jankap Posted July 30, 2012 Share #41 Posted July 30, 2012 Advertisement (gone after registration) Do Summis, Elmars, etc. fit in a Lomo? Jan Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted July 30, 2012 Posted July 30, 2012 Hi jankap, Take a look here What will the M10 Cost . I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
lct Posted July 30, 2012 Share #42 Posted July 30, 2012 Hardly more curious than comparing a crop cam with no rangefinder to the M9. Apples vs oranges as usual. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ellie Posted July 31, 2012 Share #43 Posted July 31, 2012 It will be interesting to see how Leica will position an eventual M10, it could have expensive features and be $10-12k. Imho, it would make sense for the M10 to be top of the line among several digital cameras in the M-range, they need to have an expensive camera that is not too common to be successful in the new markets. Some say the customers there have for example moved to Bentley and Rolls Royce because BMW 7 and Mercedes S are too common.. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jankap Posted July 31, 2012 Share #44 Posted July 31, 2012 Hardly more curious than comparing a crop cam with no rangefinder to the M9. Apples vs oranges as usual. Imagine, digicams could be coupled electronically. Then, 2 Ricohs would even offer more pixel power than an M9. Still at lower costs, remember 2 lenses. OK, the missing rangefinder would stay as a (double) problem. On the other hand, one would permanently have the so often wished backup camera. Jan Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lct Posted July 31, 2012 Share #45 Posted July 31, 2012 Like a Mini for a Bentley you mean? Just kidding. Bill is not reading me hopefully. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jankap Posted July 31, 2012 Share #46 Posted July 31, 2012 Kidding, brainstorming, entertaining? This thread could have been ended with message #4 of James. Jan Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SJP Posted August 3, 2012 Share #47 Posted August 3, 2012 Advertisement (gone after registration) Kidding, brainstorming, entertaining?This thread could have been ended with message #4 of James. Jan Yep, but we have better things to do. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie Roberts Posted August 3, 2012 Share #48 Posted August 3, 2012 I am personally hoping for a retail price of $6995 US again. That puts it right in with Canon and Nikon's high-end offerings, and leaves room for an M10P, and a more expensive, monochrome only version. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pico Posted August 3, 2012 Share #49 Posted August 3, 2012 [...]I never did understand why Canon had a camera called a "Rebel". I wonder if Pentax still have a trademark for "MX"? Chevrolet bombed in New Mexico with their Nova sedan. What kind of macho man wants a car named No Go? Then there was American Motors. Once while in a que in Oxford the crowd uttered a simultaneous "Whaaaa?" when a new, big-ass car cruised by with its typical, large, gleaming chrome badge: "American". Well, I guess! Thank god the model was the not the American Rebel. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff S Posted August 3, 2012 Share #50 Posted August 3, 2012 Chevrolet bombed in New Mexico with their Nova sedan. What kind of macho man wants a car named No Go? Pico, that was Mexico, and is more legend than fact. Jeff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
algrove Posted August 3, 2012 Share #51 Posted August 3, 2012 I heard Leica's Marketing Department hired a numerologist to determine the "right" price.M10 = 10 grands. But he got overruled by the psychologist who suggested 9,999. Then the new marketing guy said 9,990. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BJDrew Posted August 25, 2012 Share #52 Posted August 25, 2012 We all feel, deep in our hearts that we are looking at $10k or a hair below for the M10. If so, the M system will slip into a slow march of decreasing relevance. Owner elitism will reach new highs. But Leica knows what they are doing... they are known for making good business decisions... right? (M5, Hermes...) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
beewee Posted August 29, 2012 Share #53 Posted August 29, 2012 If Leica sticks with their creative use of dates, numbers, etc... Since "M" is 1000 in Roman numeral, M10 could mean 10,000, though it could also mean 1010 (not likely though) Or treating the 10 as binary, it could mean either 3000 or 1003 If M10 was a series of ASCII characters, it would be 77,49,49 ->7749.49? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
batmobile Posted August 29, 2012 Share #54 Posted August 29, 2012 Presumably you would not want it to be cheaper then? FWIW I also think Leica pricing has become ridiculous and yes of course I would like the M10 to be cheaper than I fear it will be. In the end I probably won't pay it. Leica is pricing itself out of the professional market and, as I have said before, has forged a strategic relationship with Magnum so it can ensure its cameras are used by 'the right people' and who would probably not pay their own cash for one. Yes, top of the line Nikon or Canon cameras are of similar price (actually they are appreciably less at the moment), but the difference is that cheaper bodies (like the D800, 5D III) are available for the back up body and lenses are in a different galaxy. The price of a two body kit with, say, five primes is very different. With the Canon/Nikon kit, the chances are it is in stock and you will get it in a day or two and if you get a dud unit (very rare with bodies, less so with lenses) you can send it back and have another one within the week. Not so with Leica. The pricing of the 50mm APO Summicron is absurd. Even Leica admits the lens was designed ages ago and (so presumably R&D costs are ancient history) and personally I flat out do not believe that it costs more to make this lens than the 35 lux FLE, or that it is comparable to the 21/24 lux. People's attitudes to the 50 APO were very interesting. I totally get people buying one because they want one, but some people were trying to justify their purchase on the basis of 'the performance' and forking out $7k for a measly 50mm f2. After the success of the M9 