35mm Summicron v1 vs. 35mm Summilux Pre-Asph

[Gregm61]

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My experience with the 35mm f2 Summicron ASPH is, it is just as prone to flare as any of these earlier models being discussed. Flare looks to be an issue, be it 35 Summicron or Summilux, early, late or in-between, and there's nothing I find even a little bit "enhancing" about it. The best anti-flare solution I have found is, using the 28mm f2.8 Elmarit ASPH instead.

 

It's unfortunate, but if one of your main interests is shooting aginst the light, 35mm Leica lenses are one of the least well performing focal lengths in this system. The 28, 24, 21 and 18mm lenses all fare better to much better.

 

I'd be interested in knowing the performance of the 35/1.4 Zeiss Distagon in comparison.

Edited July 6, 2017 by Gregm61

[Raid Amin]

I have the V1 Summicron and the pre-asph Summilux, and I use both lenses. The Summilux has become over the years my travel lens as it can serve multiple purposes when I want to stay with a light camera-lens combo. The Summicron is a lens that can give me very beautiful images when viewed on a high resolution monitor. I can see fine details that other 35mm lenses do not give me. Both lenses are superb lenses. Don't worry about your choice. Pick the lens that you like the most, or keep both lenses. Their resale values will not drop.

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[shinobi2012]

I have a Summilux 35 pre ASPH (1973) and a Summicron 35 v3 and Summaron 2.8/35. all with clean Glases and adjusted in Wetzlar. I never ever had any issue wit any of these regarding flare. I am puzzled if I read also that Summilux 35 pre ASPH is not sharp wide open. All I can say is that.it is the sharpest from 1.4 on ...yes , wide open you get the „glow“, which is minimized when printing. I use the 12504 hood with filter. So maybe I have a good copy, but Leica Wetzlar told me, usually these lenses need minor adjustments (focus) which I have done.

all three lenses are great, Summilux is the best, gives the nicest bokeh and 3D look when tested side by side.

oh, I use only a M7, illford Films and Kodak color films.

[Leon Berg]

Hello everyone,

i am currently thinking about selling my mint Lux pre ashp in order to get the 8 Elements. Why? More details in the shadows, bit more contrast at around @f2.0-4.0 

is this nonsense? 

[shirubadanieru]

32 minutes ago, Leon Berg said:

Hello everyone,

i am currently thinking about selling my mint Lux pre ashp in order to get the 8 Elements. Why? More details in the shadows, bit more contrast at around @f2.0-4.0 

is this nonsense? 

Both are great lenses, the lux has the advantage of being 1 stop brighter, but the 8e has the advantage of being less glowy, focuses to 0.7m, and can take filters without a hood. If I had to pick one, I’d go for the 8 elements, but I’m a big fan of both these lenses.

[Leon Berg]

vor einer Stunde schrieb shirubadanieru:

Both are great lenses, the lux has the advantage of being 1 stop brighter, but the 8e has the advantage of being less glowy, focuses to 0.7m, and can take filters without a hood. If I had to pick one, I’d go for the 8 elements, but I’m a big fan of both these lenses.

Thanks for your post.

I think of keeping both as an investment .. but on the long run, I want to sell one of them. Rule is to have one only.  

is the rendering similar? Everyone says the 8 elements is special for black and white. Is that correct?

[a.noctilux]

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Hello Leon,

very simple in fact, you try out the two then decide.

Or

third option, like some of us, you will not sell any as they are NOT same rendering lenses.

I have the "8 element M3 type" which can focus to 65cm, if that matters for 5cm less (a bit picky ! ).

[Leon Berg]

vor 29 Minuten schrieb a.noctilux:

Hello Leon,

very simple in fact, you try out the two then decide.

Or

third option, like some of us, you will not sell any as they are NOT same rendering lenses.

I have the "8 element M3 type" which can focus to 65cm, if that matters for 5cm less (a bit picky ! ).

Thank you. 
yes, I will have to try and then decide.

