Looking for the Right 50mm (M10/M4)

[armevans]

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Hello, Leica-philes!

Apologies for the long post ahead. The TLDR is that I'm looking for a compact 50mm lens that captures at least some of the same magic my pristine v1 Summicron. All recommendations welcome, more details in the paragraphs below.

I recently picked up an M10 after shooting for a few years with my M4. I'm mostly a 50mm shooter, and with the M4, I moved through a few different 50mms, starting with the Voigtlander Nokton 50/1.5 II (since sold), then picking up a Light Lens Lab Elcan 50/2.0 and a Leica Summicron 50/2.0 (v1 collapsible), which I still switch between. With the M4, studying differences between lenses presented a challenge with the additional variables of film stock, processing, scanning, etc. (not to mention the time delay between shooting and getting scans back). Now that I have a digital M, I'm able to more quickly identify the differences in rendering between lenses, and I've been quite surprised by the results.

Based on reputation alone, I'd been mostly using the v1 Summicron for shooting black and white film and the Elcan for shooting color negative, assuming that the Elcan would be higher contrast/saturation and sharper (and generally a touch more modern in its rendering), and thus potentially better suited for color photography. After shooting with both on the M10 over the past couple weeks, the Summicron (which is, admittedly, flawlessly clean and recently CLA'd by DAG—not your average hazy, scratched up 70-year-old lens) has really surprised me: great results in color, sharp even wide open (and even sharper from f/2.8 onward), and just incredibly appealing. The Elcan is great too, but it's noticeably dreamier and less sharp outside of the center, particularly wide open, and it doesn't seem to have quite the contrast/saturation advantage I'd anticipated. It seems to be a bit more flare prone (shooting both without hoods but with UV filters, though I have hoods for both), or at least the flares seem uglier/less usable to me (more veiling flare and blobby ghosting). I also don't love the backwards aperture ring, especially when switching back and forth with my 28mm Elmarit v3. The differences are not gigantic between the Summicron and the Elcan, and both lenses are great (no photo is going to be ruined by bringing one lens and not the other), but I do notice the differences when reviewing photos, even on the M10's screen.

Now, here's where the complication comes in. Based on the above paragraph, I would probably opt to just shoot with the collapsible Summicron on the M10 and call it a day. The images look great, the lens is nice and small, no issue. However, I've read the M10 manual's section on collapsible lenses and many of the threads where different factions argue about using these lenses on digital cameras. I've been exceedingly careful mounting and dismounting my Summicron so far, and while I cannot see anything that would impede its ability to collapse, I'm still nervous about using it every day as my primary lens on the M10 for fear that over time I'll end up damaging something. There are also some obvious limitations to the "collapsi-cron," despite it's excellent build quality and imaging: mainly its 1.0m MFD, long(er) focus throw, lack of 6-bit coding, and infinity lock. Ideally, I'd love a lens that combines some features of all three 50s I've had so far and that adds 6-bit coding. A feature list for such a lens might look like this:

• Summicron-esque image quality (medium contrast, good sharpness, gentle color saturation)
• Elcan-esque size and focus tab
• Nokton 50/1.5 II-esque focus throw (~90 degrees) and MFD (0.7m)
• Easy serviceability/repairability when needed
• +6-bit coding

I realize, of course, that this is a tall—perhaps impossible—order. Here's where I am with options so far:

