Banff is beautiful this time of the year. The T/E is perfect! JD

[pgk]

The TE got mothballed because of the flare propensity that Andy described; in fact it lost contrast in almost all situations with enough light plasticity to be worth photographing.

 

Check it for rear group haze. Mine WILL flare but is generally not at all bad. If you've lost contrast something is wrong unless you are constantly shooting in very bright conditions with no hood.

[elgenper]

Check it for rear group haze. Mine WILL flare but is generally not at all bad. If you've lost contrast something is wrong unless you are constantly shooting in very bright conditions with no hood.

 

I know about this, but I don´t think it´s the cause here.  The glass looks OK when looking at a point light source.  Also ´loss of contrast´ is a bit relative.  with mine, it´s not as aggressive as in Andy´s third example (the b/w shot).  But it is a bit too much for my taste.

Edited September 8, 2018 by elgenper

[lct]

In my modest 30+ years experience with it the so-called lack of contrast of the thin T-E 90/2.8 came mainly from flare caused by the sun or other strong light sources outside the frame. I did some of my favorite contrasty pics with it in my youth but i rarely shot into the light with it then so flare issues i had not that much. 

[Guest Nowhereman]

I have both lenses. For portraits, I would grab the Tele-Elmarit; for landscapes, I would reach for the Macro-Elmer. But often you have the "wrong lens" on the camera (below with the M-Monochrom): 

• The landscape in Sri Lanka was shot with the Tele-Elmarit: in bright and extremely hazy light, the exposure with the Tele-Elmatit was at ISO320, f/8 , 1/1500 sec, yellow filter. (Sri Lanka)
• The woman and cat in Bangkok was shot with the Macro-Elmer: ISO1250. f/4 or f/5.6, 1/125 sec. (In Bangkok, I was taking a picture of a dog, when this shopowner, sitting inside a dark shop with an open door, asked me  to take a picture of her with her cat.)

Perhaps this comparison is not fair to the Tele-Elmarit because any lens would have struggled with the haze and bright back-light from the sky. The bottom part (foreground) on the landscape indicates to me that I could use the Tele-Elmarit for landscapes. On the other hand — look at the hand — the Macro-Elmar is good for portraits in which you want a lot of detail.

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[pgk]

Well FWIW, this was taken on the 'thin' TE recently, against the light, and flare is quite well controlled. Mine is used with the latest metal hood (as is the 9/4 macro) which probably helps, and in this case no UVa was fitted.

 

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[M9reno]

If you envisage hiking with a 90, then I think the Macro-Elmar has a huge amount going for it.  Its 'macro' capability and color render are indispensable for alpine flowers, for example.  This is on an M6TTL + macro adapter, with Provia 100.

 

 

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Edited September 9, 2018 by M9reno

[M9reno]

Then, with macro adapter off, the Macro Elmar is an amazing landscape lens.  This is also the M6TTTL, this time with Tri-X.  Paired with a 35 Summicron, for example, it is as lightweight and portable a package as one could wish for.

 

 

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[adan]

Conversely: http://joerivanderkloet.com/the-leica-90-tele-elmarit-review-a-fine-vintage-for-a-good-price/

 

And

 

 

Well FWIW, this was taken on the 'thin' TE recently, against the light, and flare is quite well controlled.

 

Yes. The flare generally comes from intense light in a narrow angle, from just outside the picture, to about 1-picture-depth above or below the image area. And that's without the hood, which can cut that back to ~a half-picture-depth.

 

Friday night, I shot a jam session at the gallery with the 90TE-T, and despite the "dangerous" situation (lots of gallery and stage spotlights) did not have flare trouble, even without a lens hood. I was just - careful.

 

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[Mr.Q]

Sorry to highjack this thread a bit, but for those using the macro adapter with the 90 MEM, are using the old or new version of the lens? Would the old version focus to infinity when collapsed? I know it won't lock when collapsed, but the only problem I see (assuming it would focus properly) is changing aperture, which can be done by pulling out and pushing back in again.

[luigi bertolotti]

Sorry to highjack this thread a bit, but for those using the macro adapter with the 90 MEM, are using the old or new version of the lens? Would the old version focus to infinity when collapsed?

I have the MEM 1st version : no way to focus at infinity when collapsed, neither with the macro adapter (*), nor with another "standard" spacer like the OUFRO... didn't try with other odd combos…  … it has little sense, anyway.

 

(*) I have the vague feel that it maybe can focus at infinity with adapter on and set at some intermediate distance…not a fine way to work... 

Edited September 10, 2018 by luigi bertolotti