Csacwp Posted April 12, 2017 Share #1 Posted April 12, 2017 Advertisement (gone after registration) What is the sharpest wide angle M lens? The 21 or 24 super elmar, or the 28 summicron? Something else? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted April 12, 2017 Posted April 12, 2017 Hi Csacwp, Take a look here Sharpest wide angle. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
Stein K S Posted April 12, 2017 Share #2 Posted April 12, 2017 Hi I have no experience with SE 21 or 24... The 28 cron though is marvelous in my eyes. But I also posted a thread yesterday about my findings when buying a used 24 Elmarit asph. Very impressed! However, sharpness might not be MY only "quality parameter"... Regards, Stein Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
adan Posted April 12, 2017 Share #3 Posted April 12, 2017 It's a bit tricky - where do you want the sharpness? Center, corners, or everywhere? And do you want raw resolution (how small/far away can a picket fence be, and still see all the pickets) - or high MTF (which is a measure of resolution AND contrast - what "looks" snappiest in a print). Wide open, or stopped down to the best aperture? For example, my 1980-ish 35 Summicron v.4 is a tiny bit sharper in the center than the current 35 ASPHs (either f/1.4 or f/2) @ f/2 - BUT is much, much fuzzier in the corners down to f/8 or so. That's just how Dr. Mandler chose to optimize his lens designs back then - for photojournalism, not landscapes. Same for my Mandler 21 f/2.8 vs. the Solms 1990s 21 f/2.8 ASPH - center slightly sharper in the old lens @ f/2.8, corners sharper with the newer design at almost any aperture. The 35 f/1.4 "Aspherical" (rare collector's item, preceded the 35 f/1.4 ASPH) behaves more like a Mandler design - sharper center @ f/1.4, softer corners. That being said, in my experience the 24 f/2.8 Elmarit-ASPH is very crisp - I found the f/3.8 Super-Elmar to be a disappointment by comparison. Never had a chance to try the 21 Super-Elmar, but from others' examples, it seems to outdo the 24 SE in resolution. The 28 Summicron gets rave reviews, stopped down a tad. The 28 Elmarit-ASPH is very sharp, but some (including me) think it's almost TOO contrasty and harsh. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Lucan Posted April 12, 2017 Share #4 Posted April 12, 2017 This lens and review is interesting. http://joerivanderkloet.com/leica-elmarit-m-282-8-asph-review/ At this very moment (Stephens) Leica Store-Manchester UK is one in stock. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gregm61 Posted April 12, 2017 Share #5 Posted April 12, 2017 The 28mm f2.8 Elmarit ASPH is definitely the sharpest M lens I own. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff S Posted April 12, 2017 Share #6 Posted April 12, 2017 When evaluating the 28 Summicron, consider the old versus new design as well as the camera, as Jono has discussed... http://www.slack.co.uk/leica-m-resolution.html Jeff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
UliWer Posted April 12, 2017 Share #7 Posted April 12, 2017 Advertisement (gone after registration) One might look at the MTF graphs published by Leica for the lenses. They give an "image" on a theoretical base, which might be the right one, since the question is a theoretical question as well. You may expect a modern aspherical with modest opening like the Super-Elmars outresolving a Summilux if you campare them at f/5.6. Perhaps this is different if you take an Elmarit as comparison. Though a Super-Elmar doesn't have any sharpness at f/1.4, f/2 or f2.8 - so it is clearly "outresolved" if you look for wider openings. And I don't see much sense to compare an 18mm lens to a 28mm with regards to to sharpness. There are evidently much more important differences between the different types. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlanT Posted April 12, 2017 Share #8 Posted April 12, 2017 I can't comment on the 24 or 28 mm as I have never used them. I do own a 21mm SEM and coupled with my M246, I am astonished by how sharp it is. It is an extraordinary lens. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
tobey bilek Posted April 12, 2017 Share #9 Posted April 12, 2017 I look at details in the corners. 24 3.8 is my best, no 21 super Elmar. 28 2.8 ASPH is very good. 35 2.0 ASPH is ok to Leica standards, but 24 and 28 are better. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
