Olaf_ZG Posted January 5 Share #21  Posted January 5 Advertisement (gone after registration) 1 hour ago, PeterGA said: All digital cameras are a short term proposition - even though Leica extnds 'hort term' to a 4 year cycle before they announve thei rbest ever by a long way and never seen previously new version - the L APO mount lenses of which I opwn quite a few have a greater expecrted life - but they will all fail - it is only a matter of time and the repair costs may not be justifiable when they do. Apart from weight this is an advantage that M lenses deliver to their owners- a much longer expected life expectancy and unlike L mount lenses - they enjoy an ability to be adapted to many camera systems eg 100MP Fujis and Hasselblads.  AF lenses from many brands are still going strong after many many years. True, their value is rather low, but they are going strong. I expect the SL lenses to outlive many forummembers here… like it or not. 2 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted January 5 Posted January 5 Hi Olaf_ZG, Take a look here 21 apo f2 L mount or 21 f1.4 Lux M mount for SL2?. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
mboerma Posted January 5 Share #22  Posted January 5 10 hours ago, Genoweffa said: Yes...when I was young and still handsome, I used a film rangefinder...still have it Have you ever tried SL or Q systems?...I mean, really, really tried?...say, even with M lenses on SL? Besides, can I put my Otus 55, 135ZE plus bunch of other Milvus on M body?...no...can I put M mount lenses on SL...yes  Thank you to all suggesting 21 Apo. 10-4 I used them all. Also M-lenses on SL's. Give a digital M a try and you might opt for both lenses. It is really much more than a museum relic. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterGA Posted January 5 Share #23  Posted January 5 (edited) 40 minutes ago, Olaf_ZG said: AF lenses from many brands are still going strong after many many years. True, their value is rather low, but they are going strong. I expect the SL lenses to outlive many forummembers here… like it or not. I guess it all depends on one's definition of a 'long time' ...but the two lenses shouldnt really be compared anyway (imo) one is an answer to a question that few shooting requirements could ever ask for the aperture range one is paying for - whilst the other is a focal length too wide but not wide enough - for me anyway .... Edited January 5 by PeterGA Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genoweffa Posted January 5 Author Share #24  Posted January 5 (edited) 6 hours ago, PeterGA said: I guess it all depends on one's definition of a 'long time' ...but the two lenses shouldnt really be compared anyway (imo) one is an answer to a question that few shooting requirements could ever ask for the aperture range one is paying for - whilst the other is a focal length too wide but not wide enough - for me anyway .... f1.4 and f2 were/are factors that prompted the original post. I have 2 lenses @f 2.8 (Biogon + Distagon ZE)...but since 'grandma inheritance' came along, part of my brain that deals with mechanical toys/cameras/cars/stereos (its in a similar location where womens' 'I need a new purse + matching new shoes' chip is located), sent me a signal to research this subject  Edited January 5 by Genoweffa 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eoin Posted January 5 Share #25  Posted January 5 6 hours ago, Genoweffa said: but since 'grandma inheritance' came along, part of my brain that deals with mechanical toys/cameras/cars/stereos (its in a similar location where womens' 'I need a new purse + matching new shoes' chip is located), sent me a signal to research this subject  You're very lucky so in that regard, Super APO 21 is the ultimate choice, budget €/$4k for a 2nd hand version, job done!. That chip will never need to be activated again for that given focal length. Wish I could say the same for my other half's bag/shoe fettish.  1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterGA Posted January 7 Share #26  Posted January 7 On 1/6/2025 at 3:37 AM, Genoweffa said: f1.4 and f2 were/are factors that prompted the original post. I have 2 lenses @f 2.8 (Biogon + Distagon ZE)...but since 'grandma inheritance' came along, part of my brain that deals with mechanical toys/cameras/cars/stereos (its in a similar location where womens' 'I need a new purse + matching new shoes' chip is located), sent me a signal to research this subject  I'm not going to stand in the way of GAS - go for it - life is short...