marknorton Posted June 11, 2013 Share #1641 Posted June 11, 2013 Advertisement (gone after registration) I have no idea what Dr. Rohde looks like, but I always have this image of a trim German fellow in his late forties or early fifties, with stylish steel-framed glasses and a navy blue sailing jacket, and a brassed MP close at hand. It must be quite a lot of fun to be privy to Leica prototypes and preproduction models! You can google him - he's a respected authority in the field of radio communications and is associated with Rohde & Schwartz who make electronic test equipment. As for the accuracy of your imaginings of him, I couldn't possibly comment! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted June 11, 2013 Posted June 11, 2013 Hi marknorton, Take a look here Mini M? [MERGED] AKA X-Vario. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
marknorton Posted June 11, 2013 Share #1642 Posted June 11, 2013 Do we know where the Leica X Vario is being produced? Impossible to say for sure and Leica tend to be quite vague about these things but they have recently expanded their capacity in Portugal and I expect the bulk of the assembly work is done there with just enough being done in Germany - maybe not even in Solms - to justify the "Made in Germany" label. Of course, parts will come from all over so it's slightly academic. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ruhayat Posted June 11, 2013 Share #1643 Posted June 11, 2013 I've been looking at the V-Lux 4 for travel and when this was announced it piqued my interest. Now that I see what it is, I still like the concept - APS-C compact with a zoom. Too bad that zoom is a Vario Elmar. It would still work for most of my travel photography - I take photos mostly during the day, anyway - but now the V-Lux 4 looks better as a package. I don't expect them to squeeze a delicious update of my Digilux 2 in there, but if it had just been an Elmarit, this would have been almost perfect for me (well, no built-in VF... my eyes are getting to the stage where I can't focus on the LCD anymore). I think Leica missed a real chance here. If they had come out with a Tri-Elmarit Mini M instead, with stepped 28-35-50 or 75 constant f2.8 lens with no zooms in between... now THAT would have been something even my bank manager would not be able to stop me from. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ruhayat Posted June 11, 2013 Share #1644 Posted June 11, 2013 So what’s wrong with this approach? Simply that the decision to dedicate such a significant proportion of Leica’s resources to opening Leica stores in fashion areas around the world, and to stock them with Leica fashion cameras, does not bode well for the future direction of the company for those who value optical performance and IQ above all else. I have to disagree here with you, Stephen. By having luxury products does not mean Leica's focus on the best optical performance and IQ will suffer. Rather, I see having the luxury goods to sell as being a prerequisite, almost, of making THE best optics they can. Freed from the bottomline, they can now come out with lenses that otherwise would be far too costly to produce if they were funded solely through the sale of such lenses alone. I know many scientific companies who license patents for trivial consumer goods to fund their scientific research. If they depended on their R&D alone to cover the cost of operations, they would probably need Government grants every month, let alone every year. I am reminded of Al Pacino. When asked why he is seen as squandering his talents in bad blockbuster movies, he says the (much) bigger paycheques allow him to indulge in the one or two "indie", art movies. "Take the big jobs so that you can afford to act in the quality stuff," so to speak. Therefore, I bear Leica no grudge for going down this route. As long as they continue churning out quality optics, of course. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dkCambridgeshire Posted June 11, 2013 Share #1645 Posted June 11, 2013 Leica have not not done anything wrong in designing this camera. They have used a Leica zoom lens which is neither too big nor too small for the camera. Lens speed is not so important in the digital age now that high ISO performance is generally more than acceptably good. We could not reasonably expect to have a fast zoom on a such small camera; ergonomically it is probably fine and anything bigger and heavier would probably make it front heavy. The mass hysteria generated by Leica's initial and subsequent hints says more about forum members' over-expectations than any of Leica's alleged shortcomings. Consider how much a 100% Leica zoom lens might cost by itself - or a Leica prime lens for that matter - and then consider whether the new package is in fact the disappointment that many have so far intimated. Wait for some proper reviews including more sample photo files before condemning the wee beastie. dunk Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonoslack Posted June 11, 2013 Share #1646 Posted June 11, 2013 So the spec is out now, I'm not up on small autofocus cameras, but f6.4 is not exciting and this is a very competitive arena. It's amazing how many people have said that it's competitive . . . . but actually there are no other APS-c fixed zoom cameras on the market, and there was only one in the past (Sony R1). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
