EVF M rumoured

[SrMi]

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20 minutes ago, lct said:

Only that really? I can use my Sigma FTL at slower shutter speeds than my M11.

There can be various reasons, but EIS is not it. Sigma mentions that EIS is for video only.

[mujk]

2 hours ago, jaapv said:

I strongly suspect that the EVF will be just as befuddling - To start with, you have to turn some ring on the lens... WHAT???

That can be easily fixed. Leica will just have to start manufacturing Auto-versions of all their current lenses (except the 135 APO). These will otherwise be identical to the current lenses but have an "A" position at f16 on the aperture ring and another "A" at the infinity mark on the focusing ring. Accompanied with a "quick start guide" telling to set "A" on all dials (ISO, shutter speed, aperture and focus) and you are ready to go. Just press the shutter release and we do the rest.

[BWColor]

3 minutes ago, mujk said:

That can be easily fixed. Leica will just have to start manufacturing Auto-versions of all their current lenses (except the 135 APO). These will otherwise be identical to the current lenses but have an "A" position at f16 on the aperture ring and another "A" at the infinity mark on the focusing ring. Accompanied with a "quick start guide" telling to set "A" on all dials (ISO, shutter speed, aperture and focus) and you are ready to go. Just press the shutter release and we do the rest.

Wow, that is a major long term project.  Good excuse to drastically raise lens prices and freeze out third parties for awhile.

[charlesphoto99]

11 minutes ago, BWColor said:

Wow, that is a major long term project.  Good excuse to drastically raise lens prices and freeze out third parties for awhile.

Umm, that was sarcasm. I hope. 

Edited September 27 by charlesphoto99

[BWColor]

4 hours ago, charlesphoto99 said:

Umm, that was sarcasm. I hope. 

No, coming out with a new line of Leica lenses is no small effort and I would expect a pretty hefty increase in prices.  Why would that be sarcasm?

BTW.. planning a 5000 miles road trip and will visit Leica in your area..  My friend bought an M11 Monochrom a year ago and hasn’t taken the camera outside of his flat, so he is flying to Texas and we are doing a road trip to the Portland area and a side trip to Seattle/Bellvue Leica… Which was the last place that his M11M got some fresh air.

Edited September 27 by BWColor
Added Aside..

[Alberti]

Auto-aperture is impossible on manual lenses. So can't be used to keep out competitors.

I would instead expect a lens detection with small holes on the bayonet to appear. —> In fact, some of my lenses have that already. The holes could be a coding feature 🤔 – just like some security keys / door locks have them. . .  to expand the 6-bits.

— Then it will be almost impossible for third parties to drill feel-alikes in existing/3rd p  bayonets. An easy way to close the market.

 

[FrozenInTime]

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Having grown up in the '70s or '80's it is easy to recall that auto aperture did not happen until electronic contacts appeared on lens mounts. Before that, the big innovation on SLR lenses was auto-iris stop down e.g. the pin extending from the back of M42 lenses that would quickly close the iris when the shutter was fired.

Innovation on M lenses to read the aperture into a M body would have been considered and dismissed by Leica; similar to the ROM series of R lenses; even this would add bulk.

I don't thing auto-aperture or even stop-down would shift sales; however it would be good to see Leica diversify a little from expensive hyper-resolution and large super-speed lenses, towards compact designs that did not need complex FLE mechanisms for close focus.

[pgk]

18 hours ago, jaapv said:

There - I edited that for you. 😉

My point being, of course, that there are potentially much cheaper, and much more highly specified cameras available from other manufacturers (and even from Leica) which can be seen as being competitive.

The advantages of an EVF-M being; form factor, auto magnification switching by moving camera focus on the lens, and a degree of lens/sensor optimisation (with 6-bit lenses). But obtaining this is likely to be very costly and apart from those 'in the know' is likely to be missed by viewers of the resultant images. I can see some advantages to such a camera but for me, as a tool, the flange to sensor distance is still too great - an L mount 'M' shaped camera would be far more useful.

[jaapv]

1 minute ago, pgk said:

an L mount 'M' shaped camera would be far more useful.

I said so from the beginning - and so did many  others, starting with the wish for a full-frame CL.   I have always failed to see the objection to a dual-purpose camera with M and L-optimized sensor, L-mount and bundled L-M adapter.  It would have been far more universally attractive and functional than the one postulated now. 

[FrozenInTime]

7 minutes ago, jaapv said:

I said so from the beginning - and so did many  others, starting with the wish for a full-frame CL.   I have always failed to see the objection to a dual-purpose camera with M and L-optimized sensor, L-mount and bundled L-M adapter.  It would have been far more universally attractive and functional than the one postulated now. 

No real objection to this if the L-M adapter is updated to include a RF cam follower. 

[jaapv]

Not needed on an EVF camera. Auto magnification must be possible by detecting change in contrast AKA sharpness analogous to focus peaking. 

[JNK100]

13 hours ago, BWColor said:

No, coming out with a new line of Leica lenses is no small effort and I would expect a pretty hefty increase in prices.  Why would that be sarcasm?

BTW.. planning a 5000 miles road trip and will visit Leica in your area..  My friend bought an M11 Monochrom a year ago and hasn’t taken the camera outside of his flat, so he is flying to Texas and we are doing a road trip to the Portland area and a side trip to Seattle/Bellvue Leica… Which was the last place that his M11M got some fresh air.

The poster was joking.....

[BWColor]

1 hour ago, JNK100 said:

The poster was joking.....

Thanks..  I missed that… but in retrospect …

[FrozenInTime]

3 hours ago, jaapv said:

Not needed on an EVF camera. Auto magnification must be possible by detecting change in contrast AKA sharpness analogous to focus peaking. 

Auto magnification toggling without a user input would be insanely annoying.

[jaapv]

Why should there be no user toggle? The mechanical sensor would activate no differently. If not auto it will always be user activated and needs no input from the lens. 

[mujk]

23 minutes ago, jaapv said:

Why should there be no user toggle? The mechanical sensor would activate no differently. 

I think it would be quite difficult to distinguish between the user turning the focus ring and e.g. the subject moving into the plane of focus just by examining the sensor output. But there could be other ways than using a cam follower to detect movement of the cam, or maybe movement of some other part of the lens.

[jaapv]

Not really. Otherwise focus peaking would not work. The user focuses by visual input of the EVF, the peaking would be by contrast change from the sensor. Nothing mechanical involved. This would be for auto activation which is not very desirable for most.
If magnification can work the way it does on my SL2S and adapter ( any adapter) there is nothing to worry about.  Pushclick the thumbwheel: it activates and turning the wheel at the same time sets the amount. 

[lct]

Would an M lens user have to endure an adapter on a camera dedicated to such lenses really? This question has been discussed for years here and the definite answer is a no no, hopefully.

[jaapv]

Endure? What bollocks. It simply changes the mount. Put it on and forget as you have an M mount camera. That thread is about smeared corners not the mechanical thing. 

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[mujk]

48 minutes ago, jaapv said:

Not really. Otherwise focus peaking would not work. The user turns by visual input of the EVF. 

Yes, but focus peaking is based only on the change in contrast. Now consider the case where the focus is set to a specific distance and the photographer waits for the subject to move into focus (peaking coming on). The subject or camera is moving, not the focusing ring, but focus peaking is coming on when focus is achieved. At that moment it may not be desirable for focus magnification to turn on by itself. In fact, the photographer would probably want focus magnification to turn on before peaking occurs.