Leica Summaron-28 -image thread

[Jeff S]

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Forgetting about the lens, I really like the first 'painter' photo (among others).  The photographer remains the critical component.

 

Jeff

[james.liam]

Maybe this is why Leica posts seemingly crappy images for new lenses. They're selling you a tool and not the skills. Any 28mm lens in Adam's hands would have "sung". The exceptions being those with that curious flare effect, but then again, skill and experience tells him how and when to trigger it.

[vhfreund]

Example photos, you ask??

He, he, ...you're welcome...

 Ya'll don't all go out and buy the lens it at once, now, you'll be bound to push up the prices :)

Adam,

 

your photos are simply stunning! I wonder what metering technique you are using for the snaps?

 

Best Theodor

[A miller]

Adam,

 

your photos are simply stunning! I wonder what metering technique you are using for the snaps?

 

Best Theodor

 

Thanks a lot, Theodor.   Suffice to say that, through a LOT of trial and error (which involved a huge spend of money and time) I have gained some sort of a working sense of reading the light w/o an in-camera meter.  What works for me is the use of a small hand held sekonic meter to set a reference point (which I adjust from there).   Having said this, I am sure that the rendering of this original lens (as illustrated in the foregoing examples) would be produced regardless of the metering technique, provided the exposure is "correct."

Edited October 23, 2016 by A miller

[vhfreund]

Thanks a lot, Theodor.   Suffice to say that, through a LOT of trial and error (which involved a huge spend of money and time) I have gained some sort of a working sense of reading the light w/o an in-camera meter.  What works for me is the use of a small hand held sekonic meter to set a reference point (which I adjust from there).   Having said this, I am sure that the rendering of this original lens (as illustrated in the foregoing examples) would be produced regardless of the metering technique, provided the exposure is "correct."

Thank you Adam, my question was not because of the lens. I noticed that you use an M3 and an M-A which don´t have inbuilt meters. I also use the M-A and I am still a bit slow, thats why I asked.

 

Best Theodor

Edited October 23, 2016 by vhfreund

[philipus]

Hello Jaap,

 

I just heard back from Customer Service. The optical formula is, indeed, exactly the same as the old lens; there has been no recomputing. However, your guess is correct that the use of modern glass and better coating account for the improved optical performance.

 

Best,
Philip

 

 

For one thing: the original glass types  are most likely not available any more. Most likely Leica did the same thing as with the Elmar-M: Use the old optical formula and recalculate using newer glass.

[jaapv]

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If they used different glass they must have recalculated the radii of the lens elements. The basic formula is obviously the same.

[philipus]

Well if you doubt what I write feel free to contact them yourself.

 

 

If they used different glass they must have recalculated the radii of the lens elements. The basic formula is obviously the same.

[Exodies]

A Miller - "News Stand" is a fantastic moment. Well spotted. Should be placed with "Morrow's Nut Shop" by Steven Shore.

[jaapv]

Well if you doubt what I write feel free to contact them yourself.

I think we are talking the same thing. The formula has not changed, as we agreed from the beginning. However, unless a new glass type has exactly the same refractive index as the old one - and why should one create a new glass then?- the lens must be recalculated to fit in the optical formula. Actually, this happens with other lenses as well during the production span, without Leica announcing it. So there can be no doubt about the lens not being recalculated to produce a new formula, only to fit new glass into the old design. Which may, btw., enhance the lens quality, as new coatings will.

[willeica]

If the optical formula is the same, it may be of interest to some to note that two copies of the lens (with some nice accessories) are coming up for auction at Westlicht on 19th November. Neither lot includes the SOOBK hood. I had to buy my hood separately and it is nearly more rare than the lens. Other hoods may work, of course. Perhaps Leica will issue the hood for the new version separately.

