The New LEICA M-P: Discreet, Faster, Harder

[FlashGordonPhotography]

Advertisement (gone after registration)

M-P buyers should remember that they are buying a camera which is more than 2 years old.

 

I wonder whether purchasers of the Canon 5D mk3 get the same dire warning?

 

I assume my camera will be new in the box... :-)

 

Gordon

[Advertisement]

The Leica Q3 is available for pre-order at B&H Photo Video and Adorama

[CheshireCat]

I wonder whether purchasers of the Canon 5D mk3 get the same dire warning?

 

As far as I know, there is no "New Canon 5D mk3-P".

The problem is Canon did not find a way to add a frame line selector

[Ecaton]

Am I alone in finding this a rather sad comment on the digital world.?

 

I recently bought this "old" D4 sensor housed in a Df;)

[Paul J]

Am I alone in finding this a rather sad comment on the digital world.?

 

My M9 still keeps me happy and is all I need for a lot of work. I will never sell it and I'm not likely to upgrade it until it falls to bits or until it can replace my high MP system. Even then, I will keep and use it for as long as it is working. In a sub 20MP camera it's all I need.

 

It's seen very heavy use. I've sent it off to be serviced a couple times and Leica send it back looking new with a new leatherette and one time, almost entirely new innards. The bottom plate has a little braising but the steel grey paint is otherwise unmarked, as is the unprotected standard plastic screen cover.

 

So long as I have a shutter dial, an aperture wheel, the best quality manual lens and a light recording medium, I have all the "innovation" I need to take pictures. Anything else, in my opinion is unnecessary. Just ply me with some new and exciting lenses (as they have been) and i'll remain happy.

[colonel]

To keep the list manageable, let's restrict it to only features that you could use while shooting the M240 like an M7 (no video, no live view). I'll also list the camera that has the feature.

 

 

 

• 
   
  
• Electronic first curtain shutter to allow complex metering mode without delay (A7)
   
  
• User selectable frame lines (X-Pro 1)
   
  
• Single frame line option (X-Pro 1)
   
  
• Suggested shutter speed in viewfinder (Zeiss Ikon ZM for gods' sake)
   
  
• Current ISO & aperture guess in viewfinder (every other camera ever forever)
   
  
• Ability to re-assign digital buttons (Fuji cameras)
   
  
• Built in sensor cleaning (Almost every other digital camera)
   
  
• (restricted by my rules outlined above) Hybrid viewfinder (X-Pro 1 - may be patented)
   
  
• (restricted by my rules outlined above) Wireless connectivity - app to grab photos, control camera. (A7)
   
  

 

 

 

Of course the M240 could also have better ISO performance and a lower base ISO, but that doesn't really count as a "missing" feature to me. I'm sure Leica would like its sensor to have 0 noise at 6400, but they aren't magicians.

 

 

Of course it's personal taste but none of those things are any use to me except perhaps sensor cleaning but I prefer the sensor to be fixed and not move. I rarely have the sensor cleaned on any of my cameras and for Leicas have it done free by the shop

[aeturnum]

Of course it's personal taste but none of those things are any use to me except perhaps sensor cleaning but I prefer the sensor to be fixed and not move,

 

I wasn't implying that you (or anyone) wanted those features in particular, simply listing features that appear on other cameras that the M-240 does not offer (and could offer using a RF system). For what it's worth, all the cameras with self-cleaning sensors also have an option to disable automatic cleaning.

 

I could also add that Leicas (in my experience) crash / freeze up / etc more often than other cameras, but that also feels like a low blow. Leica doesn't have the same level of QA as other makers, and everyone has awful camera software.

[jlehrer]

Advertisement (gone after registration)

I make no secret about my affiliations, and my post on Red Dot Forum was meant to be informative. Whether or not the purchase is worthwhile is a decision purely in the hands of the user. I do my best to present valid, logical information about the products they spend their hard-earned money on.

 

I did compare the startup times and they were identical. Because the cameras use the same firmware that's not a big surprise. The extra RAM only allows for more images to be shot before the buffer fills. Since I never turn my camera off when I'm using it, (extra batteries are easy enough to stow in a pocket), I've yet to have startup time be an issue in my photography.