• A v4 Summicron would fill a great many of these requirements but would be larger than either of my current 50mms, and Youxin suggested that the Canadian models have internal plastic parts that are becoming increasingly brittle with no spares available for replacement. Even the later German models are difficult to calibrate and also have no parts availability.
• The v5 is apparently the same optical formula with better coatings and much better serviceability/parts availability (plus 6-bit coating for the later ones), but it loses the focus tab and adds a bit more size and weight. I'm not certain whether these later Summicrons retain the "look" that I admire so much in my collapsible version, but I imagine there is some family resemblance.
• I've also considered the more recent collapsible Elmar-M as speed isn't a high consideration for me, but I worry that it shares some of the ergonomic downsides of my v1 Summicron and Leica seem unclear about its compatibility with digital Ms.
• While I've had mixed success with Voigtlander lenses in the past, the screw-mount Color Skopar 50mm f/2.5 is ergonomically exactly what I'm looking for, but I don't know that it would offer the image quality, and 6-bit coding would be a nonstarter.
• Similarly, the Summarit 2.4/2.5 seem to be precisely what I'm looking for—compact, high-performing 50s—but from what I've read, their rendering may lean more contrasty and modern than I'm hoping for.
• If I sacrificed some of the physical attributes (size, focus tab, focus throw, 6-bit coding, etc.), the other Summicrons would come into play (DR, Rigid, v3), but I don't know whether those ergonomic compromises would get me to the imagery I want.

If you've read this far, you can probably see that I'm fully submerged in option paralysis here, and in all reality, the LLL Elcan might be the closest I'm going to get to the Goldilocks lens I have in mind. But I wanted to see if others have gone on similar deep dives looking for a compact 50mm lens for a digital M and what suggestions the more experienced folks on the forum can share. I certainly don't want to throw money at a problem with no solution, but there is a dizzying array of M-mount (and LTM) lenses, each of which seems to offer a slightly different balance of features. I don't have the opportunity to handle or test drive pretty much any of them, so your experiences would be incredibly valuable in making some decisions.

So, all suggestions, reflections, and "stop worrying about lenses and go take some damn pictures"s are appreciated.

Thanks, y'all!

-A

Edited June 14, 2024 by armevans
subject verb agreement is hard sometimes with collective nouns.

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[lct]

14 minutes ago, armevans said:

A v4 Summicron would fill a great many of these requirements but would be larger than either of my current 50mms [...]

I have no experience with the Elcan but the Sumicron 50/2 v4 is just a bit taller but also slimmer than my Nokton 50/1.5 SC v2.

16 minutes ago, armevans said:

The v5 is apparently the same optical formula with better coatings and much better serviceability/parts availability (plus 6-bit coating for the later ones), but it loses the focus tab and adds a bit more size and weight.

The Summicron 50/2 v5 is the same optical formula with same coating as the v4 German version AFAIK. They both render the same way with same qualities and flaws. Focus throw is a bit shorter on v4 than v5 though.

26 minutes ago, armevans said:

the screw-mount Color Skopar 50mm f/2.5 is ergonomically exactly what I'm looking for, but I don't know that it would offer the image quality, and 6-bit coding would be a nonstarter.

The Skopar 50/2.5 looks sharp and contrasty on digital. 6-bit coding is not a problem, suffice it to hand-code the LTM to M adapter.

22 minutes ago, armevans said:

the Summarit 2.4/2.5 seem to be precisely what I'm looking for—compact, high-performing 50s—but from what I've read, their rendering may lean more contrasty and modern than I'm hoping for.

I have no experience with the 50/2.4 but the 50/2.5 is a very good lens indeed, slightly more contrasty than v4 and v5 Summicrons although by not that much. For less modern rendering, you may consider the Nokton 50/1.5 SC v2, or the Sonnar 50/1.5 if focus shift is not a problem on the M10 i have no experience with.

[TomB_tx]

Although I used a v3 Summicron as my only 50 for 40+ years, I've tried a few others since adding digital. My main lenses on M10 are now Summarit 2.5 35 & 50. Love the size and handling = which is identical between them. The 35 has more modern rendering, while the 50 is more a scaled-down Summicron. If I'm not using those I may use a v5 Summicron, but like the handling of the 2.5s better.

[crons]

2 hours ago, armevans said:

Hello, Leica-philes!

Apologies for the long post ahead. The TLDR is that I'm looking for a compact 50mm lens that captures at least some of the same magic my pristine v1 Summicron. All recommendations welcome, more details in the paragraphs below.