😜 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JTLeica Posted January 7 Share #27 Â Posted January 7 Advertisement (gone after registration) On 1/3/2025 at 9:06 PM, Genoweffa said: Your rich grandma just passed away and you inherited.. Which one would you go for? No comparison at all. 21 APO is high years ahead of the M Lux, almost perfect optically at F2. Â 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Postelnikov Posted January 7 Share #28  Posted January 7 On 1/4/2025 at 5:02 PM, Genoweffa said: Dont have M and never will... M model format (ie.rangefinder) is produced only for religious Leica followers and potential Leica followers who prefer this 'uniqueness' over functionality and convenience, while having choice of Q and SL series. Just in November, I made a trip through India and Bhutan. I left my SL at home. My friend gave it to me to try the Q3 43, a great camera. But mainly, I used M and MM. I do not understand why there is so much hate in your words? You don’t like it? Go to the mirror and you will see the only person who is interested in this opinion. And do not use it. You be you. I love M. There are a lot of cases where I wouldn’t imagine any camera doing a better job than M. Starting from travel, street, and reportage. But this is my opinion, and my mirror agrees with that.  3 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genoweffa Posted January 7 Author Share #29  Posted January 7 1 hour ago, Postelnikov said: Just in November, I made a trip through India and Bhutan. I left my SL at home. My friend gave it to me to try the Q3 43, a great camera. But mainly, I used M and MM. I do not understand why there is so much hate in your words? You don’t like it? Go to the mirror and you will see the only person who is interested in this opinion. And do not use it. You be you. I love M. There are a lot of cases where I wouldn’t imagine any camera doing a better job than M. Starting from travel, street, and reportage. But this is my opinion, and my mirror agrees with that.  1.glad you like it 2.I just dont like it...and I dont hate things.. 3.my opinion was expressed...and its and the same validity level as yours...so.. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sandokan Posted January 9 Share #30  Posted January 9 On 1/4/2025 at 5:02 PM, Genoweffa said: Dont have M and never will... M model format (ie.rangefinder) is produced only for religious Leica followers and potential Leica followers who prefer this 'uniqueness' over functionality and convenience, while having choice of Q and SL series. You did ask the question for what we would choose. I have the 21 M Summilux and like it. I like the M and SL and Q cameras. I have a 16-35 and see no reason to get the 21 Summicron when I already have the range covered, I do not need another fast ultrawide lens and my SL is used with ultrawide lenses for landscape where I shoot mostly at 5.6 to 8. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pelu2010 Posted January 9 Share #31  Posted January 9 On 1/4/2025 at 5:02 PM, Genoweffa said: Dont have M and never will... M model format (ie.rangefinder) is produced only for religious Leica followers and potential Leica followers who prefer this 'uniqueness' over functionality and convenience, while having choice of Q and SL series. We‘ll see how far your religion goes with future M models. I guess that some people just like the quirqeyness of the process to take pictures with the M. On the other hand it’s hard not to find engage people on a Leica M forum.  1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Photoworks Posted January 9 Share #32 Â Posted January 9 On 1/4/2025 at 11:02 AM, Genoweffa said: M model format (ie.rangefinder) is produced only for religious Leica followers and potential Leica followers who prefer this 'uniqueness' over functionality and convenience, while having choice of Q and SL series. the M9 was so successful that it saved the company. but I have heard somewhere that "real photographers use a Leica M camera". Â but what do I know I don't do religion. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SrMi Posted January 9 Share #33 Â Posted January 9 On 1/7/2025 at 7:46 AM, Genoweffa said: 1.glad you like it 2.I just dont like it...and I dont hate things.. 3.my opinion was expressed...and its and the same validity level as yours...so.. People do not judge what you like. We judge that you judge what other people like (digital M cameras). 