rosuna Posted December 10, 2013 Share #161 Posted December 10, 2013 Advertisement (gone after registration) I guess the most accurate market test we have is the comparison of numbers of M8 cameras sold (APS-H crop) against M9 cameras (full frame). How many M8.2 were sold after the M9 presentation? A new APS system has no interest to M users, and even less after the Sonys FF are in the market. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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lct Posted December 10, 2013 Share #162 Posted December 10, 2013 Don't count me in my friend. I bought my M8.2 is 2011 and i have no interest in the Sonys so far. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
IkarusJohn Posted December 10, 2013 Share #163 Posted December 10, 2013 How many M8.2 were sold after the M9 presentation? A new APS system has no interest to M users, and even less after the Sonys FF are in the market. Sounds about right to me. Bugger-all M8 interest after the M9 was (suddenly) announced. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
IkarusJohn Posted December 10, 2013 Share #164 Posted December 10, 2013 Don't count me in my friend. I bought my M8.2 is 2011 and i have no interest in the Sonys so far. I think that speaks volumes. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lct Posted December 10, 2013 Share #165 Posted December 10, 2013 Not sure what you mean but you must be right. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rosuna Posted December 10, 2013 Share #166 Posted December 10, 2013 Sounds about right to me. Bugger-all M8 interest after the M9 was (suddenly) announced. A different thing is the interest on the new APSC system by himself, not for using M lenses on it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuny Posted December 10, 2013 Share #167 Posted December 10, 2013 Advertisement (gone after registration) Never forget that Leica's announced business plans called for a much greater market share (much greater in terms of Leica, not in terms of the Big 3). A piece of that plan is the investment from Blackrock, an organization known not to throw money around haphazardly. It seems logical that Leica intends to maintain their traditional market while expanding into new markets -- And by "markets" I mean buyers, not countries. That suggests products for other camera buyers while leveraging the brand name. A number of you suggested a high-end gift sold in Leica Boutiques in wealthy cities. I suspect that is at least part of the grand plan, and an APS-C system for wealthy buyers not as perfectionist crazed as we are as the targets of that and other new products. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lct Posted December 10, 2013 Share #168 Posted December 10, 2013 ...I suspect that is at least part of the grand plan, and an APS-C system for wealthy buyers not as perfectionist crazed as we are as the targets of that and other new products. You mean « more perfectionist crazed than we are » i guess. No vignetting, color shifts or smeared corners with APS. Full frame is the realm of compromise as far as digital Ms are confirmed. Give me an M8-3 with the same shutter noise and the same dynamic range as the M240 and i could well use it more often than the latter if Leica made a couple of tiny wides for APS. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rosuna Posted December 10, 2013 Share #169 Posted December 10, 2013 New sensors in the near future will improve the image quality of the M system. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlanG Posted December 10, 2013 Share #170 Posted December 10, 2013 Don't count me in my friend. I bought my M8.2 is 2011 and i have no interest in the Sonys so far. So are you also using an APS system camera now? If so, what is wrong with it for your needs? I'm not counting the M8 as it is APS-H, and the body is from a full frame design and the lenses are for full frame. That camera would have been full frame from the start if the technology were available at the time. If you are happy with the discontinued M8 and haven't bought any of the smaller mirrorless cameras or full frame models, then what do you want to see Leica do for you or others and why? I see the market as flooded with great cameras and lenses. Leica won't be making an APS-(C or H) M mount rangefinder manual focusing system, I'll bet on that. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lct Posted December 10, 2013 Share #171 Posted December 10, 2013 Bunch of questions indeed! I have big to medium sized FF, APS-H and APS-C already but i would like a smaller outfit fitting both my M lenses and a couple of small wides or zooms faster than f/4. Silent shutter noise. No 4/3 or m4/3. A Ricoh GXR on steroids sort of. I said this to Mr Leica and he told me OK lct i'll do it for you, so i'm just waiting and discussing on the LUF in the meantime. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlanG Posted December 10, 2013 Share #172 Posted December 10, 2013 Bunch of questions indeed! I have big to medium sized FF, APS-H and APS-C already but i would like a smaller outfit fitting both my M lenses and a couple of small wides or zooms faster than f/4. Silent shutter noise. No 4/3 or m4/3. A Ricoh GXR on steroids sort of. I said this to Mr Leica and he told me OK lct i'll do it for you, so i'm just waiting and discussing on the LUF in the meantime. OK. Leica surprised everyone by going to a larger system with the S2. So I am hoping this will be their model for a new digital system. This will double their lens sales. It certainly will have no competition in the marketplace. They bought Sinar for a reason. Maybe they will be smart to move away from all of the small stuff. Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/216719-ceo-alfred-schopf-and-future-products/?do=findComment&comment=2484465'>More sharing options...