 

I suppose my comment about the frame line lever was meant more for dramatic effect then detailed historical accuracy. I apologize if anyone or their cameras was offended!

[efreed2754]

Thanks for posting Josh.

 

Believe our forum members understand you will position most equipment in a positive light and thus take these types of reviews with a grain of salt just like auto, audio, camera magazines. Hey, I'd love to see the day someone's review puts it by the forum members!!!

 

As for the preview lever, there are some who believe having it challenges their manhood. As I have stated, there are times it is useful, especially when I am shooting a classical concert and want to be sure one shot includes the entire orchestra from left to right. It could be a 50, 35 or even 24 is needed and don't want it too large to avoid excessive cropping.

 

Please post again after donning some armor.

 

Ed

[lct]

I did compare the startup times and they were identical.

That's what i suspected thanks.

[farnz]

… I suppose my comment about the frame line lever was meant more for dramatic effect then detailed historical accuracy. I apologize if anyone or their cameras was offended!

My M2 said it wasn't at all offended, Josh, and neither was I. I mentioned it to assist because if others spotted the discrepancy they might wonder whether something else is incorrect, which could affect engagement with your piece.

 

Pete.

[ALD]

What is the official code for the new Leica M-P ?

 

I agree that the new features should come out on the original version, but there are probably at least 10000 people who would buy the updated camera and sell their old one. And that generates cash flow.

 

Ok so the screw is a mistake, it does look ugly, but it's still a great camera. It's a fantastic camera. If you want the features go buy a Nikon.

 

Sure we all whinge about features and I am the biggest whinger about features, because in a sense I hope that it will influence some engineer, to go beyond and I can finally get what I want.

 

I want a 80 megapixel sensor in the M body and I want 6k video and to be able to use Leica lenses in extremely low light with a high ISO sensitivity so that I can have the camera do everything, I want a 1000% improved range finder that magnifys with the flick of a switch so that I can focus easier. I want the camera to weigh as much as my old iPhone and be the size of two iPhones back to back.

 

Am I going to get that yet?

Nope!

 

I will have to wait, obviously.

 

If anyone wants to get rid of their M240 for a really quick sale and don't really mind if they loose a lot of money, I am buying!

[Ozkar]

What is the official code for the new Leica M-P ?

 

I agree that the new features should come out on the original version, but there are probably at least 10000 people who would buy the updated camera and sell their old one. And that generates cash flow.

 

Ok so the screw is a mistake, it does look ugly, but it's still a great camera. It's a fantastic camera. If you want the features go buy a Nikon.

 

Sure we all whinge about features and I am the biggest whinger about features, because in a sense I hope that it will influence some engineer, to go beyond and I can finally get what I want.

 

I want a 80 megapixel sensor in the M body and I want 6k video and to be able to use Leica lenses in extremely low light with a high ISO sensitivity so that I can have the camera do everything, I want a 1000% improved range finder that magnifys with the flick of a switch so that I can focus easier. I want the camera to weigh as much as my old iPhone and be the size of two iPhones back to back.

 

Am I going to get that yet?

Nope!

 

I will have to wait, obviously.

 

If anyone wants to get rid of their M240 for a really quick sale and don't really mind if they loose a lot of money, I am buying!

 

What's a fair price on a used M240? A local dealer (Australia) was recently clearing brand new M240's for USD 4800 (ex. tax). This is phenomenal value when you consider that the new M-P will sell for USD 9300 (ex. tax) on launch.

[masjah]

OK, here's my take, and I'm happy to accept criticism for stating the bleeding obvious:

 

(1) If I was in the market for a new M ab initio, would I pay the extra and buy the M-P rather than the M? Most certainly.

 

(2) If I already had an M, would I trade it in for an M-P? Most certainly not.

 

So far as I'm concerned, end of story.

[MarkP]

OK, here's my take, and I'm happy to accept criticism for stating the bleeding obvious:

 

(1) If I was in the market for a new M ab initio, would I pay the extra and buy the M-P rather than the M? Most certainly.

 

(2) If I already had an M, would I trade it in for an M-P? Most certainly not.

 

So far as I'm concerned, end of story.