3 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genoweffa Posted January 9 Author Share #34 Â Posted January 9 27 minutes ago, SrMi said: People do not judge what you like. We judge that you judge what other people like (digital M cameras). slow day eh? pls refer to #8 and re-read Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genoweffa Posted January 9 Author Share #35  Posted January 9 9 hours ago, Pelu2010 said: We‘ll see how far your (not mine) religion goes with future M models. (my bet...M will finally get TTL and the age advanced (is this a politically correct word?) users will be happier...no AF though, since they want to keep selling lenses) I guess that some people just like the quirqeyness of the process to take pictures with the M. (people can do whatever they want) On the other hand it’s hard not to find engage people on a Leica M forum.(no different as on any other themed forums..one's opinion will always have challenges from devotees of a subject)   Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SrMi Posted January 9 Share #36  Posted January 9 1 hour ago, Genoweffa said: slow day eh? pls refer to #8 and re-read It is not a slow day :), but reading what you wrote ("only for religious Leica followers "). Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genoweffa Posted January 9 Author Share #37  Posted January 9 8 minutes ago, SrMi said: It is not a slow day :), but reading what you wrote ("only for religious Leica followers "). relax ok? can not use word 'religious'?...in your mind, I am offending your actual spiritual religion? look it up for the definition of that word's synonyms 10-4 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pelu2010 Posted January 9 Share #38  Posted January 9 2 hours ago, Genoweffa said: relax ok? can not use word 'religious'?...in your mind, I am offending your actual spiritual religion? look it up for the definition of that word's synonyms 10-4 I read it more like a joke. And as I am born without religion, I need some M8, M9 and M240 to get to daddy. Lets laugh about "religion" and "Leica" cheers Peter 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Postelnikov Posted January 9 Share #39  Posted January 9 (edited) 5 hours ago, Genoweffa said: relax ok? can not use word 'religious'?...in your mind, I am offending your actual spiritual religion? look it up for the definition of that word's synonyms 10-4 I am sorry, but you continue to explain yourself and every time show that you think people that use Leica M do not understand something that you understand. You say about religion. Religion means to choose something on believe and dogma, but not logic. So you basically call M users stupid fanatics.  What kind of quirk of process are you talking about? Manual focus? What kind of photos are you doing? Most of my landscapes are manual. Some of my safari shots are manual focusing. Reportage shots are manual focus. I love auto focus, but it is a necessity not 100%. But weight is. The main problem with M for me is not TTL, but IBIS. I am returning to the question - what kind of photography are you doing? When I am in a small workshop in Kolkata I really don’t want an SL. Because it is scary for people. And then you compare body size and SL 35 Apo to M35 Apo. And SL is better, but not by a mile. So for things like this M is better than SL. Period. Lightness, speed, battery (yes, battery), and the possibility not to scare those who you are shooting.  I have SL system and M system, and if you ask me to choose one, I will choose M. I used M in Iceland, Greenland on a boat, Lofotens in rain, and used it in minus 20 to make Aurora photos in Finland. Was it wise? No, I didn’t have a budget for SL, so I used what I had. Still got okay results. Every camera is compromise, as I told you before - you be you. But don’t call other people religious, because they made other decision then you.  As to the original question - buy 21 Apo SL. One of the best lenses in the SL line-up. 21 Summilux is huge as well. SL with IBIS will give you the same range with 2.0. Edited January 9 by Postelnikov Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Postelnikov Posted January 10 Share #40  Posted January 10  On 1/7/2025 at 4:46 PM, Genoweffa said: 1.glad you like it 2.I just dont like it...and I dont hate things.. 3.my opinion was expressed...and its and the same validity level as yours...so.. Some of the shots wit 21 Apo. Funny that quite often it sits in a bag and I gust use 16-35, and for the best places I gave been in 2024 I mostly use 16-35. Nevertheless 21 Apo is perfection (not by my photos). it is sharp from edge to edge. No visible distortion. I will try to use it this year more often Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! 7 Quote Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/418335-21-apo-f2-l-mount-or-21-f14-lux-m-mount-for-sl2/?do=findComment&comment=5736977'>More sharing options...
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