And there my M6 meter died.

[Huss]

Advertisement (gone after registration)

23 hours ago, Beresford said:

..

It is strange, but I had become fond (is that reasonable for an inanimate object?) of my M6. It fits my hands and gives me pleasure. I look forward to getting it back.

And that is the thing about Leica Ms.  It really is about how they feel in hand and are to use that make them irresistible.  It's a strange thing to try to justify, but basically that is the reason they are the only mfgs still making high end 35mm cameras.  It has nothing to so with technical specs, but the sensation of use.

[Anbaric]

18 hours ago, jensthoes said:

...same to my M6 classic 5 years ago (2018).

The estimate for the Leica service was 1.167,15 €.

Back then it would have been possible to fix even if the meter circuit board was dead, because replacements were available (and it could probably have been done a lot more cheaply at a good independent). Now we are in limbo, because the original boards have run out. Leica have suggested there may be a new fix, probably using the meter from the M6 2022, on a vague timetable that has been pushed back to next year (and the price won't be getting any cheaper!).

15 hours ago, madNbad said:

It's surprising no independent shop has is making replacement meter boards for the M6. When Leica was overloaded with M9 sensor replacements, there were a few that started offering their own version. There are varying reports on how well some of them worked but it shows with some effort, replacement electronics can be fabricated.

I thought the third party M9 fixes were just cover glass replacements? A new sensor would be a much more complex fix. A new M6 board wouldn't be a trivial thing to make, but one independent technician has suggested he may make one:

https://www.cameraworks-uk.com/post/is-your-leica-m6-slowly-becoming-an-m4-p-no-more-light-meter-pcb-s

10 hours ago, Beresford said:

Oh dear! I never asked. Wetzlar are quoting quite a lot of money to fix the meter, and suggested on top of that that it would be a good idea to have the camera serviced. I am not very good at asking the sort of questions which put someone 'on the spot'. I trust Leica, and am sure they will do the best for me that they can. I will be satisfied with that.

Have they examined it already? If the meter board is dead, nobody else will be able to replace it right now (and even Leica are apparently still working on the solution). But it's always possible it's something simple, like a connection that has to be re-soldered.

[TomB_tx]

A common reason for M6 meter failure (which is rare anyway) is a leaking battery left in the camera that causes corrosion on the board. A good tech might clean and repair traces, but Leica probably just does replacement of such components - so would wait for the "new board" solution.

[jakontil]

24 minutes ago, TomB_tx said:

A common reason for M6 meter failure (which is rare anyway) is a leaking battery left in the camera that causes corrosion on the board. A good tech might clean and repair traces, but Leica probably just does replacement of such components - so would wait for the "new board" solution.

if that's the case, that means not so common only with M6 but other M film camera too.. but i take the battery out after each shoot if knowing i wont shoot for another week 

[Matlock]

23 minutes ago, jakontil said:

if that's the case, that means not so common only with M6 but other M film camera too.. but i take the battery out after each shoot if knowing i wont shoot for another week 

Fair comment but slight overkill unless you are using Alkaline batteries. Silver and Lithium batteries have a life of up to 10years and seldom leak anyway.

[jakontil]

7 minutes ago, Matlock said:

Fair comment but slight overkill unless you are using Alkaline batteries. Silver and Lithium batteries have a life of up to 10years and seldom leak anyway.

hi mat, i used the alkaline, but lately fighting to get the more rare silver batteries but even it should have risk of leaks? no? i was just told by a local tech, always good to take them out when not shooting for some time not sure if he was referring to the time when i was still using the alkaline

bearing the risk of leak which might result damaging the circuitry, not that i enjoy taking 'em out every now and then

[Huss]

Advertisement (gone after registration)

On 9/22/2023 at 10:39 AM, madNbad said:

It's surprising no independent shop has is making replacement meter boards for the M6. When Leica was overloaded with M9 sensor replacements, there were a few that started offering their own version. There are varying reports on how well some of them worked but it shows with some effort, replacement electronics can be fabricated. The major problem may be that the meters in the M6 don't fail often enough for someone to put out the effort. Every one of the M9's were affected, ensuring the cost of development could be recouped. If a few dozen M6's have meter failure each year, it's devastating to the owner but is it worth the investment to make and store replacement parts? Leica continues to make a small number of film cameras each year and finally admitted many of the reported problems could be traced to contracted parts. Somewhere in one of the many threads, it was announced there would be replacements for failed meters. Do they have the parts on hand or are they ordered on a by case basis? 

