EVF M rumoured

[UliWer]

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1 hour ago, Stuart Richardson said:

But what I mean is that the engineering team probably is excited to do really interesting and innovative things and wants to do everything with the best quality, best practices etc, and then the other teams come in and pour a bucket of cold water on it, based on market research, budgets and practicality etc.

When the Leica II was introduced Oskar Barnack wrote a lengthy text in which he promised that all present Leica camera could be upgraded with every future novelties introduced with new models. He really wrote "all" and "every future novelties". Most of his text was used for an official brochure to advertise the new camera - but they "censored" this passage which did not appear in the official text. The original manuscript was only published in 2008 in Kisselbach's book "Barnacks erste Leica". During the times of the M8 Mr. Lee was Leica CEO and he publicly made the same promise with almost identical wordings Barnack had used long before: the M8 could be upgraded with all future novelties. His promise wasn't censored, but Mr. Lee was fired some time later (not alone for this reason).

In both cases the promise wasn't "innovative" and made "to do everything with the best quality, best practices etc." but just unrealistic phantasy.

At the beginning there is an idea to achieve something. Then technicians start to develop something. But soon reality creeps in. If you look at the different digital M models you always find this same pattern. It is not some unknown wisecrack from the marketing department but just simple reality which shows where the limits are. 

Edited May 6 by UliWer

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[DadDadDaddyo]

In theory, there's no difference between theory and practice. 

In practice, there is.

[Derbyshire Man]

4 hours ago, marchyman said:

Nothing to do with an EVF-M, but this comment reminded me that I still use a notebook on the rare occasions I shoot film.  I find a lack of data is better than incorrect data. Incorrect aperture data is probably what  annoys me most about shooting with an M.  That doesn't mean, however, that it annoys me a lot.

When digitizing negatives my solution is to transcribe the info from my notebook into the caption of the digital image.  That and setting the image capture data/time to the noted values so at least the images correctly sort by date.

 

I realise this would cause a meltdown for most here but one thing that my canon cameras often had was a record voice note button. It's potentially quite useful, especially for some forms of photography to be able to record a short story, to save getting out the phone or a recording device. I never used it on the canon's of course but I'm in the process of moving to more project work where it would actually be useful.

[Stuart Richardson]

12 hours ago, Derbyshire Man said:

I realise this would cause a meltdown for most here but one thing that my canon cameras often had was a record voice note button. It's potentially quite useful, especially for some forms of photography to be able to record a short story, to save getting out the phone or a recording device. I never used it on the canon's of course but I'm in the process of moving to more project work where it would actually be useful.

I think the thing with that is that the vast majority of people are now walking around with phones that can do that with a very high quality, organize it effortlessly and send it around the world without even plugging it into a card reader etc. Getting out the phone is probably not any effort if it is always at hand. I just can't see Leica doing any sort of purpose built feature like that.

Edited May 7 by Stuart Richardson

[Derbyshire Man]

42 minutes ago, Stuart Richardson said:

I think the thing with that is that the vast majority of people are now walking around with phones that can do that with a very high quality, organize it effortlessly and send it around the world without even plugging it into a card reader etc. Getting out the phone is probably not any effort if it is always at hand. I just can't see Leica doing any sort of purpose built feature like that.

But it’s yet another thing to get out, fumble with, load the app, speak into it, read out some image number. On the canon it was press a single button and speak, file next to the photo. Especially these days with cameras having linked apps is child’s play to get any linked audio files out and organised. It would be a serious boon for documentary/reportage photography. 

[jaapv]

15 hours ago, Stuart Richardson said:

I think it is quite unlikely that the engineers are the ones making these decisions. I am sure they are deeply involved in informing the executives as to what can be done and what kind of effort/budget, but I would guess the engineers are probably closer to the users' camp than the marketing team.

Leica works with multidisciplinary teams when proposing/designing cameras. The result is normally a consensus which is presented to the decision-making management. 

[ApoVision]

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19 hours ago, marchyman said:

Nothing to do with an EVF-M, but this comment reminded me that I still use a notebook on the rare occasions I shoot film.  I find a lack of data is better than incorrect data. Incorrect aperture data is probably what  annoys me most about shooting with an M.  That doesn't mean, however, that it annoys me a lot.

When digitizing negatives my solution is to transcribe the info from my notebook into the caption of the digital image.  That and setting the image capture data/time to the noted values so at least the images correctly sort by date.

 

Use a Nikon F6, metadata gets printed on the film.

