otto.f Posted January 31, 2014 Share #161 Posted January 31, 2014 Advertisement (gone after registration) If they can make it for €3500 it will be a success I guess Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted January 31, 2014 Posted January 31, 2014 Hi otto.f, Take a look here A digital M6. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
lct Posted January 31, 2014 Share #162 Posted January 31, 2014 Would be marvelous for a full frame RF indeed. I would not hold my breath though. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevelap Posted January 31, 2014 Share #163 Posted January 31, 2014 .......I am sure that the ‘digital M6’ concept is something Leica will not come up with on their own. As a Monochrom owner, I would not be so bold with such statements. Various rumors have been coming out of Leica about a smaller interchangeable lens camera, and Leica has said it will not come out with another lens series... So nothing is impossible. I think you'll find that Michael is (much) more informed than you or I about that 'smaller interchangeable lens camera'......... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rodluvan Posted January 31, 2014 Share #164 Posted January 31, 2014 I agree that it is possible, and that the market is small. It would seem to appeal to photographers who: I. Value simplicity above all, but not too much: a) They value simplicity so much that a screen on the camera is too thick & distracting, and any buttons for digital functions are too many. But they don't mind carrying, powering and connecting a secondary screen (smartphone/tablet/pc) to change camera settings, format a card or review an image; creating a film-like experience is worth the extra complexity. Again, with the either-or. This is infantile and dishonest representation of a position and ignoring the common view that using a Leica at all is "the appreciation of simplicity above all but not to much!" Who, in any situation in life wants too much of anything? It's a definitional contradiction. Implementing this design idea is not a principle step, but a difference in degrees. You yourself have decided to give up 9fps, TTL composition, split second AF, i.e. you want simplicity but not too much. And again, as others have pointed out, it says more about you than about anyone else, if you consider carrying a smartphone a chore. However the entire point of the camera is not to have to dial in settings, chimp photos every 1 minute or format your mem-card, it's to appreciate the experience of taking photos without being distracted by the technology present in modern digital cameras so why on earth would you negate that by using your mobile phone? Still, if you wanted to, the slim, roughed, stylish Digital M6 in combination with a smartphone and a Leica app running while you're taking photos, has the possibility of hugely increasing functionality and usability at the same time. A dedicated app running on a, in effect, hand-held computer with a superior screen makes much sense. Granted, it introduces some restrictions as well , but it improves on other things. That's the nature of reality. But they do still require the immediacy and convenience of digital because waiting for film to be developed and scanned sometimes takes too long. Yes, so? Another, a childish ignorance of nuances. According to your logic, people using film today (like me), should use a brownie and Sunny 16 otherwise why even bother? Film is a medium that is going extinct, not many films are left, and not many professional labs are left, certainly not in rural areas and so forth. Developing yourself is simply not an option to many for many reasons, one, again, is that chemicals are increasingly difficult to come by. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
swamiji Posted January 31, 2014 Share #165 Posted January 31, 2014 I think you'll find that Michael is (much) more informed than you or I about that 'smaller interchangeable lens camera'......... Considering his record with the Monochrom, I am reminded of the old quote, "Me thinks he protests too much". I am fully aware of what ND agreements he operates. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
noLeicaOwner Posted January 31, 2014 Share #166 Posted January 31, 2014 So her's the idea: A new M that is in every aspect like the M6 was, but has a sensor instead of film. And i mean i EVERY aspect! Exact same size of the body, NO monitor, VERY limited control buttons. Only ISO and RAW or JPG can be chosen. Would you buy such a camera? I would definitely buy it, even I still do not own an cannot afford a leica camera. And even better a monochrome one, so no white-balance is needed. Output not chooseable, just RAW or JPG. I would prefer JPG, so no software needed at all (I do not like to change my shots further by software). And even if the power dropped after 24 Exposures I still would buy it My Mamiya in older Days stopped after 15 Exposures and at least 12 Exposures on that stripe had a perfect quality, much more usable pictures compared to the digital work :-/ Even my old Minox, without focus assist gave me the capability to estimate distances very accurate. So, for me: Less is more. I will buy the first product like this and will not care about the brand. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
steveclem Posted January 31, 2014 Share #167 Posted January 31, 2014 Advertisement (gone after registration) Hi noLeicaOwner, welcome to the forum, would you care for the five minute argument or do you want the full hour? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
noLeicaOwner Posted January 31, 2014 Share #168 Posted January 31, 2014 Hi noLeicaOwner, welcome to the forum, would you care for the five minute argument or do you want the full hour? The full hour Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wattsy Posted January 31, 2014 Share #169 Posted January 31, 2014 Still, if you wanted to, the slim, roughed, stylish Digital M6 in combination with a smartphone and a Leica app running while you're taking photos, has the possibility of hugely increasing functionality and usability at the same time. A dedicated app running on a, in effect, hand-held computer with a superior screen makes much sense. In the interests of keeping the discussion about camera design (rather than speculating whether the digital "M6" is likely to happen) I have to admit that the camera + smartphone 'controller' idea has little appeal to me. I like the idea of the thinner body with a clean (screenless) back but I wouldn't want the simplicity of such a product compromised by a dependence on wifi, bluetooth or any other non-physical connection. Connecting the camera up via USB to a computer occasionally to set the time and other EXIF data (copyright notice, etc.) would be fine with me but I believe that a digital "M6" should be designed as a standalone product. Assuming DNG only output, the camera would need only a top plate LCD for battery power and shots remaining indicators (and possibly a simple histogram of the photo just taken), an ISO dial on the back (even better stick it on the top to clean up the back completely) and a button (maybe inside the baseplate) for formatting an SD card. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomB_tx Posted January 31, 2014 Share #170 Posted January 31, 2014 In the interests of keeping the discussion about camera design (rather than speculating whether the digital "M6" is likely to happen) I have to admit that the camera + smartphone 'controller' idea has little appeal to me. I like the idea of the thinner body with a clean (screenless) back but I wouldn't want the simplicity of such a product compromised by a dependence on wifi, bluetooth or any other non-physical connection. Connecting the camera up via USB to a computer occasionally to set the time and other EXIF data (copyright notice, etc.) would be fine with me but I believe that a digital "M6" should be designed as a standalone product. Assuming DNG only output, the camera would need only a top plate LCD for battery power and shots remaining indicators (and possibly a simple histogram of the photo just taken), an ISO dial on the back (even better stick it on the top to clean up the back completely) and a button (maybe inside the baseplate) for formatting an SD card. Even that is more complex than needed. I never format my SD cards in the camera - just in a PC, and have never had an issue with any of my digital cameras that way. An M5-style ISO selection would be fine (or like most film cameras built into the shutter speed dial - but that's more mechanically complex). I'd be happy with a battery check button and LED. Shots remaining is a valid need, although I've never filled up an SD card, so I could omit that too. I don't believe such a camera would be cheaper, but I'd choose it anyway. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
zlatkob Posted January 31, 2014 Share #171 Posted January 31, 2014 This is infantile and dishonest representation of a position ....... Another, a childish ignorance of nuances. Camera design is a fascinating topic, with implications for the user and the manufacturer. But it's hard to discuss when someone is being this offensive and uncivil. One can disagree with ideas in many ways, but attacking the other person with words like "infantile and dishonest" and "childish ignorance" is just over-the-top rudeness. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
otto.f Posted January 31, 2014 Share #172 Posted January 31, 2014 If soon after a thread is opened it turns out that it's a hot topic, as can be seen by the number of reactions within a period of time, you can bet that within too short temperament gets high and people become personal. I really don't see why free opinions on such a subject as an M6D can make people so fanatic, as if we are talking about genocide or so. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ynp Posted January 31, 2014 Share #173 Posted January 31, 2014 A Leica wrist watch with a screen for the histogram and other info can be an interesting product to supplement the M6D-wifi. Then it will open a way for Leica to manufacture a lot of Hermes and other limited editions of such a watch. :-) Sent from my iPad / Tapatalk HD Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
earleygallery Posted January 31, 2014 Share #174 Posted January 31, 2014 Various rumors have been coming out of Leica about a smaller interchangeable lens camera, and Leica has said it will not come out with another lens series... So nothing is impossible. I understand they are reviving the Leica Thread Mount for the new camera - which is also why it's code named the 'T' (for Thread). You heard it here first. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
M9reno Posted February 1, 2014 Share #175 Posted February 1, 2014 James, that would be awesome. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjh Posted February 1, 2014 Share #176 Posted February 1, 2014 As a Monochrom owner, I would not be so bold with such statements. What has the Monochrom got to do with it? First time I heard about Leica thinking about a monochrome M was in 2006, whereas I am not aware of any plans for a ‘digital M6’. Various rumors have been coming out of Leica about a smaller interchangeable lens camera This is past the rumor stage by now. That Leica is indeed working on such a system has been confirmed by the CEO. Leica has said it will not come out with another lens series... Actually this has since been disconfirmed by Alfred Schopf. There will be a new lens series. This has no bearing on the future of the M system, though. I am fully aware of what ND agreements he operates. I would never try to mislead people about Leica’s plans (which I only know a tiny part of anyway). When I say I believe that Leica will or won’t do something or other, that is to the best of my knowledge – which doesn’t necessarily imply inside knowledge; as I have explained before, confidential information isn’t spread indiscriminately, but on a need-to-know basis. If I couldn’t confirm or disconfirm some idea without violating an actual or (most often) tacit NDA I will simply remain silent. Although sometimes I will stress some publicly accessible info pointing in the right direction. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pgk Posted February 1, 2014 Share #177 Posted February 1, 2014 I have to admit that the camera + smartphone 'controller' idea has little appeal to me. The whole idea of this intrigues me. So Leica produce an 'M6-like' camera, true to the traditions of the Leica M, small, compact hand-holdable, etc., etc. And then a 'phone is added in - presumably either held in the hand not holding the camera or attached to the camera via a bracket? I nearly agree, except that the idea has NO appeal to me ..... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlanJW Posted February 1, 2014 Share #178 Posted February 1, 2014 . This is infantile and dishonest representation of a position ....... Another, a childish ignorance of nuances. IMHO comments like this are an inappropriate personal attack that reflect poorly on the author. You can state your position on the merits without demeaning the character of your opponent. When I was an attorney and other lawyers engaged in this kind of attack, not only were they admonished by the Judge, it was often because they stood on shaky ground on the merits. Just my two cents. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jankap Posted February 1, 2014 Share #179 Posted February 1, 2014 The whole idea of this intrigues me. So Leica produce an 'M6-like' camera, true to the traditions of the Leica M, small, compact hand-holdable, etc., etc. And then a 'phone is added in - presumably either held in the hand not holding the camera or attached to the camera via a bracket? I nearly agree, except that the idea has NO appeal to me ..... Look at this: Sony Alpha 7 Review: Digital Photography Review Could be useful, I think. I am not a fan of scn-modes (Panaleicas), to make clear. Jan Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pgk Posted February 1, 2014 Share #180 Posted February 1, 2014 To me the whole point of an M type camera is its size and simplicity - which is where, to some extent this thread started (I think, albeit with perhaps an over enthusiastic zeal, from my viewpoint anyway). I try to minimise accessories and I see no need to remove the lcd from the rear of the camera which is IMHO the most logical place to have it. But start adding in 'phones and other bits and pieces and this seems somewhat self-defeating in that it complicates what actually might benefit from simplification. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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