From M240 back to the essential (M8)

[satijntje]

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Just a little story of my purchases of Leica gear that ended up to a value of more then 11.000 Euro.

 

In 2009 I had bought my first Leica M8 with a new 35mm Summarit. Coming from an DSLR, the rangefinder field was new for me but the pictures I took those days were satisfactory for me (mainly B/W).

 

Moved soon to the M9 as it was very difficult those days to get one.

I paid 5400 Euro for a new M9 that was on stock by coincidence at my local dealer.

 

After saying goodbye to Leica for some time, I had a Canon 5DMII, an 1DMIII, NEX7, I came back to LEICA again in 2012 and bought a very nice looking M8u from a dutch guy (also here in the forum).

But the upgrade to an M9 did not take a long time, and I bought in December 2012 a real nice M9 from a German forum member from Solms. Stunning pics of course, I was happy, and bought several lenses, but ended up with a 50mm ASPH Lux.

 

Shortly after I bought a 90mm elmarit that I mainly used to shoot people/portraits.

 

 

So far so good, but in 2013 the M240 came on the street.

I had a unique possibility to buy a M240 already in March 2013 from a guy that probably had a disagreement with his wife about this purchase.

 

M240, nice, and good for my eyes to use the VF + LV.

 

Next purchase was a Vario Elmarit R 80-200 that I found at the Fotobörse in Solms. So my problem that I missed the zooms from my DSLR period were solved.

Yippieee I was able to use a real zoom lens on my M!

 

 

So far so good.......

 

A few days ago when I walked around with my gear, I realized that I was carrying stuff with a price ticket over 11.000 Euro. Yes, it is insured, so thats not the problem, but for me as a amateur that uses his camera only a few days per month I could not balance anymore the value of my gear and the use of it.

 

Please understand me correctly, I'm not criticizing the pricing of Leica, but myself, who came in the Leica rush and to buy more and better (and more expensive)

 

I read forums quite a lot, and buy often what people recommended.

Just get the perfect gear.....(GAS syndrome)

 

But the perfect gear does not exist, its the photographer that determines mainly the quality of his pics and the PP work afterwards.

 

I have seen foto's from Ming Thein, done with pocket cameras that are fantastic, as he knows PP extremely well.

 

So, coming back to my walk, I was more or less shocked, to end up with a gear collection of more then 11.000 Euro value.

 

Just by coincidence, a piece of land came available this week that I can buy now, and add it to my garden.

 

So finally I have decided to do the following:

 

Sell my Leica stuff, the M240 is already sold, just waiting for the money to arrive.

Sell my lenses,

 

and

 

stay with Leica but on a much more lower level.

 

I intend to buy a 1000 Euro Leica M8, and use it as the poor mans monochrome.

As lens I will probably end up with a 40mm Summicron that can be found below 400 Euro.

 

So, I will "fall back" from my 11000 Euro equipment to a gear set that will be around 1400 Euro.

 

It is fantastic that Leica gear, especially the lenses keep their value, so I expect that my losses are kept to a minimum, maybe I can make a zero out of it.

 

So the essential issue of my story that I have written here is that I want to go back to the gear what I really need to have fun.

At this moment (it might change of course ) it is a M8 with ONE small Leica lens.

That's it, so more!

 

I would be interested to hear from you if you have had similar cases either yourself of from your friends that changed the way I do right now.

 

Thanks for reading and kind regards

 

John

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[hepcat]

John, your points are valid and well reasoned. . I have about $10k USD in Leica equipment, but that's an M4-P, an M8, an M9P, eight lenses and a Visoflex. I bought all of it used, and only three of the lenses are Leitz lenses and all of those from the late 1960s vintage. The M9P cost was half of that $10k.

 

I wouldn't have but probably the M8 body and three lenses if I weren't using the entire kit as a working pro.

 

Sometimes a reality check is just what you need. Gear doesn't make the photos.

[timd.]

honestly john, seeing the line of cameras you had within the last five years, not counting the white m8, i think you will not be sticking to your m8-only-gear for very long. there will be the next m9 (basically a full frame m8, so it will be easy to use with m8-like PP). and if you stick to black&white, there will be the opportunity to get an mm for a good price - not now, but sometime in the future...

 

as we all know, GAS is nothing that's easy to cure and leica makes it even more difficult.

[iedei]

wow you've come full circle!

 

i think the M8 and the 40mm Summicron may be one of THE finest packages one could use made by Leica.....especially for the price. Great choice!

 

I used to have GAS....but got rid of it...by deciding that the quality of photos has to do with ME....not with my gear. So these days i am very happy with the M5 and M8....have no desire to buy anything else....it feels GREAT to be satisfied. Hopefully you enjoy this feeling as well!

 

cheers

[jaapv]

Well, I must admit your story is well-reasoned and rational, and I will not say a single word against it, but in my case I have regretted selling each and every major piece of Leica gear I ever did, and ended up buying most of it back at a considerable financial loss. So I simply stopped doing it.

[Jeff S]

Sorry, but there's nothing rational or logical about GAS; the first step in dealing with an addiction is to recognize that it's a disease. So is hoarding.

 

Jeff

[hamey]

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I know how you feel John.

 

Over the years I must of spent thousands on Leica gear (around 35.000$) I did dispose some as trade in's

 

But still have a large collection. I just love the stuff and hate parting with it.

 

I am going to Japan with the 21-35, 28-90, R9 and the Canon DSLR the whole cost of that gear was

Around 9,500$ still cheaper then the M240 + hand grip, EVF and the R-M adaptor.

 

Walking around with that stuff is bad enough especially the weight, but If I buy the M240 and take that instead of the Canon DSLR it would be close to 20.000$.