 

Very nicely put

[vikasmg]

>>You can't do face detect with MF<<

 

Why I've been detecting faces all my life with manual focus cameras with fairly good results ;-)

[Bill W]

OK, here's my take, and I'm happy to accept criticism for stating the bleeding obvious:

 

(1) If I was in the market for a new M ab initio, would I pay the extra and buy the M-P rather than the M? Most certainly.

 

(2) If I already had an M, would I trade it in for an M-P? Most certainly not.

 

So far as I'm concerned, end of story.

Agree, I kind of like the red dot on my old M240

[Jeffry Abt]

OK, here's my take, and I'm happy to accept criticism for stating the bleeding obvious:

 

(1) If I was in the market for a new M ab initio, would I pay the extra and buy the M-P rather than the M? Most certainly.

 

I have been in the market for a new M….I should have a M-P by the end of the week.

It is good I some how delayed and procrastinated the purchase of a M. The M-P will be a degree or two better. For ounce procrastination worked for me.

[skimmel]

Am I alone in finding this a rather sad comment on the digital world.?

 

I'm with you on this! There are 2 things I think about with respect to the rapid "obsolescence" in the digital world:

 

1) It's still all about the lenses: these are always a good investment and, more importantly, the most important factor in image quality today

 

2) Related: I wonder when we will get to the point (we may already be there) that improvements in sensor technology just don't provide sufficient improvements that it's worth buying a new camera. I actually think we may be there already. For example, the panasonic GH4 has essentially identical image quality compared with the GH3. Same with the Sony RX100III vs the previous model. The only reason to upgrade is improvements in usability (and, of course, for the GH4, video).

 

So, I really wish that camera manufacturers would focus on usability/ergonomics. I realize that doesn't make a big splash but I can tell you that the improvement in usability from the GH3 to the GH4 is truly, for me, the biggest selling point.

[Advertisement]

Hallo,

Look here: Leica M

[Hamad]

Wahoo.. this is some news for some news readers.. to be honest its not any news at all. Any leica user who has been using leica for over 5-8 years (like myself) would have easily know that this was coming. to be honest these new features are not really helpful.

1- Increase of Buffer of two GB. I don't think anyone will be shooting F1 Start or finish or podium where we do need a big buffer just to make sure we dont miss any unusual action that may happen. with my M100 i shot recently jet plans landing and taking off the carrier and the buffer and the performance of the camera was way to fast for me to capture 4-5 frames of plans landing. having said so if anyone wants to shoot 50 frames of such action then i would say better get Canon 1X as that has a speed to give you this... not Leica. I dont think professional photographers shooting soccer will use Leica in any match. if there is a say that we can record video... then on professional level all use Canon or other 35mm cameras to shoot if they are doing any professional video work. Now why leica says its good for professional i really need to see that.

2- Anti-Scratch screen... yes its good. but $4 dollar mat screen protection will give you the same protection. buy few once it gets scratched replace it.

3-Having no Red-Dot Leica ... i don't know how it helps some and it is in demand.

4-Stronger body... well i bet drop it from your hand to a hard floor and it will be of no use until you sent it back to service center and ask them to open it completely and fix all shaken parts inside. No camera is solid enough to bear the fall of such level. So its a good new camera for anyone who is willing to upgrade from M9 to M240 ... yes thats what i will advice all as i have seen a big difference in performance of the M240 compared to M9. have a good day all.

[CheshireCat]

1- Increase of Buffer of two GB. I don't think anyone will be shooting F1 Start or finish or podium where we do need a big buffer just to make sure we dont miss any unusual action that may happen.

 

Note that the number of frames per second (fps) has not been upgraded. It is just the number of shots before the buffer is full and you are stuck waiting for the camera flashing the red led (i.e. flushing the buffer to disk).

The F1 racing scenario is not a good example, as what really matters in F1 racing is the fps.

 

The speed you flush the buffer to flash is as important (if not more) than the buffer size itself in many shooting conditions.

Unfortunately, this has not been upgraded.

The M lags far behind the 1Dx speed in both fps and buffer flush speed.

 

4-Stronger body... well i bet drop it from your hand to a hard floor and it will be of no use until you sent it back to service center and ask them to open it completely and fix all shaken parts inside.

 

Stronger body ? I have just heard about stronger LCD glass. And the vanilla-M has a supposedly anti-scratch screen already.