I recently picked up an M10 after shooting for a few years with my M4. I'm mostly a 50mm shooter, and with the M4, I moved through a few different 50mms, starting with the Voigtlander Nokton 50/1.5 II (since sold), then picking up a Light Lens Lab Elcan 50/2.0 and a Leica Summicron 50/2.0 (v1 collapsible), which I still switch between. With the M4, studying differences between lenses presented a challenge with the additional variables of film stock, processing, scanning, etc. (not to mention the time delay between shooting and getting scans back). Now that I have a digital M, I'm able to more quickly identify the differences in rendering between lenses, and I've been quite surprised by the results.

Based on reputation alone, I'd been mostly using the v1 Summicron for shooting black and white film and the Elcan for shooting color negative, assuming that the Elcan would be higher contrast/saturation and sharper (and generally a touch more modern in its rendering), and thus potentially better suited for color photography. After shooting with both on the M10 over the past couple weeks, the Summicron (which is, admittedly, flawlessly clean and recently CLA'd by DAG—not your average hazy, scratched up 70-year-old lens) has really surprised me: great results in color, sharp even wide open (and even sharper from f/2.8 onward), and just incredibly appealing. The Elcan is great too, but it's noticeably dreamier and less sharp outside of the center, particularly wide open, and it doesn't seem to have quite the contrast/saturation advantage I'd anticipated. It seems to be a bit more flare prone (shooting both without hoods but with UV filters, though I have hoods for both), or at least the flares seem uglier/less usable to me (more veiling flare and blobby ghosting). I also don't love the backwards aperture ring, especially when switching back and forth with my 28mm Elmarit v3. The differences are not gigantic between the Summicron and the Elcan, and both lenses are great (no photo is going to be ruined by bringing one lens and not the other), but I do notice the differences when reviewing photos, even on the M10's screen.

Now, here's where the complication comes in. Based on the above paragraph, I would probably opt to just shoot with the collapsible Summicron on the M10 and call it a day. The images look great, the lens is nice and small, no issue. However, I've read the M10 manual's section on collapsible lenses and many of the threads where different factions argue about using these lenses on digital cameras. I've been exceedingly careful mounting and dismounting my Summicron so far, and while I cannot see anything that would impede its ability to collapse, I'm still nervous about using it every day as my primary lens on the M10 for fear that over time I'll end up damaging something. There are also some obvious limitations to the "collapsi-cron," despite it's excellent build quality and imaging: mainly its 1.0m MFD, long(er) focus throw, lack of 6-bit coding, and infinity lock. Ideally, I'd love a lens that combines some features of all three 50s I've had so far and that adds 6-bit coding. A feature list for such a lens might look like this:

• Summicron-esque image quality (medium contrast, good sharpness, gentle color saturation)
• Elcan-esque size and focus tab
• Nokton 50/1.5 II-esque focus throw (~90 degrees) and MFD (0.7m)
• Easy serviceability/repairability when needed
• +6-bit coding

I realize, of course, that this is a tall—perhaps impossible—order. Here's where I am with options so far:

• A v4 Summicron would fill a great many of these requirements but would be larger than either of my current 50mms, and Youxin suggested that the Canadian models have internal plastic parts that are becoming increasingly brittle with no spares available for replacement. Even the later German models are difficult to calibrate and also have no parts availability.
• The v5 is apparently the same optical formula with better coatings and much better serviceability/parts availability (plus 6-bit coating for the later ones), but it loses the focus tab and adds a bit more size and weight. I'm not certain whether these later Summicrons retain the "look" that I admire so much in my collapsible version, but I imagine there is some family resemblance.
• I've also considered the more recent collapsible Elmar-M as speed isn't a high consideration for me, but I worry that it shares some of the ergonomic downsides of my v1 Summicron and Leica seem unclear about its compatibility with digital Ms.
• While I've had mixed success with Voigtlander lenses in the past, the screw-mount Color Skopar 50mm f/2.5 is ergonomically exactly what I'm looking for, but I don't know that it would offer the image quality, and 6-bit coding would be a nonstarter.
• Similarly, the Summarit 2.4/2.5 seem to be precisely what I'm looking for—compact, high-performing 50s—but from what I've read, their rendering may lean more contrasty and modern than I'm hoping for.
• If I sacrificed some of the physical attributes (size, focus tab, focus throw, 6-bit coding, etc.), the other Summicrons would come into play (DR, Rigid, v3), but I don't know whether those ergonomic compromises would get me to the imagery I want.

