pippy Posted January 7 Share #121 Posted January 7 Advertisement (gone after registration) 39 minutes ago, pgk said: Its an interesting problem......How on earth do you reconcile poor performance with ecstatic users in a template combining objective and subjective...data which contradicts it? It is a problem which has no definitive answer. 3D-Kraft's analogy with wine is actually quite apt. How can anyone tell whether they will like a wine until they try it out for themselves? I happen to be very partial to Bordeaux. My wife prefers wine from the Loire Valley. Most of our friends would always choose a Burgundy. How could there be universal agreement when there are so many choices options and variables? Same thing with lenses. Admittedly it is somewhat easier to make sweeping descriptive comments where APO/ASPH/FLE lenses are concerned as they tend to do things in as 'perfect' a way (optically speaking) as is currently possible for a lens in M mount but trying to get universal agreement on any lens built by Leitz / Leica over, say, the first 80 years of their existence? If there is a tendency in this thread towards a certain amount of levity perhaps it's because many of those taking part have a fairly good idea of how truly quixotic - and I do mean that quite literally - this project will prove to be. To that end I'm as interested as anyone else here to see how it might progress. Philip. 5 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted January 7 Posted January 7 Hi pippy, Take a look here Leica Lens template proposal. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
jaapv Posted January 7 Share #122 Posted January 7 3 hours ago, 3D-Kraft.com said: This will be like rating the quality of wine based on the flowery descriptions that wine testers usually give in catalogues. Oh, it can be done - I am quite a fan of South African wines -the French are stuck in conservatism IMO- and Platter's is quite a useful resource. People I know in the South African wine industry tell me that it is taken exceedingly seriously by the producers and consumers alike. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pippy Posted January 7 Share #123 Posted January 7 (edited) 57 minutes ago, jaapv said: Oh, it can be done... With the very greatest of respect, Jaap, I disagree. Descriptions can give an idea of what to expect from a wine and the more experience one has about the type of wine in question the better informed that understanding might be but having an idea - even a really good idea - of what something will taste like is absolutely not a substitute for actually tasting the wine for oneself. Philip. Edited January 7 by pippy Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pippy Posted January 7 Share #124 Posted January 7 36 minutes ago, Al Brown said: The database has not yet initiated to manifest in any form yet the debate here is already 129 posts long. Good. To borrow a quote from 'The Life of Brian' as the latter is about to be 'nailed up'; "Right! This calls for immediate discussion!!!"......😸...... Philip. 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
costa43 Posted January 7 Share #125 Posted January 7 Even with the very best intentions this is a non starter if the objective is to produce a serious database. Every single piece of glass released has had conflicting views, strong ones. Heck, I change my mind about the glass nowadays depending on which sensor is behind it. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pippy Posted January 8 Share #126 Posted January 8 (edited) Here's a thought; What if AI has been at work all along and we have simply been an amusement / information resource for whomever has started this thread? Have a look through the first four or five pages and see if there is any hint at 'Human' (i.e. strongly held emotional) input from the OP.... Whichever way this goes I've decided that enough is, indeed, enough. I'm out and will never be back here again. For those that decide to stay? Have fun! P. Edited January 8 by pippy 2 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lct Posted January 8 Share #127 Posted January 8 Advertisement (gone after registration) Trolling bot? 😄 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
KFo Posted January 8 Share #128 Posted January 8 ...throwing an example into the ring... Some here already know reidreviews.com For a methodology that is relevant to both the techie-pixel peeper and more organic approach photographers, Sean Reid is without peer. His methodology allows comparison of different lenses tested at different times yielding useful information. I think it is an important example to consider. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
DigitalHeMan Posted January 8 Share #129 Posted January 8 6 hours ago, pippy said: What if AI has been at work all along and we have simply been an amusement / information resource for whomever has started this thread? Have a look through the first four or five pages and see if there is any hint at 'Human' (i.e. strongly held emotional) input from the OP.... You mean the second letter of the user name is not actually a lower case L as I had assumed, but is in fact an upper case i? Certainly pulled the wool over my eyes! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
250swb Posted January 8 Share #130 Posted January 8 I have a dystopian feeling coming on. Lets face it if such a database existed the OP could have referred to that and hopefully would not have gone on to manipulate this thread for his own amusement, so yippee. But if this impossible database did exist wouldn't it also deprive everybody else of the amusement of sharing an opinion in other threads? You can't have it both ways, one comprehensive source of one-stop information whether Ai or compiled by humans is detrimental to discussion. Even if it was started by humans it will ultimately do away with the need for humans, so in effect you've invented a way to delete yourselves from having a new opinion. So even if these types of thread are click bait and self serving it could be worse and maybe we have to humour the ideas, only in this case the subject is both self serving and worst case if theoretically carried through. Discussions about a 50mm Summicron are not meant to be comprehensive or definitive because you may change them tomorrow, and that's a prerogative worth keeping without having to battle a database of opinion in which 'the computer says, no'. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lct Posted January 8 Share #131 Posted January 8 A database with facts including links to opinions was a good Wiki idea already. Improving it sounds more realistic than a new database mixing objectivity and subjectivity IMHO. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ecar Posted January 8 Share #132 Posted January 8 13 hours ago, pippy said: What if AI has been at work all along and we have simply been an amusement / information resource for whomever has started this thread? Have a look through the first four or five pages and see if there is any hint at 'Human' (i.e. strongly held emotional) input from the OP.... This gave it away - AI lacks subtlety and this was rather heavy-handed...: On 1/5/2025 at 4:44 AM, Altair said: I want to see this happen, and firmly believe that once the ball gets rolling this will be sold enjoyable and the usefulness so clear we won't be able to stop. This effort would be so comprehensive and valuable it will eliminate redundant threads for decades to come, the names associated will go down in Leica history, the general quality of pictures taken by newcomers will be sold much better it will be all but impossible to differentiate a legendary photographer from a first time user. But I thoroughly enjoyed following the exchanges in this thread.😁 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ecar Posted January 8 Share #133 Posted January 8 7 minutes ago, Al Brown said: It wasn't me, I promise. Of course not - you are more subtle than that. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
grahamc Posted January 8 Share #134 Posted January 8 On 1/4/2025 at 9:44 PM, Altair said: we won't be able to stop you/we heard it here first, folks. RUN !!!! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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