 

I am at the age of 64 and in a comfortable financial position, but I am having this guilt about the cost of

Leica Digital gear and walking around with it.

 

Ken.

[Guest rivercityrocker]

If you know what you need and know what you like, stick with it. I've got 10's of thousands of dollars tied up in my Nikon gear, but it's my job.

 

I wanted to get the best Leica I could, which was the M240, but I couldn't justify it as a legitimate expense. I bought the M8 and a few lenses and ended up at around $4000 USD, which is still quite a bit for a camera I use mainly for "art".

 

It sounds like you thought things through very well and I think you'll be happy with your decision.

 

The M8 is far from a perfect camera, which ironically is one of the reasons I have come to adore it. The M8 renders B/W amazingly. The IR capability is a bonus in my eyes.

 

I generally use the UV/IR block filter, but sometimes I take it off and it gives my images an "expired film" look that is impossible to replicate using photoshop/lightroom filters. Here's an example:

 

I believe that knowing what your camera can and can't do is more important than just getting a camera that you think can do everything.

[dpitt]

John, I can agree with you partly. I do not like to carry gear that is too expensive.So, when I was 'obliged' to take Leica's upgrade to M9 because of the coffee stain, I downgraded back to an M8 and sold the brand new M9. Sometime in the future I will buy a nice second hand M9. Mean while I enjoy my M8 and invested the rest of the money in a few lenses.

 

 

For lenses, I am on the same page as Jaap. I have no problem keeping gear that is holding its value. I avoid collector items that are so expensive that I would hesitate to use them, that is all.

[wattsy]

Good story and I agree with the consensus that an M8 and 40/F2 is a very strong combination that doesn't place you at a meaningful disadvantage to what you had before. I'm also with you on the notion of balancing "the value of ... gear and the use of it" and I rather wish I hadn't bought so much Leica gear over the years (it isn't so much the cost of the gear itself that bothers me but the number of lenses and bodies that I have churned through).

[stephen.w]

Hans in Luck - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

[satijntje]

sooo, I found my replacement gear, a nearly mint black M8 with 800 actuations only and a Summicron 40mm, both for very reasonable prices.

 

Bought it from an official Leica dealer and will get a 1 year guarantee.

 

My "expensive" stuff (50mm ASPH Lux, the M240, 90mm Elmarit, 80-200mm Vario Elmar-R) will be advertised soon here in the forum.....

 

Looking forward to use my low budget M. I will feel more comfortable when walking around with this instead of the 11.000 Euro bag:cool:

 

Thanks for the replies in this thread, I really appreciated this.

 

Enjoy your weekend

 

John

[wda]

John, you are a brave man to make such a confession. But, having done so, I think this thread should enjoy a year as a 'sticky', just to inspire and save others who confuse GAS with actual successful photography. Long may you enjoy your M8 + 40. I would be tempted to keep the 90 though, just to have a nice balanced 2-lens practical travel kit.

[Ecaton]

There is a difference between costly and expensive gear. The capital tight up in a Leica M and lenses can be significant (cost). It is, however, not expensive as a system since the Leica lenses keep their value or even appreciate, easily compensating for the depreciation of the digital body. My excessive buying, trying and selling of other systems over the last couple of years (mft, NEX, Fuji) was definitely eating much more capital than my Leica M and lenses as all this stuff was sold at significant losses (expensive). Concerning guilt when walking around with costly Leica gear, how about the price of your wrist watch?

[satijntje]

There is a difference between costly and expensive gear. The capital tight up in a Leica M and lenses can be significant (cost). It is, however, not expensive as a system since the Leica lenses keep their value or even appreciate, easily compensating for the depreciation of the digital body. My excessive buying, trying and selling of other systems over the last couple of years (mft, NEX, Fuji) was definitely eating much more capital than my Leica M and lenses as all this stuff was sold at significant losses (expensive). Concerning guilt when walking around with costly Leica gear, how about the price of your wrist watch?

 

I have no watch:D:D:D

[Guest rivercityrocker]

I tried a Summicron 40 yesterday and I REALLY liked it. Unfortunately they wouldn't sell it to me without the accompanying CL camera. I found that the 40mm is WAY more accurate for the the 35mm framelines than the 35mm is.

 

I'd like to throw the 40 in the mix, but I have a 28, 35, and 2 50's so a 40 really isn't needed.

[Jeff S]

I found that the 40mm is WAY more accurate for the the 35mm framelines than the 35mm is.

 

Then you obviously didn't use an M8 with upgraded 2m frame lines, or an M8.2 with same. Or maybe you shoot really close distances.

 

Jeff

[desu]

It's a matter of dedication. I love photography and even if I don't make money with it's the hobby I have no spending limits on. When someone says: "Wow 9000€ for a lens? You can get a good car with that money." I think: "15'000€ for a car? I could get several lenses with that money".

 

Sadly as a student I can't afford the newest camera and best lenses, which is why I honestly am envious when users here talk about their M240s, MMs, Noctiluxes, APO-Summicrons and Summiluxes. The M8 is a nice camera. Age doesn't really make the image quality degrade. But I still would wish to have more resolution. 18MP from the M9 would be perfect for me. There are also situations where I wish I had a fast lens and better high iso.

 

Those situations aren't that common and they often have a workaround like using a tripod but it still would be nice. One probably needs to have the best gear first before being able to realize that one doesn't really need it that much.

 

But then again this depends on your shooting style.

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[Guest rivercityrocker]

Then you obviously didn't use an M8 with upgraded 2m frame lines, or an M8.2 with same. Or maybe you shoot really close distances.

 

Jeff

 

Yeah, obviously not. Or maybe I do.

[Jeff S]

So you're not going to disclose? My use of the M8.2 leads to a very different conclusion. YMMV.

 

Jeff