If you've read this far, you can probably see that I'm fully submerged in option paralysis here, and in all reality, the LLL Elcan might be the closest I'm going to get to the Goldilocks lens I have in mind. But I wanted to see if others have gone on similar deep dives looking for a compact 50mm lens for a digital M and what suggestions the more experienced folks on the forum can share. I certainly don't want to throw money at a problem with no solution, but there is a dizzying array of M-mount (and LTM) lenses, each of which seems to offer a slightly different balance of features. I don't have the opportunity to handle or test drive pretty much any of them, so your experiences would be incredibly valuable in making some decisions.

So, all suggestions, reflections, and "stop worrying about lenses and go take some damn pictures"s are appreciated.

Thanks, y'all!

-A

All I can say is once I bought my v5 Summicron I stopped looking for 50mm lenses. And it really doesn't need a focus tab. 

[armevans]

29 minutes ago, lct said:

I have no experience with the Elcan but the Sumicron 50/2 v4 is just a bit taller but also slimmer than my Nokton 50/1.5 SC v2.

The Summicron 50/2 v5 is the same optical formula with same coating as the v4 German version AFAIK. They both render the same way with same qualities and flaws. Focus throw is a bit shorter on v4 than v5 though.

The Skopar 50/2.5 looks sharp and contrasty on digital. 6-bit coding is not a problem, suffice it to hand-code the LTM to M adapter.

I have no experience with the 50/2.4 but the 50/2.5 is a very good lens indeed, slightly more contrasty than v4 and v5 Summicrons although by not that much. For less modern rendering, you may consider the Nokton 50/1.5 SC v2, or the Sonnar 50/1.5 if focus shift is not a problem on the M10 i have no experience with.

This is incredibly helpful, thank you!!

Definitely lots of good options here, and I'd forgotten about the single-coated version of the Nokton! I did really love my MC version, and it does hit nearly all of my criteria aside from a focus tab, which I solved with one of the stick-on 7Artisans ones—not as nice as a built-in, but still plenty effective. People seem to really talk up the SC version for black and white work—have you used it much for color?

32 minutes ago, TomB_tx said:

Although I used a v3 Summicron as my only 50 for 40+ years, I've tried a few others since adding digital. My main lenses on M10 are now Summarit 2.5 35 & 50. Love the size and handling = which is identical between them. The 35 has more modern rendering, while the 50 is more a scaled-down Summicron. If I'm not using those I may use a v5 Summicron, but like the handling of the 2.5s better.

Interesting! So the better handling of the Summarit is worth whatever tradeoff in rendering compared to the Summicron for you? Given that Summarits seem to selling for the same price as the v5 Summicron (and more than the v4), if you woke up with no 50mms tomorrow, would you still be rebuying the Summarit?

17 minutes ago, crons said:

All I can say is once I bought my v5 Summicron I stopped looking for 50mm lenses. And it really doesn't need a focus tab. 

And see, this is the thing I keep coming back to. Perhaps it's just the years spent pining after one, but a 50mm Summicron feels like an end-game lens in the same way that a Leica M felt like an end-game camera. After buying my M4, I didn't just stop buying 35mm cameras (though my emptied bank account did guarantee that, lol)—I stopped looking. While I'm still very much in the honeymoon period with my M10, I'm hoping it will be similar (though I understand that digital cameras likely won't have the lifespan of film cameras). I have a feeling anything else I buy would have me wondering about a Summicron. So that makes it a bit harder to pull the trigger on anything but a Summicron, whether a v5 or something else.