Does the goggle make the viewfinder a bit foggy? I will buy one version from a dealer and try it out this week and then keep it or give it back.

are there significant differences in coating with different serial numbers? There is one starting with 17……. that had a CLA from Leica and one with 21…… that looks mint but wasn’t serviced. 
Same price.

also.. I have the summilux and bought a Made in Germany King of Bokeh to complement.. I just can’t justify keeping all three .. but could see myself having two

i habe the 50 rigid and V3. I think it’s the perfect combination for me for color and black and white.

I think Summilux plus „King“ would be a good combination.. but the 8 elements turns me on really bad 🤣

[a.noctilux]

Leon, with these old lenses, kind of lottery.

I don't care if it's serviced or not, but clean glass is a must.

 

The goggle is not limiting factor for me, the goggled lens can be used with every M, if the RF is calibrated (no glass knock out goggles),

trying at infinity to see if there is a problem in RF.

Sometimes the M3 type lens can have vertical discrepency with som Leica M (easy or not to cure or adjust).

[Leon Berg]

vor 6 Minuten schrieb a.noctilux:

Leon, with these old lenses, kind of lottery.

I don't care if it's serviced or not, but clean glass is a must.

 

The goggle is not limiting factor for me, the goggled lens can be used with every M, if the RF is calibrated (no glass knock out goggles),

trying at infinity to see if there is a problem in RF.

Sometimes the M3 type lens can have vertical discrepency with som Leica M (easy or not to cure or adjust).

Thanks for the great insight.

Yes, clean glass is a must, you are right!

good to know about the goggles.. the one without is just to expensive and also I think I don’t mind the goggles, but will have to try..

my summilux is mint, from 1988, Maybe it’s a mistake to sell it. It’s a great lens if I think about it. But only on film. 
 

How is the king of bokeh on black and white? Too modern? The 8 elements looks just fabulous, the best I have seen. 

Edited December 26, 2021 by Leon Berg

[insideline]

44 minutes ago, Leon Berg said:

Thanks for the great insight.

Yes, clean glass is a must, you are right!

good to know about the goggles.. the one without is just to expensive and also I think I don’t mind the goggles, but will have to try..

my summilux is mint, from 1988, Maybe it’s a mistake to sell it. It’s a great lens if I think about it. But only on film. 
 

How is the king of bokeh on black and white? Too modern? The 8 elements looks just fabulous, the best I have seen. 

I rarely try to comment on whether someone should keep a lens they own or not but in this instance of a 35 1.4 Pre-asph I can't help myself. 

I own a late German Titanium copy in the 360 serial # range and when I carefully compare it to my 8 element and 35 V4, the Summilux comes out on top every time. At F2 on up it is the sharpest of the three, possesses better contrast and in general the photographs posses more information and clarity. Given the titanium copies are machined from brass I also find this lens very well made and wonderful to use. The V4 is quickest to focus given the proximity to the focus ring and the 8 element the slowest. On my M10M my favorite is also the Summilux so I am surprised to hear you say only on film as its my favorite on film and on the M10 Monochrom. I hope you decide to keep the Summilux, if you can afford to what would you sell it? 

[Leon Berg]

vor 25 Minuten schrieb insideline:

I rarely try to comment on whether someone should keep a lens they own or not but in this instance of a 35 1.4 Pre-asph I can't help myself. 

I own a late German Titanium copy in the 360 serial # range and when I carefully compare it to my 8 element and 35 V4, the Summilux comes out on top every time. At F2 on up it is the sharpest of the three, possesses better contrast and in general the photographs posses more information and clarity. Given the titanium copies are machined from brass I also find this lens very well made and wonderful to use. The V4 is quickest to focus given the proximity to the focus ring and the 8 element the slowest. On my M10M my favorite is also the Summilux so I am surprised to hear you say only on film as its my favorite on film and on the M10 Monochrom. I hope you decide to keep the Summilux, if you can afford to what would you sell it? 

First of all thank you very much for sharing your experience.

I have to say, I am surprised about what I read. Maybe I was just premature with my opinion about the Lux on digital sensors. I just repeated what I heard. 
I hear about the 8 elements being the most unique and best rendering on black and white.

