Why M240 users will (not) switch to M10

[bozu_shutterbugger]

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Sorry to sound critical but given that the clouds are the least interesting thing in this image, wouldn't it have been better to expose for the building? By underexposing the heck out of the building you've ended up with very muddy main subject simply because you didn't give it enough light. I love what you have been doing with the M10, your images of Rockport and Groton are very inspiring. In fact, thanks to you, I visited Ponyhenge yesterday. What fun.

I don't think the question is about how to post process this image but more about what all you can do with the m10

 

 

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[Tailwagger]

Sorry to sound critical but given that the clouds are the least interesting thing in this image, wouldn't it have been better to expose for the building? By underexposing the heck out of the building you've ended up with very muddy main subject simply because you didn't give it enough light. I love what you have been doing with the M10, your images of Rockport and Groton are very inspiring. In fact, thanks to you, I visited Ponyhenge yesterday. What fun.

 

No worries. As I mentioned in the original post, this wasn't an attempt at  full on processing job. I'm sure I could make it more presentable with a bit of effort. Just presented a quick example of capability, not one demonstrating either artistic nor technical merit,  though admittedly, I'm totally capable of botching such things entirely.  As proof of self awareness in this regard and feeling ever so slightly called out ( )...

 

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But a few of the pixels gathered depicting this building. It's part of my process in situations like this to make many alternate exposures from a number of vantage points. When dealing with something I find interesting that's stationary, particularly in difficult light, I'm in no rush to move on. These days with 32 GB instead of 32 frames, one is liberated from having to make any potentially limiting decisions in the moment. I'm quite content to be a hack, conceive a set of alternate potential results, take a set of varied exposures and see what develops on the back end. Had this scene made the cut and I decided to express a sense of elegance in the face of decay, I'd might have stayed in color and gone with #84 (the comparison was done from 78 to 79).  But, in general, when shooting such structures, I like to evoke a sense of impending loss about a fundamental aspect of New England's character which is disintegrating in our time.  Not to be overly conventional, but that tends to dictate B&W and pushing from the bottom up to get the result I'm after. In the case of this subject, I succumbed to my usual desire to be depressing and despite the fortuitous, but mildly uplifting stray path of light, settled on this shot from the series as the one that best expressed both those sentiments.

 

  

Anyway, a very deep bow and thank you for the exceeding kind sentiment. Glad you find some of my recent effort motivating. OTOH, my own greatest motivator, self doubt, won't let me forget that any positive statements made were done so under the intoxicating influence of Ponyhenge afterglow and therefore utterly suspect.  

[Kwesi]

I'm glad you felt "called out" enough to share some insights to your process  . The final black and white image is stunning.

[Tailwagger]

i am a sucker for shadow recovery. I am spoiled by A7R & A7S. I havent been able to do as much DR recovery as i would like to on 240. But the image that you present here is very tempting. This makes me think did i do the right thing by buying a new MP whilst being frustrated about the delivery on M10. Lets put it this way, i like big batteries. (moral support)

 

What you demonstrated is useful when shooting landscape without filters. I can expose for the sky, may be bracket the shots and still not loose the shadow. Question becomes then, do you end up loosing the Leica Character? if all we are trying to do is take a photo that looks like taken from a Sony A6000. I beleive it boils down to preference. No? 

 

Well, let met put it this way, to a very great degree I bought the M10 by accident.  I think its offers improvements across  range of areas, with a few steps backwards in others. Power, as you mention and we've discussed in this thread, is its achilles heal, and to in the interest of honesty, given it is warm to the touch at times, I have a bit  of a nagging concern about  its long term reliability.  But for my use cases, if both cameras were sitting in front of me, while I certainly would have to think about, I'd buy the M10.   Now with that on the table, I'd wouldnt lose sleep over it. Had I not stumbled into an M10, I'd still content to soldier on with my 4 year old M240. Improved yes, irresistibly so, I'd say not. 

 

As for the added DR losing the Leica-ness, I'd say perhaps sometimes, but certainly not in general. What's quite interesting and unexpected for me is that although I find color processing far easier with the M10, there seems to be a new learning curve to extract B&W as easily it was accomplished with the M240.  In the end, its really about the glass anyway. 

Edited July 7, 2017 by Tailwagger

[Tailwagger]

I'm glad you felt "called out" enough to share some insights to your process  . The final black and white image is stunning.

Wow, that Ponyhenge glow is really long lasting!

[Kwesi]

Wow, that Ponyhenge glow is really long lasting!

 

Remember what happens at Ponyhenge, stays at Ponyhenge

[bozu_shutterbugger]

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No worries. As I mentioned in the original post, this wasn't an attempt at full on processing job. I'm sure I could make it more presentable with a bit of effort. Just presented a quick example of capability, not one demonstrating either artistic nor technical merit, though admittedly, I'm totally capable of botching such things entirely. As proof of self awareness in this regard and feeling ever so slightly called out ( )...