earleygallery Posted June 11, 2013 Share #1647 Posted June 11, 2013 Advertisement (gone after registration) I had another thought about the X Vario. Some here are upset at Leica for putting resources into launching a new camera when they're still waiting for their new M's to be delivered. As we know, Leica have a significant investor and however 'hands off' Leica may claim them to be, I'm sure that there are certain milestones in their contract, with regards to market penetration, targets which Leica are bound by contract to meet. The X Vario will sell, there's no doubt about that. It will also sell to new/new customers IMHO, thus increasing Leica's market share to take them towards their lofty 1% target. This camera is a quick win for them. Launching a variation of an existing product is relatively risk free, lower cost and achievable in a shorter time frame than developing a new line. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dwbell Posted June 11, 2013 Share #1648 Posted June 11, 2013 It's amazing how many people have said that it's competitive . . . . but actually there are no other APS-c fixed zoom cameras on the market, and there was only one in the past (Sony R1). Is that not just a semantic distinction though Jono? In so far as there are other 'better' interchangeable lens APS-C cameras where one could leave a zoom lens on, thus creating a semi-fixed zoom camera? And if so does the semi-fixed (ie interchangeable) not have the advantage of being, you know, interchangeable? My APS-C camera knowledge is limited. (edit - wasn' the R1 launched in 2006? And had a quicker lens?) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
stunsworth Posted June 11, 2013 Share #1649 Posted June 11, 2013 And the purpose being ? It's for people who like the X2 but would prefer a zoom lens? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lct Posted June 11, 2013 Share #1650 Posted June 11, 2013 Yes and who don't have to ask the price perhaps. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dkCambridgeshire Posted June 11, 2013 Share #1651 Posted June 11, 2013 Yes and who don't have to ask the price perhaps. For many Leica enthusiasts, IQ is more important than price. Anyone who finds that they cannot afford the camera but really want one will probably make sacrifices, accept that quality costs £€$ and will buy it. dunk Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
earleygallery Posted June 11, 2013 Share #1652 Posted June 11, 2013 Yes and who don't have to ask the price perhaps. Do Leica customers generally buy on price? The PanaLeicas are proof enough that people are willing to pay more for the Leica name. The X Vario is no less competitive than the X1/2 which are both underwhelming cameras but sell well enough. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dkCambridgeshire Posted June 11, 2013 Share #1653 Posted June 11, 2013 Do Leica customers generally buy on price? The PanaLeicas are proof enough that people are willing to pay more for the Leica name. The X Vario is no less competitive than the X1/2 which are both underwhelming cameras but sell well enough. You missed off 'imho' ... ... my X1 is fabulous ... a superb instrument. ... and Lightroom needs factoring into the cost equation too. dunk Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
iforum Posted June 11, 2013 Share #1654 Posted June 11, 2013 No, this camera is aimed squarely at people who want to set the camera on “P for Program” and click away. f2.8 is still very handy in "P" mode makes their shooting easier as for the X1 atleast it is f2.8 all be a bit slow in the focus game Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
onceuponatime Posted June 11, 2013 Share #1655 Posted June 11, 2013 It's amazing how many people have said that it's competitive . . . . but actually there are no other APS-c fixed zoom cameras on the market, and there was only one in the past (Sony R1). R1 24-120mm f2.8-4.8 $999. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
250swb Posted June 11, 2013 Share #1656 Posted June 11, 2013 For many Leica enthusiasts, IQ is more important than price. Anyone who finds that they cannot afford the camera but really want one will probably make sacrifices, accept that quality costs £€$ and will buy it. dunk If IQ is most important what are they buying a zoom lens for? And a slow one at that, on a camera with no image stabilisation? People put too much weight on the APS-C sensor size and forget that the whole package needs to be geared towards quality. Although a smaller sensor the quality of the Sony sensor in the latest Olympus m43's isn't so far off, and the primes available will more than make up for that by their quality compared with a zoom lens. In terms of overall package size and eventual image quality (with all the factors taken into consideration) why would anybody wanting IQ buy the mini-M? Steve Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lct Posted June 11, 2013 Share #1657 Posted June 11, 2013 Do Leica customers generally buy on price? ... I should have put two smileys Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paolo.Battista Posted June 11, 2013 Share #1658 Posted June 11, 2013 Again a money issue? No, any money issue here. My observation was simply about the targeted customer. The Lunar is clearly targeted at the typical actual Hermes customer, who buys that product based on the exclusivity created by the price. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
NZDavid Posted June 11, 2013 Share #1659 Posted June 11, 2013 I still can't find an official announcement on the Leica site. Time/date in GMT would have been helpful. Nearly June 12 here. Ah well, time to hit the sack and I'll check in tomorrow. No surprises anyway. I'm happy with the M9 and D-Lux 5 for digital, and the film Ms. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dkCambridgeshire Posted June 11, 2013 Share #1660 Posted June 11, 2013 A well known Austrian Leica Premier dealer is listing the MINI M at €2445 ... but no other details or photos. Thus £ price could be c. £2000 which is c. £500 premium above the cost of an X2 ... price seems to be within expectation considering the zoom lens. dunk Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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