[spydrxx]

I would stop worrying about the collapsible 50 you already have and just use that. However it sounds like you have a severe case of GAS, in which case you absolutely MUST buy another 50, but alas none ticks all of your boxes. I've been down this road and now have a collection of 50s, LTM, M mount, rigid , collapsible, old, new, and lots that I've also sold, and in all honesty, any one of the ones I have or have previously owned had the capabilities to far outperform me as a photographer, so I can't offer you a solution except to say, buy what you can afford and one which you think you will enjoy using.

[lct]

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25 minutes ago, armevans said:

I'd forgotten about the single-coated version of the Nokton! I did really love my MC version, and it does hit nearly all of my criteria aside from a focus tab [...]. People seem to really talk up the SC version for black and white work—have you used it much for color?

I use the Nokton 50/1.5 SC v2 for both BW and color. Couple of snaps on M11 below. Beware that the lens is prone to color fringing more so than the Summicrons which are not free from it though.

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Edited June 15, 2024 by lct

[david strachan]

Well I'm happy with my only Summicron...a V1 1952 collapsible, and can't find any reason to buy another Summicron.

 

...or make all sorts of excuses and justifications.

 

[crons]

2 hours ago, armevans said:

And see, this is the thing I keep coming back to. Perhaps it's just the years spent pining after one, but a 50mm Summicron feels like an end-game lens in the same way that a Leica M felt like an end-game camera. After buying my M4, I didn't just stop buying 35mm cameras (though my emptied bank account did guarantee that, lol)—I stopped looking. While I'm still very much in the honeymoon period with my M10, I'm hoping it will be similar (though I understand that digital cameras likely won't have the lifespan of film cameras). I have a feeling anything else I buy would have me wondering about a Summicron. So that makes it a bit harder to pull the trigger on anything but a Summicron, whether a v5 or something else.

Yea. I kept buying 50mm lenses and then I just went for it and that was 2 years ago. Haven't looked at a 50mm lens since. 

Now the focus is like butter. 

[armevans]

35 minutes ago, david strachan said:

Well I'm happy with my only Summicron...a V1 1952 collapsible, and can't find any reason to buy another Summicron.

 

...or make all sorts of excuses and justifications.

 

2 hours ago, spydrxx said:

I would stop worrying about the collapsible 50 you already have and just use that. However it sounds like you have a severe case of GAS, in which case you absolutely MUST buy another 50, but alas none ticks all of your boxes. I've been down this road and now have a collection of 50s, LTM, M mount, rigid , collapsible, old, new, and lots that I've also sold, and in all honesty, any one of the ones I have or have previously owned had the capabilities to far outperform me as a photographer, so I can't offer you a solution except to say, buy what you can afford and one which you think you will enjoy using.

Ha, I think you're probably right about all of the above—the collapsible Summicron certainly outperforms my skill as a photographer (good enough for Cartier-Bresson, etc.), and I certainly don't need another 50mm, despite my itch to get one.

2 minutes ago, crons said:

Yea. I kept buying 50mm lenses and then I just went for it and that was 2 years ago. Haven't looked at a 50mm lens since. 

Now the focus is like butter. 

See, this is the thing I want—to not be thinking about 50mm lenses all the time. Haha.

I'm going to see if I can get my hands on a more recent Summicron for a few days to shoot alongside my collapsible model. Maybe I'll find that the "collapsicron" has a magic that can't be replicated, and I can sleep easy knowing that the grass is greenest in my camera bag. Or maybe I'll discover that the v5 will, in fact, address my wishlist, and I can still sleep easy with a pair of crons (and a lighter wallet). Either way seems better than staring at sample images. If I end up getting another 50, I'll likely sell the Elcan. It's a phenomenally cool lens, but I don't think I can justify three 50s—even two seems extravagant!

I'll post an update if I get a chance to demo one.

Thanks, all!

 

[costa43]

Voigtlander have just announced a release date of July for their new 50mm f2.2 Color Skopar lens. Could be something to keep an eye on. 