 

Adam, your photos are wonderful and they show the possibilities for using the lens for street and people watching photography. The lens is actually quite sharp in the centre and for most of the field of view at f5.6. Most of my shots with the lens are at f8 or f11, with perhaps f16 used on one occasion. In most circumstances I rarely go beyond f8 with digital as the image tends to go away a bit beyond that point. I note that your shots were taken with film and I think I recognised Portra in some of the shots. I have never been able to get anything near the quality of your film scans which are outstanding. With film and manual exposure there are no intervening factors and your photos show the true quality of the lens. Perhaps Leica should call you the next time that they want to show the possibilities of a new lens.

 

William

[IWC Doppel]

I'd be interested to see how it compares to the summicron at f5.6. Never really compared lenses at that sort of aperture, suspect any character differences will be small ?

[lct]

Main difference at f/5.6 is glow, vignetting and flare apparently. 

Edited October 24, 2016 by lct

[Alberti]

Looking at the two drawings of the lens, it looks like it is significantly changed; the outside two lenses are now on a flat plane (much better I understand) (see right image).

 

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The back element in the new one looks significantly larger now too. That should improve corners in a digital universe maybe.

 

Anyway, I like this lens; and I hope the flare is indeed as good as seen - that is, I hate ten or twelve pronged stars, I love the SA 21 soft style, the style my old 35mm has.

It does grab my awareness; next is move it up in my intention towards desire . .

 

ps. I have a 90 mm Elmar-M, and that is the among sharpest lenses, even more so than the 50mm Cron. So I expect a lot from the new recalculation of an older formula. So I trust them engineers.

Edited October 24, 2016 by Alberti

[DBAUDUI1]

Hello,

 

I have been using successfully this lens , a "like new" summaron 2.8 f5.6, on a M8 and now on a M240. This lens gives stunning results already wide open: you have an excellent contrast and sharpness on most of the field, nice colour saturation and details, plus visible pleasing vignetting wide open, that envelopes your undistorted and crisp picture. Then this lens is so compact that you can put the camera and summaron 2.8 in your poket! What to dream more of a lens? Maybe the new summaron 28 M is even better tnan the old already successful one, as it has new coating and maybe new glass and also simply because it is newer and shows no scratches or hase that you could fine on a dirty used old summaron (not like mine, that is as new). I would actually be very happy to compare the new summaron 28M with my old one. I remember that the new Elmar M 50 2.8 is rated better as the old one, although it shares nearly the same formula.

 

Best regards.

 

Dominique

[jaapv]

Looking at the two drawings of the lens, it looks like it is significantly changed; the outside two lenses are now on a flat plane (much better I understand) (see right image).

 

summaron original kopie.jpg  new summaron kopie.jpg

 

The back element in the new one looks significantly larger now too. That should improve corners in a digital universe maybe.

 

Anyway, I like this lens; and I hope the flare is indeed as good as seen - that is, I hate ten or twelve pronged stars, I love the SA 21 soft style, the style my old 35mm has.

It does grab my awareness; next is move it up in my intention towards desire . .

 

ps. I have a 90 mm Elmar-M, and that is the among sharpest lenses, even more so than the 50mm Cron. So I expect a lot from the new recalculation of an older formula. So I trust them engineers.

That is somewhat more redesign than I expected.

[lct]

Which new redesign? There are two different ones so far:

 

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[jaapv]

That does not look like the original one that Alberti posted. But even in your comparison all the elements look quite different. Could there be a third configuration? :o

[lct]

Both come from Alberti's post above:

 

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Hallo,

Look here: Leica M

[TomB_tx]

These are marketing illustrations, not design drawings, and Leica has often taken some artistic liberties with them, such as exaggerating the air gap lenses in some Summicron versions.

With different optical glass I'd expect some visible differences. The flat lens surfaces are not for performance, but for ease of manufacture, as noted with the v4 Summicron. Still, it looks like only the first couplet has a flat joining surface, the "illustration" shows a slight curvature to the joint of the last two elements.

 

I also find this lens tempting. I just had my 3.5/3.5 LTM Summaron cleaned, and I'm amazed at the images it makes now. I had used it on a IIIf while in the army around 1970, but in recent years the haze really affected the "glow" and contrast.

Edited October 24, 2016 by TomB_tx