[pgh]

3 hours ago, Derbyshire Man said:

But it’s yet another thing to get out, fumble with, load the app, speak into it, read out some image number. On the canon it was press a single button and speak, file next to the photo. Especially these days with cameras having linked apps is child’s play to get any linked audio files out and organised. It would be a serious boon for documentary/reportage photography. 

This is the type of photography I do, and it is so easy to do this on the phone I imagine it would be more trouble to do it on a camera.

It almost feels like it takes longer to read your explanation of what's involved than to do it in practice - "hey siri, record voice memo" then go. I've never needed it to go next to a single photo, more like a set of photos. It would be more cumbersome to have it attached to one file to be honest.

[didier]

19 hours ago, UliWer said:

the M8 could be upgraded with all future novelties

That would be such an innovation and great perspective if Leica came up with a RF than can be upgraded for, let’s say, 10 years (sensor, …) … I’d love that… just a phantasy…

[Derbyshire Man]

2 hours ago, pgh said:

This is the type of photography I do, and it is so easy to do this on the phone I imagine it would be more trouble to do it on a camera.

It almost feels like it takes longer to read your explanation of what's involved than to do it in practice - "hey siri, record voice memo" then go. I've never needed it to go next to a single photo, more like a set of photos. It would be more cumbersome to have it attached to one file to be honest.

It depends what you’re doing. On the canon it’s press the rating button for 3 seconds and it takes a recording and attaches, perfect for matching a name and email to a portrait. 
 

With the phone, how will I know which email corresponds to which portrait? I suppose if I’m lucky the time stamp will match!

[jdlaing]

51 minutes ago, didier said:

That would be such an innovation and great perspective if Leica came up with a RF than can be upgraded for, let’s say, 10 years (sensor, …) … I’d love that… just a phantasy…

Pixii offers that. Sensor and processor.

[marchyman]

4 hours ago, ApoVision said:

Use a Nikon F6, metadata gets printed on the film.

If only my RB 67 did that... or the F6 was medium format.

[costa43]

Leica are riding on the crest of a popularity wave at the moment. They are trending. In my experience, most businesses in these instances will milk it at this point rather than innovate. I still think it’s just the built in Visoflex, we may be talking about this till September now by the look of things though!

[Stef63]

43 minutes ago, costa43 said:

Leica are riding on the crest of a popularity wave at the moment. They are trending.

I don’t see the spike in interest in Google search stats, but with statistics you can prove a lot 😊

https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?cat=65&q=Leica&hl=en

 

Edited May 7 by Stef63

[costa43]

6 hours ago, Stef63 said:

I don’t see the spike in interest in Google search stats, but with statistics you can prove a lot 😊

https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?cat=65&q=Leica&hl=en

 

They have had a record profit year and the last few years seem to have been kind to them as a brand. Lots of exposure on social media, which of course does not automatically translate to sales but that’s the feeling I have. 

[robb]

So with the release of the m11-p safari today, I am guessing evf is pushed back to later in year or 2026… hmm

Robb

[hdmesa]

16 minutes ago, robb said:

So with the release of the m11-p safari today, I am guessing evf is pushed back to later in year or 2026… hmm

Robb

 

 

I'd bet they will release the M11-V in 2026 not long before the M12 w/rangefinder is released. They'll probably make both of them at the same time for a few years, waiting to release the M12-V until the M12 is near the end of its run.

[FrozenInTime]

9 minutes ago, hdmesa said:

 

 

I'd bet they will release the M11-V in 2026 not long before the M12 w/rangefinder is released. They'll probably make both of them at the same time for a few years, waiting to release the M12-V until the M12 is near the end of its run.

Not a fan of the 60 Mpixel sensor, so hope for a new platform generation with co-developed cameras; M12 and M12-V.

With the new compact Noctilux rumor looking more like a 40 or 43mm than a 35mm, does that imply new frame lines for the optical rangefinder cameras; I wonder if the M6, M-A and MP will also get updates to their mask set.
 

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[Smudgerer]

14 hours ago, hdmesa said:

 

 

I'd bet they will release the M11-V in 2026 not long before the M12 w/rangefinder is released. They'll probably make both of them at the same time for a few years, waiting to release the M12-V until the M12 is near the end of its run.

You're probably correct in saying that 2026 will most likely be the release date of the M11-V / EVF-M, though I am sure it exists now and is in the hands of the usual suspects undergoing testing with firmware / software probably being the reason that it is held over until those functions are sorted as best they can if only to avoid a repeat of the M11's sad history before they got that right years later.