lct Posted December 10, 2013 Share #173 Posted December 10, 2013 You're reading my mind like an open book. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
40mm f/2 Posted December 10, 2013 Share #174 Posted December 10, 2013 New sensors in the near future will improve the image quality of the M system. Present sensor technology is limiting the incidence angle even/especially with micro lens offset. Organic sensor technology should allow much wider range of incidence angles and would therefore improve the use of wide-angle lens performance and should also increase dynamic range & low light performance. Sony and Fuji/Panasonic have announced such sensors for the future but I have not seen anything to specify the timeframe. So I am presently quite reluctant to invest in any new camera (e.g. Sony A7r) hoping that new sensor technology pans out. Leica may be able to use it Panasonic connections to access this technology? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
algrove Posted December 11, 2013 Share #175 Posted December 11, 2013 62 x 37mm vs 52 x 34mm for the Summarit 35/2.5, which is not bad at all, but the Zeiss 55 is bigger than the Summarit 90 (64 x 71mm vs 55 x 67mm). There is no free lunch. Keep in mind the FE 35 Zeiss IS an auto focus lens even at that size for the a7r. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lct Posted December 11, 2013 Share #176 Posted December 11, 2013 I know this my friend and it is the reason why full frame AF lenses cannot be small a la Leica M. Either they are APS or they are bigger a la Sony A7, there is no free lunch. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
onceuponatime Posted December 11, 2013 Share #177 Posted December 11, 2013 Plenty of new Cameras coming in J-February: NEX-7 successor, low end OMD, GH4, Fujica ST, Leica FF and Samsung NF1 | Mirrorless Rumors Leica: Leica will launch a new mirrorless system with EVF and AF lenses. Primes will be designed and fabricated in Germany. The zooms are made by Panasonic in Japan. The camera should cost close to $2000 and have a bigger than ASP-C sensor (FF or less big). 1.3x crop? that would be more than fine. As a sidenote : "Samsung: Samsung will launch a new NF1. No specs are given yet but the "F" suggests that this could be the first FF camera?" This is the one that looks like a digital M copycat (Not rangefinder) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
algrove Posted December 11, 2013 Share #178 Posted December 11, 2013 I know this my friend and it is the reason why full frame AF lenses cannot be small a la Leica M. Either they are APS or they are bigger a la Sony A7, there is no free lunch. Guess I'll just get another M as a backup and/or use for R lenses. Just hate to spent the funds for that use. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted December 11, 2013 Share #179 Posted December 11, 2013 Plenty of new Cameras coming in J-February: NEX-7 successor, low end OMD, GH4, Fujica ST, Leica FF and Samsung NF1 | Mirrorless Rumors Leica: Leica will launch a new mirrorless system with EVF and AF lenses. Primes will be designed and fabricated in Germany. The zooms are made by Panasonic in Japan. The camera should cost close to $2000 and have a bigger than ASP-C sensor (FF or less big). 1.3x crop? that would be more than fine. As a sidenote : "Samsung: Samsung will launch a new NF1. No specs are given yet but the "F" suggests that this could be the first FF camera?" This is the one that looks like a digital M copycat (Not rangefinder) With the DMR and M8, APS-H (1.3x) is a bit of a "Leica format" Although it was introduced by Canon. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff S Posted December 11, 2013 Share #180 Posted December 11, 2013 Guess I'll just get another M as a backup... Back to 3? Hard to keep track. Jeff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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