 

barnshots.jpg

 

But a few of the pixels gathered depicting this building. It's part of my process in situations like this to make many alternate exposures from a number of vantage points. When dealing with something I find interesting that's stationary, particularly in difficult light, I'm in no rush to move on. These days with 32 GB instead of 32 frames, one is liberated from having to make any potentially limiting decisions in the moment. I'm quite content to be a hack, conceive a set of alternate potential results, take a set of varied exposures and see what develops on the back end. Had this scene made the cut and I decided to express a sense of elegance in the face of decay, I'd might have stayed in color and gone with #84 (the comparison was done from 78 to 79). But, in general, when shooting such structures, I like to evoke a sense of impending loss about a fundamental aspect of New England's character which is disintegrating in our time. Not to be overly conventional, but that tends to dictate B&W and pushing from the bottom up to get the result I'm after. In the case of this subject, I succumbed to my usual desire to be depressing and despite the fortuitous, but mildly uplifting stray path of light, settled on this shot from the series as the one that best expressed both those sentiments.

 

 

Anyway, a very deep bow and thank you for the exceeding kind sentiment. Glad you find some of my recent effort motivating. OTOH, my own greatest motivator, self doubt, won't let me forget that any positive statements made were done so under the intoxicating influence of Ponyhenge afterglow and therefore utterly suspect.

[ndf9]

thank you for the link, jmahto

[MarkP]

Events conspired against me and formed a Perfect Storm for an M10 purchase:

 

I initially had no plans to upgrade but did go into the local Leica Store, looked at the camera ,and really liked it.

 

About 10 minutes after leaving the store I was contacted by another Australian Forum member who wanted to buy my M240 for an acceptable price. They're not that easy to sell in a small market such as Australia.

Leica Australia had promised me a rebate on my next purchase as goodwill for a major repair stuffup some years before.

 

So I bought the M10 and am very happy with it.

Best colour digital M I've had to date, having had an M9 and M240.

 

PROS:

Sensor - great colour
            - increased DR helpful with wide dynamic range scenes.
           -  better high-ISO without banding

Much improved rangefinder

Having analogue controls for aperture, shutter speed and ISO is very fast and convenient

The EVF (a big improvement over the EVF-2 of the M240) is fine for fast lenses wide open and fabulous for use with my 28-90 Vario-Elmarit-R. 

I like toe simplified menus.

 

CONS:

The reduced battery life, for my purposes, is for most of my uses only of nuance value. I just take a spare battery when I think I may need one (EVF use).

However, I do a reasonable amount of tripod work and really miss the virtual horizon feature. It is beyond me why this was removed and for my purposes the only significant downside of the M10.

[Exodies]

I have an M typ 240 and just spent three days with an M10. As many have noted the viewfinder is gorgeous and focus speed is improved. The thickness (thinness?) is interesting but not astounding. The ISO gadget was annoying. M240 is so much simpler. I mostly used auto ISO but it's prolly something you can get used to. I really like the colours you get by default. I won't switch and I rarely have a need of a second body but maybe next model.

[jmahto]

I have an M typ 240 and just spent three days with an M10. As many have noted the viewfinder is gorgeous and focus speed is improved. The thickness (thinness?) is interesting but not astounding. The ISO gadget was annoying. M240 is so much simpler. I mostly used auto ISO but it's prolly something you can get used to. I really like the colours you get by default. I won't switch and I rarely have a need of a second body but maybe next model.

Highlight mine... can you please elaborate?

[Jeff S]

Highlight mine... can you please elaborate?

Likely meaning that better viewing (improved magnification, eye relief and larger opening) facilitates ease of focusing... provided one's eyes are properly corrected for the focus patch (2m).

 

Jeff

[lct]

And provided one's eye is centered on the eyepiece to avoid the flare of the M10's viewfinder...

[jaapv]

Which is advisable anyway to achieve correct focus. Any rangefinder system must be used with the eye precisely in the optical axis.

[lct]

My M240 doesn't require eye centering at all. 

[Jeff S]

It does if you want optimal focus.

 

Jeff

[erl]

Consider the possibility of parallax inside the VF window.

You are looking at two different images  (of the same motif). They are both physically in differing planes.

If your eye is off centre (skew) with the axis of the tywo images, you will line them up slightly incorrectly.

I would deduce that therefore centering your eye is necessary for optimal focus alignment of the two images, which controls camera focus.

 

If my theory is wrong, please enlighten me.

[lct]

Well i want optimum focus generally and i've never been bothered by eye centering i must say. Only negligible issue so to speak is some faint flare coming from the frame lines in low light. 

[Jeff S]

Well i want optimum focus generally and i've never been bothered by eye centering i must say. Only negligible issue so to speak is some faint flare coming from the frame lines in low light.

It's not about flare; it's about alignment. I agree that the M10 seems more susceptible to misalignment, but the principle remains the same.

 

Jeff

Edited July 29, 2017 by Jeff S

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Hallo,

Look here: Leica M

[lct]

I was referring to flare Jeff. Erl, i'm not good at theories my friend . Just sharing my modest experience with the M240 but i have none with the M10 admittedly.