[crons]

3 hours ago, armevans said:

I'm going to see if I can get my hands on a more recent Summicron for a few days to shoot alongside my collapsible model. Maybe I'll find that the "collapsicron" has a magic that can't be replicated, and I can sleep easy knowing that the grass is greenest in my camera bag. Or maybe I'll discover that the v5 will, in fact, address my wishlist, and I can still sleep easy with a pair of crons (and a lighter wallet). Either way seems better than staring at sample images. If I end up getting another 50, I'll likely sell the Elcan. It's a phenomenally cool lens, but I don't think I can justify three 50s—even two seems extravagant!

I'll post an update if I get a chance to demo one.

Thanks, all!

The 50 cron produces beautiful images but it doesn't "add" things to it. It's sort of what you saw is what it is. It's nice and softer wide open and sharpens a lot closed down and the contrast goes up too. So it does have a personality. It's one of those lenses you just shoot and forget about the gear. 

It lacks the extra contrast of the ASPH lenses so it still keeps things classic. 

For example this is the 50 cron v5

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And this is the 35 cron asph 

See the 50 is still modern (I'll say modern classic) but without the asph look of the 35. And the 35 has the asph without being too much in your face like for example the 28f2 Ultron which is a great lens but a lot of that ASPH contrast. 

Edited June 15, 2024 by crons

[01maciel]

Due to a good opportunity, I ended up with both lenses, Summicron v4 and v5. I much prefer v5 to version 4 for reasons I can't really explain. If you like the old style rendering of lenses I would recommend to have closer look to the Zeiss C SonnarT* 1.5/50

[dpitt]

9 hours ago, armevans said:

Or maybe I'll discover that the v5 will, in fact, address my wishlist, and I can still sleep easy with a pair of crons (and a lighter wallet). Either way seems better than staring at sample images. If I end up getting another 50, I'll likely sell the Elcan. It's a phenomenally cool lens, but I don't think I can justify three 50s—even two seems extravagant!

 

I have tried and owned all of them from v1 to v5, including the Elmar and Summarit 50. I must admit that I have a kind of Summicron addiction 😊
Nothing wrong about owning more than two 50mm lenses in my eyes. 

They are all outstanding but in a different way. Although differences are small, probably smaller than what you see between your v1 and Elcan sample. But the color rendering of v1 and v2 is very different from the others.

I saw very little (no) difference in rendering between the v4 and v5, so I sold the v5. The v4 is my favorite because it is smaller and has a tab. It gets most use, and It often without the sun hood because we have very cloudy weather here.  From time to time, I take the v1 or v2 for a spin.
The v3 was good but not very special in the series, so I sold that too. The Summarit 50 felt too modern. The Summicron v5(and v4) have the best balance between modern ASPH and vintage for me.

An other one of my favorites is the Summicron 40C. It gets even more use than the 50mm v4, but it is more competition for my Summicron 35mm than for the 50mm.

[GinaJ]

I have a love/hate relationship with my Elcan; I agree the flare is pretty ugly, and my copy has pretty noticeable focus shift at f/4.  But it's pretty decently sharp in the center, renders uniquely from other lenses I own, and the focus shift is negligible when I use it on my CL digital.

Perhaps consider the Thypoch Eureka?  It is also tiny and based on an older design.  I don't own it, but the review on Phillip Reeve's site says it has sharper corners and handles flare better than the Elcan, and when collapsed is about as small.  

[lct]

On 6/15/2024 at 10:57 AM, 01maciel said:

Due to a good opportunity, I ended up with both lenses, Summicron v4 and v5. I much prefer v5 to version 4 for reasons I can't really explain.