I had hoped that Leica would step a little bit away from the luxury/boutique pricing structure it had been following to that point, but alas, it seems not. The M9-P was evidence of that. I find it very sad, because as the owner of five film Ms and 9 lenses, it looks like the digital era will be enjoyed under a different brand. No, I cannot afford to spend $18K on two bodies and to then have to do the same in five years. I accept this as a fact of life, but it does seem a shame when I am exactly the sort of photographer who would like to stay with the brand and, arguably, Leica should want to remain associated with it. I can only hope that Leica has drawn a line at $7-8K or that Fuji has what 'people like me' are hoping for in the next year or three. If Leica has called a price halt, I might consider selling some film gear to fund a M10 and using my X100 as the back up. The price is the price. Calling it "outrageous", "astronomical", "ridiculous", or "exorbitant" simply indicates that you would like it to be cheaper. But in the end the price is the price. You will either pay it or you won't. Pete. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
farnz Posted August 29, 2012 Share #55 Posted August 29, 2012 Presumably you would not want it to be cheaper then? .... Cheaper than what? There is no price because it doesn't currently exist. If and when it is released and if I make the decision to purchase one then I'll be happy to pay a reasonable price that helps to keep the company in business but doesn't include an unreasonable profit margin (which will be a subjective valuation at the time). Too low a price might threaten the company's financial stability or ability to provide support, which would be undesirable. Pete. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lct Posted August 29, 2012 Share #56 Posted August 29, 2012 ...The pricing of the 50mm APO Summicron is absurd. Even Leica admits the lens was designed ages ago and (so presumably R&D costs are ancient history)... I know nothing about costs at that level of excellence but would you ask about costs if you wanted to buy a Ferrari car, a Breguet watch or even an Hermes or Vuitton luggage? This lens is the best 50 ever made and will sell like hotcakes to people who can afford it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
batmobile Posted August 29, 2012 Share #57 Posted August 29, 2012 This is a heavily specced 3-series BMW. It might be the best luxury small sedan in the world, exceedingly efficient and refined, but we are talking about a pedestrian 50mm F2! The 0.95 Noct, or 21 lux is a Ferrari... and the 50 APO Cron is not much cheaper.... It is telling that you are comparing it to fashion accessories, which makes my point for me: I'm a bleeding photographer and regard cameras as tools. Its sad that Leica has become all about boutique pricing, because we might as well forget that we are talking about cameras, which are there to do a job. And no, watches are not the same: they have been fashion/image items for a very long time. Not so for cameras. Regarding the other reply, no, the M10 is not yet released, but I am working on the same assumption as most, which is that it will cost more than a M9-P. I hope to be proven wrong, however! I know nothing about costs at that level of excellence but would you ask about costs if you wanted to buy a Ferrari car, a Breguet watch or even an Hermes or Vuitton luggage? This lens is the best 50 ever made and will sell like hotcakes to people who can afford it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pop Posted August 29, 2012 Share #58 Posted August 29, 2012 This is a heavily specced 3-series BMW. It might be the best luxury small sedan in the world, exceedingly efficient and refined, but we are talking about a pedestrian 50mm F2! The 0.95 Noct, or 21 lux is a Ferrari... and the 50 APO Cron is not much cheaper.... The 50mm F2 is a lens for making photographic images as are the Noctilux lenses or the 21mm Summilux. (BTW, there is no such thing as a lux unless you mean the rather little known car by Fiat). The Noctiluxes excel with their light gathering ability as does - presumably - the 21mm Summilux for its focal length. The new 50mm F2 excels with its resolution and absence of aberrations. Why is that "pedestrian"? If you don't care for imaging quality, why waste your time and money with Leica at all? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
batmobile Posted August 29, 2012 Share #59 Posted August 29, 2012 Does abbreviating summilux to 'lux' cause offence enough to cause you to patronise (in brackets)? ... all spoken like a true believer. You are surely aware that image quality is one of the many reasons why a person might shoot a Leica M? To some people, the image quality improvement between a 50 cron and a 50 APO cron is not worth another $5K. For those who just want one, fair enough, but for those who claim it matters to their images, pull the other one. I do care for image quality, but I am astonished that some would claim the improvements in the 50 APO 'important', because they are clearly not, unless your photographic goals are restricted to 'the highest possible resolution'. Another $5k is an awful lot to spend when the real improvement to photographic output is zero. The same cannot be said of the 0.95 Noct because it is the only lens of its kind and, arguably, you could make the point about the entire M line. There is already a bloody good 50 cron and superb 50 lux, which is half the price of the 50 APO cron.... The 50mm F2 is a lens for making photographic images as are the Noctilux lenses or the 21mm Summilux. (BTW, there is no such thing as a lux unless you mean the rather little known car by Fiat). The Noctiluxes excel with their light gathering ability as does - presumably - the 21mm Summilux for its focal length. The new 50mm F2 excels with its resolution and absence of aberrations. Why is that "pedestrian"? If you don't care for imaging quality, why waste your time and money with Leica at all? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted August 29, 2012 Share #60 Posted August 29, 2012 I must confess that these abbreviations always cause a hiccup in my reading as well... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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