gpwhite Posted April 12, 2017 Share #10 Posted April 12, 2017 If you define sharpness as evidenced by the crisp illusion of 3D, then the Elmar 24mm ASPH is your lens. It competes with the APO 50mm Summicron in every respect, IMHO. The WATE is quite close to the Elmar 24mm in the central 70% of the frame, but the corners are not as good as with the 24mm Elmar. All of this said, my vote for the most beautifully rendering (and still very crisp and contrasty) wide-angle would be the Elmarit 24mm ASPH. To confuse the matter, there is something uniquely elegant about the very fine rendering of the original version 28mm Summicron ASPH, if you can get a fine piece (alert that there is large sample variation with this lens for some reason). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pgk Posted April 12, 2017 Share #11 Posted April 12, 2017 What is the sharpest wide angle M lens? The 21 or 24 super elmar, or the 28 summicron? Something else? Or how long is a piece of string? Define the parameters - wide-angle; which focal lengths are you referring to (FWIW 18mm is often defined as super-wide-angle) - aperture; wide open, mid or stopped down - 'sharpness'; micro-detail, contrast, a mix? Simple question, complex answers as many are. And at the end of the day photography is very, very rarely about the 'sharpest' lens, its about the appropriate focal length, aperture, focus point, shutter speed at a low ISO setting, and not least relevant and acceptable sharpness for the end use, so if you are after an image which requires 'sharpness' and want to know which lenses may deliver this you need to specify more than just 'sharpness' I'm afraid. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronazle Posted April 12, 2017 Share #12 Posted April 12, 2017 The 35mm Cron, the 28mm Elmarit and the 18mm Distagon are probably the sharpest WAs that I own. The 28mm Summaron is not a contender. Regards, ron Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
a911s Posted April 12, 2017 Share #13 Posted April 12, 2017 For example, my 1980-ish 35 Summicron v.4 is a tiny bit sharper in the center than the current 35 ASPHs (either f/1.4 or f/2) @ f/2 - BUT is much, much fuzzier in the corners down to f/8 or so. That's just how Dr. Mandler chose to optimize his lens designs back then - for photojournalism, not landscapes. Same for my Mandler 21 f/2.8 vs. the Solms 1990s 21 f/2.8 ASPH - center slightly sharper in the old lens @ f/2.8, corners sharper with the newer design at almost any aperture. The 28 Summicron gets rave reviews, stopped down a tad. The 28 Elmarit-ASPH is very sharp, but some (including me) think it's almost TOO contrasty and harsh. My experience as well. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
otho Posted April 13, 2017 Share #14 Posted April 13, 2017 Quite sharp is also CV Ultron 21/1.8. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
helged Posted April 13, 2017 Share #15 Posted April 13, 2017 From my experience, these are all very sharp wide angle lenses: 21SEM, the new 28Elmarit (11677) and the 28Lux. I always bring with me the 21SEM if/when wide coverage is needed/expected. Given its small size and wight and outstanding performance into the corners, I always pick 28Elmarit for hiking. In this respect, 28Lux is more of a special lens. And it is on the heavy side for my liking. Regarding corner sharpness of the 'old' vs new 28Elmarit, have a look a little down in this thread. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gregm61 Posted April 13, 2017 Share #16 Posted April 13, 2017 Regarding corner sharpness of the 'old' vs new 28Elmarit, have a look a little down in this thread. Looks similar to Reid's review of the two 28 Elmarits.....if you use the SL, the new version is worth the update. If you use an M body, the difference in the corners is not significant. I certainly do not see the corner blurring at f2.8 demonstrated in those images using the "old" Elmarit on an M262 or an M9. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Csacwp Posted April 13, 2017 Author Share #17 Posted April 13, 2017 I'd be using the lens solely for landscape, so overall sharpness and sharpness to the corners is a must. The WATE doesn't perform too well at 21mm so that's why I'm considering the 21 SE, but adding a 24mm elmar would make for an even more versatile kit. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pgk Posted April 13, 2017 Share #18 Posted April 13, 2017 I'd be using the lens solely for landscape, so overall sharpness and sharpness to the corners is a must. The WATE doesn't perform too well at 21mm so that's why I'm considering the 21 SE, but adding a 24mm elmar would make for an even more versatile kit. The 21SE is the BEST wide-angle I've owned and I've owned a lot. If you want a 21mm its stunning. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lct Posted April 13, 2017 Share #19 Posted April 13, 2017 I'm not good at comparing lenses of different focal lengths but WAs giving me a higher sense of sharpness are perhaps Biogon 35/2.8 and Summicron 28/2 v2. Summicron 35/2 asph v1, Summilux 35/1.4 FLE and Elmarit 28/2.8 asph v1 are no slouch either. I like much wider lenses like 21/3.4 asph and 24/3.8 asph but they are not sharp enough in the corners to compete IMHO. Now if corners are not taken into account, an old lens like 21/3.4 pre-asph remains among the sharper. Purely subjective though. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
uhoh7 Posted April 14, 2017 Share #20 Posted April 14, 2017 By anecdote, the SEM 21 wins the prize across the frame. But not as many own the SEM18, which might be better yet by a tad, at least on the chart. My old 28 cron seems very sharp. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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