One of them could possibly be that your v4 was an early variant made in Canada. I had one too and it exhibited a bit more flare than both German made v4 and v5 due to different coatings apparently. My current v4 is made in Germany and i can't seem to distinguish it, IQ wise, from my v5. Early v4 and v5 comparo here:

https://photos.smugmug.com/photos/i-4RKCr3w/0/DSd6SWT3Dqv2CFmcGhQLSRvLhLxQNtMpr2ZqQTTZz/X4/i-4RKCr3w-X4.jpg

https://photos.smugmug.com/photos/i-BvXmk5v/0/Dz98sGsK8SZXJRJDH6cg3cPtpSnVpN2qNssF5FPFJ/X4/i-BvXmk5v-X4.jpg

[S Maclean]

The 50 cron DR is excellent but I think it would give problems on the M10. (Not sure)

Since you have a V1 why not go into the close focussing Lux?  It's modern, sharp, contrasty and flexible.

On the other hand I agree the CV Skopar sounds likr a winner to me.  Voigtlander is really delivering incredible optics as of late.

[armevans]

I figured I'd come back and give an update for future readers and anyone else who's interested.

At the suggestion of a few people, I decided to get my hands on a Summicron V5. There's no Leica store in my area, and the only Leica dealer nearby didn't have this lens to loan out, so I ended up buying a used copy from MPB, knowing I could return it in fourteen days if it didn't work for me.

The build quality of the V5 is perhaps not quite as spectacular as the V1 (the 50s chrome over brass lenses set a really high bar when they're in good condition), but the lens is just fantastic ergonomically—the dampening of the focus is better than any of my other lenses, and the focus throw is absolutely perfect—shorter than both the V1 and the Elcan. I was on the fence about the integrated hood initially, but I'm now totally sold on it. I like to travel light, and I often eschew a hood even when I know I'd be better off with one, just to shed a bit of bulk. Having a hood that adds essentially zero size or weight to the lens is just awesome and really saved me shooting in pretty harsh sunlight this weekend. I do wish the V5 had a focus tab, but I've ordered one of the stick-on 7Artisans ones. I used one of those back when I had a Nokton 50/1.5 II, and it worked well enough.

Now, onto the images. In my initial post, I said that I was looking for a lens that had some of the same magic as the V1 collapsible Summicron. The V5 Summicron is not exactly that—out of focus areas look different, colors look different. This isn't surprising given the many design revisions between my two copies, but it's worth noting that images taken with both lenses are noticeably different. I think the V1 would still be my pick for shooting black and white film in good light—there's something extremely appealing about the images it produces, but for everything else, the V5 is phenomenal. At f/2.0 or f/2.8 on the M10, the images it takes remind me a bit of photographs I've taken on medium format cameras in the way they transition from in focus to out of focus—it's both really sharp and slightly dreamy. The colors are fantastic—not super modern or ultra saturated but extremely accurate and visually pleasing. The V5 flares significantly less than the V1, and while I could force it to veil a little bit even with the hood extended, the results still totally usable and still quite attractive, much nicer than the blobby ghosting flare of the LLL Elcan, even with its bulky IROOA hood. I've been shooting with the V5 for less than a week, but I'm pretty sold on it—it won't be going back to MPB, and the Elcan will likely be up for sale soon.

So, I think that probably solves my 50mm problems for the time being, and I'm really loving using my M4 and M10 with my Mandler-designed lens duo (28mm f/2.8 Elmarit V3 and 50mm f/2.0 Summicron V5). I'd love a nice 90mm to cover my telephoto end, but beyond that, I think I'm pretty well set for all occasions. Now to take some photos!

Thank you all for your insights—I really appreciate it!

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Hallo,

Look here: Leica M

[RexGig0]

Enjoy!

As I was reading the posts, even though I have never used a Version I Summicron, I was thinking that trying a present-version Summicron would be a sensible action. Well, that being already done, I believe that you will be well-served by your choice. Having a 2003 Summicron-M 50mm, and a Version III Elmarit-M 28mm, I, too, believe that a Walter Mandler classic lens duo is a good thing. 🙂 A wonderful creative choice!

Edited June 25, 2024 by RexGig0

[chris7273]

I would continue to use the collapsible and never shorten it if you are concerned with potential problems. But if you suffer from gas, maybe try a Summarit 2.4 (easy to resell) ?