lct Posted July 27, 2013 Share #221 Posted July 27, 2013 Advertisement (gone after registration) Aside from Olaf's statemente, the central veiling flare (CVF) is a special issue reported on one lens only AFAIK, the Summicron 50/2 asph. I don't know if Olaf owns a Summicron 75/2 actually but it would be certainly useful to support his statements by some pictures on the LUF. I have not my 75/2 with me here so i cannot be of any help for that. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted July 27, 2013 Posted July 27, 2013 Hi lct, Take a look here APO Summicron 50/2 ASPH: Central veiling flare / fogging. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
jankap Posted July 27, 2013 Share #222 Posted July 27, 2013 I changed my mind. I do not believe that the flare posted here by other members is sensor flare. Any flare that is from the sensor (reflection) will have to be geometrically upside-down and reversed and its ray has to pass through the center of the photograph. Anything else is just flare. On the other hand that would explain, why CVF is worse with smaller apertures (f/16). The light could be reflected by the backside of the iris or by lens surfaces ev. several times. The other cause - something from outside the ray trace - could be fought with a lens hood effectively. An error in the design of the lens would show up in bad MTF curves. Jan Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
01af Posted July 27, 2013 Share #223 Posted July 27, 2013 Aside from Olaf's statement, the central veiling flare (CVF) is a special issue reported on one lens only AFAIK, the Apo-Summicron-M 50/2 Asph. It has been reported on the Apo-Summicron-M 75 mm Asph as well, by several users, and on the the Summicron-M 28/2 Asph, by me. I don't know if Olaf owns an Apo-Summicron-M 75/2 Asph actually ... I do. ... it would be certainly useful to support his statements by some pictures on the LUF. This has been done years ago in the German-language part of this forum—see here. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick Posted July 27, 2013 Share #224 Posted July 27, 2013 I was able to duplicate the flare from my Vernazza post 183 using the same 28/2 and shooting my window. I know think I know what it was. It wasn't the lens' fault or some strange aberration of the laws of physics that took place for those 5 pictures I shot in Vernazza. Don't get frustrated with me, at least I'm trying to be open minded here. First take a look: Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/208297-apo-summicron-502-asph-central-veiling-flare-fogging/?do=findComment&comment=2383690'>More sharing options...
Rick Posted July 27, 2013 Share #225 Posted July 27, 2013 That is a breath on the rear element. I think Steve was right after all. Although, it was sizzling hot and not a humid day, we had been walking around half the day and I remember switching lenses. I carry extra lenses in the cargo pockets of my shorts. That is where the condensation came from and that is why after removing the lens and inspecting it the next set of pictures where fine. At least this makes more sense. This may also be why I have seen this randomly on most all of my lenses. You just can't take anything posted here at face value, can you? Does this all sound like a more reasonable explanation? Now, I'll place the lenses in baggies before I put them in my sweaty pants pocket... they didn't seem sweaty to me. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lct Posted July 27, 2013 Share #226 Posted July 27, 2013 It has been reported on the Apo-Summicron-M 75 mm Asph as well, by several users, ... in the German-language part of this forum—see here. I don't read German unfortunately but my understanding, from Google's translation, is that all samples of the 75/2 don't suffer from CVF and that this behavior is considered unusual by Leica. Thanks for sharing anyway. Leica User Forum - Einzelnen Beitrag anzeigen - Apo-Summicron-M 75 Asph an M9 unbrauchbar? Leica User Forum - Einzelnen Beitrag anzeigen - Apo-Summicron-M 75 Asph an M9 unbrauchbar? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
algrove Posted July 27, 2013 Share #227 Posted July 27, 2013 Advertisement (gone after registration) I carry extra lenses in the cargo pockets of my shorts. That is where the condensation came from and that is why after removing the lens and inspecting it the next set of pictures where fine. At least this makes more sense. This may also be why I have seen this randomly on most all of my lenses. You just can't take anything posted here at face value, can you? Does this all sound like a more reasonable explanation? Now, I'll place the lenses in baggies before I put them in my sweaty pants pocket... they didn't seem sweaty to me. Rick you might try the small Zing neoprene bags for M lenses. They protect a bit and let the lens "breathe" it seems. An idea anyway. So far I have not hyperventilated while changing lenses, but the next conductress could change all that. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick Posted July 27, 2013 Share #228 Posted July 27, 2013 Rick you might try the small Zing neoprene bags for M lenses. They protect a bit and let the lens "breathe" it seems. An idea anyway. So far I have not hyperventilated while changing lenses, but the next conductress could change all that. Just googled that. Those are perfect. I have one like that from a Nikon lens and like it also for the reason that I get tired of the focus tab banging against my leg all day long. The neoprene adds some padding - probably good for both my leg and the lens. Thanks. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
01af Posted July 27, 2013 Share #229 Posted July 27, 2013 Does this all sound like a more reasonable explanation? Yes, definitely. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