All of the lenses (king, Lux and 8-el) are great investments. I think I buy them all and try them out and resell 1 or 2 them. I won’t loose money I guess.

Some people said the Lux pre asph is only usable from 5.6, others appreciate that it looks different at every aperture.

i barely use it wide open. But like the glow.

just heard the 8el has more detail in shadows and retains more detail in highlights, too. I just like the rendering of the 50/60ies.. well, my Lux is a 60ies lens too heheh.. made 88 though, maybe with a different coating.. 

 

tough decision ..

[a.noctilux]

I don't agree that the 35mm Summicron "I" (8 element) is "best rendering on b&w", I use it (them, I have two) on color sensor/film and the results may not be as saturated as other modern asph. 35mm, but has it's own very nice rendering in subtle colors.

 

 

[Leon Berg]

vor 11 Minuten schrieb a.noctilux:

I don't agree that the 35mm Summicron "I" (8 element) is "best rendering on b&w", I use it (them, I have two) on color sensor/film and the results may not be as saturated as other modern asph. 35mm, but has it's own very nice rendering in subtle colors.

 

 

I intend to have that slightly de-saturated look on color and on black and white I want that 60ies look. 
King of bokeh is too modern, what do you think? I think I’ll let go of that, in the long run at least. Which 35mm lenses do you own? I intend to use it on film only.

Maybe I already have everything I need in the Lux.. Additionally to using the lenses I look to make an investment and resell one day, maybe, but also use all of them (with care).
I could justify keeping two lenses that I use frequently in the end. Two that have different characteristics. 
Don’t know if the Lux and 8 elements complement each other or are too similar. 
 

[Leon Berg]

Apologies for being off topic. Other than looking very similar, what do you gentlemen think about the Summaron 2.8? It’s more on the classic rendering side, too, no? 

[Jeff S]

6 hours ago, Leon Berg said:

is this nonsense? 

Yes.

Read less; shoot more.

Rendering depends on myriad variables, including endless processing options, especially if you print, and most of which depend on you. Every lens you mention is capable of producing superb… or mediocre… results. Nobody will know or care which was used, except on a gear forum.  And even here, each person will have a different opinion based on personal needs and preferences.

Jeff

[a.noctilux]

Leon,

Follow Jeff S advice above,

Read less, shoot more 😉

...

posts #34 and 35

kind of answer which 35mm I use

and continuing adventure

part of them in pic

seen here

in this thread

 

Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here…

Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!

 

[Leon Berg]

vor 15 Minuten schrieb a.noctilux:

Leon,

Follow Jeff S advice above,

Read less, shoot more 😉

...

posts #34 and 35

kind of answer which 35mm I use

and continuing adventure

part of them in pic

seen here

in this thread

 

Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here…

Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!

 

You’re wonderful guys, thanks for the advice. Totally agree. Believe it or not I shoot a lot , but always looking for some change.. it’s a bad habit, I know. Will upload you some shots from the Lux. You’re absolutely right.. I will have to improve my development and also scanning. I have a Durst enlarger already, just didn’t print yet. Thank you guys. 
from a practical standpoint, I will get another 35 for closer focus and different character.. Because .. well, because it’s fun.  

thanks again! 
 

and: nice collection of lenses, sir!

Edited December 26, 2021 by Leon Berg

[Pyrogallol]

2 hours ago, Leon Berg said:

Apologies for being off topic. Other than looking very similar, what do you gentlemen think about the Summaron 2.8? It’s more on the classic rendering side, too, no? 

I have a liking for the Summaron f2.8

I have four of them now, two in bayonet and two original screw fitting.

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[TomB_tx]

I have a Summicron 8-element M3 type with goggles, and a Summaron 2.8 M2 version (no goggles). I had the Summicron serviced by DAG to CLA and adjust the goggles, and it improved the viewfinder image, but still not as good as a version without goggles. I also prefer the rendering of the 2.8 Summaron, as it has higher contrast and just seems "snappier". I use both on film bodies, and prefer the 2.5 Summarit on digital.