Leica is primarily a manufacturer of digital cameras. The fact that they still build and service film cameras should be applauded but as others have pointed out, a litte customer service can go a long way. 

I read that the famous indie Leica shop in England - Starkie? - is working on developing a replacement M6 meter.  For the original M6.

[aesop]

On 9/21/2023 at 10:15 PM, Al Brown said:

It may seem harsh hearing this but if you cannot meter via the sunny 16 rule (I hate that rule, it is wrong) any time of the day you should not use film cameras.
I am NEVER more than one stop off looking at *any* scene on E6 with M6, M4-P or any Barnack. And E6 is up to 1/3rd of a stop precise.
Do 25 years of experience help? Sure, but I learned to do this from the start.
 

 

        ...this is very useful - just the sort of relevant advice required when one's meter conks out. Seriously.

 

[69xchange]

5 hours ago, TomB_tx said:

A common reason for M6 meter failure (which is rare anyway) is a leaking battery left in the camera that causes corrosion on the board. A good tech might clean and repair traces, but Leica probably just does replacement of such components - so would wait for the "new board" solution.

Good point, also I believe undesirable environmental factors such as humidity and temperature also affects the meter/ electronic life as well. Then there’s age.. certain materials such as the soldering used back then deteriorate as time goes by. Not sure if that’s still the case for newer electronics? 

[logan2z]

3 hours ago, Huss said:

I read that the famous indie Leica shop in England - Starkie? - is working on developing a replacement M6 meter.  For the original M6.

Alan Starkie at Cameraworks-UK.  From his blog about the M6 meter:

I fully intend to redesign the metering and produce replacement circuit boards. I will make an announcement when the time comes. For the time being we will continue in our efforts to repair them.

https://www.cameraworks-uk.com/post/is-your-leica-m6-slowly-becoming-an-m4-p-no-more-light-meter-pcb-s

They also make a Rapid Load Kit for the M2, M3:

https://www.cameraworks-uk.com/product-page/leica-rapid-load-kit-rlk

Edited September 23, 2023 by logan2z

[Huss]

4 hours ago, logan2z said:

Alan Starkie at Cameraworks-UK.  From his blog about the M6 meter:

I fully intend to redesign the metering and produce replacement circuit boards. I will make an announcement when the time comes. For the time being we will continue in our efforts to repair them.

https://www.cameraworks-uk.com/post/is-your-leica-m6-slowly-becoming-an-m4-p-no-more-light-meter-pcb-s

They also make a Rapid Load Kit for the M2, M3:

https://www.cameraworks-uk.com/product-page/leica-rapid-load-kit-rlk

I like the Rapid Load kit.  Problem is I bought a spare spool for my M3 and carry that preloaded in a cool Adox double film cannister container (came standard when you buy two rolls of CMS 20).  So I'm all set even though I would still like the quickload!

[logan2z]

8 minutes ago, Huss said:

I like the Rapid Load kit.  Problem is I bought a spare spool for my M3 and carry that preloaded in a cool Adox double film cannister container (came standard when you buy two rolls of CMS 20).  So I'm all set even though I would still like the quickload!

The RLK looks well designed, but I can't help feeling it's a solution looking for a problem.  Loading film into an M2/M3 just isn't that hard.

[Matlock]

13 hours ago, jakontil said:

hi mat, i used the alkaline, but lately fighting to get the more rare silver batteries but even it should have risk of leaks? no? i was just told by a local tech, always good to take them out when not shooting for some time not sure if he was referring to the time when i was still using the alkaline

bearing the risk of leak which might result damaging the circuitry, not that i enjoy taking 'em out every now and then

I fully agree with you, better to be safe than sorry. I have never known a silver or lithium cell to leak (but that doesn't mean they never will). One other problem with alkaline is, even if they don't leak, they can distort and stick in the battery holder. 

[NAvalanche]

On 9/22/2023 at 9:07 AM, Borna said:

Did it just die by itself or for example, moist, water etc? Have you tried once again another new battery? Perhaps the second battery was flat. 

Ive tried 3 different batteries now. Ive found out I can sometimes see the light meter leds very faint. Seems to me its bad connection somewhere. 
Im in contact with Cameraworks in UK. 