semi-ambivalent Posted July 27, 2013 Share #230 Posted July 27, 2013 ...You just can't take anything posted here at face value, can you?... Rick, You can't take anything anywhere at face value; that's why they have Science. Good work, s-a Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick Posted July 28, 2013 Share #231 Posted July 28, 2013 Rick, You can't take anything anywhere at face value; that's why they have Science. Good work, s-a Around here there often exists a lot of belief-based-science mixed in. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkP Posted July 28, 2013 Share #232 Posted July 28, 2013 "belief-based-science" Too funny ! That's going to be my expression of the month. ps. don't worry, I'll reference you appropriately . Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Branch Posted July 28, 2013 Share #233 Posted July 28, 2013 Ok, first off, here is the first time I saw this central veiling flare. It was in 2011 with my 28mm Summicron at f5.6 on the M9. Common knowledge was that this lens is one of the most flare resistant lenses. This is the image I discussed in post 171. Is this what we are talking about? Pretty bad, huh? [ATTACH]389344[/ATTACH] I've had quite a few images taken with the 28mm Summicron Asph which show exactly the same type of "flare". In every case I was able to explain it as being caused by a bright light source just outside the field of view. It seemed to be more prevalent on my M8 when the lens had an IR/UV filter attached. I got used to being careful whenever this was a possibility particularly as I once had to re-shoot some pictures I had been asked to take for a neighbour of the interior of their house. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill W Posted July 29, 2013 Share #234 Posted July 29, 2013 Around here there often exists a lot of belief-based-science mixed in. Isnt everything you read on the internet true. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff S Posted August 12, 2013 Share #235 Posted August 12, 2013 Puts responds to flare concerns with APO Summicron 50 (and other lenses) in this recent post. In other words, he stands by his earlier review, and doesn't think much about internet posts to the contrary, particularly not as a general characteristic. Jeff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpk Posted August 25, 2013 Share #236 Posted August 25, 2013 Today I experienced central flare with my Apo 50 - see attached picture. Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/208297-apo-summicron-502-asph-central-veiling-flare-fogging/?do=findComment&comment=2404994'>More sharing options...
otto.f Posted August 25, 2013 Share #237 Posted August 25, 2013 I can induce a veiling flare quite easily on the 50 APO by taking a picture in the direction of the sun, with the sun roughly 20 degrees above top frame of the photo. It is bothersome and I do wish Leica had included a longer hood, even at some cost to the design aesthetic. On the other hand, other Leica 50s I have used have the same problem to varying degrees, and in all other respects, this lens is spectacular. IMHO and experience, 50's are relatiively more prone to flare than other angles. This is why I think Leica should never have abandoned the beautiful separate hood that came before the last Summicron 50. It would have been perfect if the APO would have been delivered with a separate screw-hood for special light situations, alongside the built-in hood which will do for most situations. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lct Posted August 25, 2013 Share #238 Posted August 25, 2013 CVF may occur when light sources are far off the frame though... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim.grover Posted August 28, 2013 Share #239 Posted August 28, 2013 Hello...a happy ending! So....some of you may recall me posting images in July (page 5 of this thread)...which showed central flaring as I stopped down (leading to various of you trying similar stopping down approaches around the world!). Well...my story has a happy ending...! When I returned to London I sent (via my dealer) the lens back to Solms (as some of you had also suggested)...but then separately, and unsolicited, I received the following e-mail from Solms: Dear Mr Grover I have read in the Leica User Forum about your problems with central flare with your Apo-Summicron-M 1:2/50mm ASPH. As a matter of course we want to prevent that this effect occurs at any aperture. My I ask you give me some details about what has happened about that before? You reported that it had been at Leica for repair. Can you please tell me when and where? Nevertheless we would like to see the lens again to find out what is causing the problem. Would it be OK for you if we arrange an exchange for a certain time? Thank you very much for your support, Best Regards, Jesko v. Oeynhausen This was followed shortly after with this: Dear Jim I would like to give you an update on your lens. We can reproduce the effect and we would like to replace your lens against a new one, if this is OK for you. Unfortunately the supply chain is interrupted at this moment, so it will take some more days to find a replacement lens. Is that OK for you? All the best, -- Jesko v. Oeynhausen And then, sure enough, a few days later a replacement new lens appeared...and I am happy to report that it is perfect...a delight...and as gorgeous as promised! So in my case just a faulty lens that Leica were quick to rectify. So my sincere thanks to Jesko for caring, for reaching out to me, for fixing the problem, and making it all effortless for me. Many thanks to all of you who contributed to this thread..I read them all as I waited to see how my own story would end! Best Jim Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill W Posted August 28, 2013 Share #240 Posted August 28, 2013 Very nice that Leica was proactive. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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