[TomB_tx]

At least your M6 can still take photos with its electronics dead. Yesterday I pulled out my Zeiss Ikon ZM (stored without batteries for some months), installed a fresh lithium battery, and got no LEDs in the finder. Tried different shutter speeds (on manual) and the shutter fired with timing good, Then decided to try another fresh battery. Took one out of my M6 that worked perfectly and put it in the ZM. NOTHING - shutter wasn't working either. Checked the battery and it was fine, also checked the one where the shutter would work, and it was fine - a bit lower than the 2nd one, tried it again with both batteries: NADA. So now it's a brick with an excellent finder (better finder than any M). So what good is a great finder on a brick... Also - try to find service for a ZM - at least with Leica you can find service. Maybe time to find a good M7 to replace the brick I decided on instead several years ago.

[Huss]

3 hours ago, TomB_tx said:

At least your M6 can still take photos with its electronics dead. Yesterday I pulled out my Zeiss Ikon ZM (stored without batteries for some months), installed a fresh lithium battery, and got no LEDs in the finder. Tried different shutter speeds (on manual) and the shutter fired with timing good, Then decided to try another fresh battery. Took one out of my M6 that worked perfectly and put it in the ZM. NOTHING - shutter wasn't working either. Checked the battery and it was fine, also checked the one where the shutter would work, and it was fine - a bit lower than the 2nd one, tried it again with both batteries: NADA. So now it's a brick with an excellent finder (better finder than any M). So what good is a great finder on a brick... Also - try to find service for a ZM - at least with Leica you can find service. Maybe time to find a good M7 to replace the brick I decided on instead several years ago.

I actually disagree w the better finder than any M.  I had a ZM and really disliked the rf flaring out unless your eye was perfectly placed, disliked the leds becoming invisible in bright light, and hated the fact that the RF patch was fixed, instead of moving in conjunction with the frame lines when you focus.

But!!! Try contacting Zeiss directly.  Until very recently they did still service the camera.  

https://www.zeiss.com/consumer-products/int/service/contact/contact-form.html

[Huss]

3 hours ago, NAvalanche said:

Ive tried 3 different batteries now. Ive found out I can sometimes see the light meter leds very faint. Seems to me its bad connection somewhere. 
Im in contact with Cameraworks in UK. 

That is a good sign.  Suggests an internal clean is in order.  Or you should try cleaning the contacts in the battery chamber.  Pencil eraser first, then isopropyl alcohol on a cotton bud/q-tip

[Pyrogallol]

My Leica repair man, 40 years with Leitz, says turn the ISO dial on the back of the camera from one end of its travel to the other several times to clean up the contacts.

[TomB_tx]

1 hour ago, Huss said:

I actually disagree w the better finder than any M.  I had a ZM and really disliked the rf flaring out unless your eye was perfectly placed, disliked the leds becoming invisible in bright light, and hated the fact that the RF patch was fixed, instead of moving in conjunction with the frame lines when you focus.

But!!! Try contacting Zeiss directly.  Until very recently they did still service the camera.  

https://www.zeiss.com/consumer-products/int/service/contact/contact-form.html

Thanks for the response - depends on what you value in the display. What I like is he higher clarity in the VF optics and larger opening in the eyepiece. Seems like more of a picture-window view. I fully agree that the numeric display of shutter speed along the left side, which compares both the selected speed and the suggested speed, is nowhere near as clear and fast as the M6 arrows at the bottom of the VF. I haven't had an issue with the flare-out you noticed, but can make it happen if I try. I got used to that with my M6 for decades before I had the VF upgraded. The fixed RF patch also doesn't bother me. 

For manual exposure I much prefer the M6, but have used the Ikon when I'm lazy and just use it auto-aperture preferred, as I typically pre-select an aperture for the situation/scene, and let the shutter fall where it will - so I don't care about the VF shutter display. Also use it when my wife wants to use a 35mm, as focusing and framing is enough work for her.

Thanks for the Zeiss contact info - I'll check into it. Also found an unused Ikon ZM in Japan, but a used M7 may be a better option for about twice the price.

[Advertisement]

Hallo,

Look here: Leica M

[NAvalanche]

On 9/24/2023 at 8:46 PM, Huss said:

That is a good sign.  Suggests an internal clean is in order.  Or you should try cleaning the contacts in the battery chamber.  Pencil eraser first, then isopropyl alcohol on a cotton bud/q-tip

Isopropyl alcohol did the trick and my meter works again. 
Thanks for all good ideas 🙌