Summilux-M 35mm f/1.4 11301 "STEEL RIM" reissue QC problems

[Al Brown]

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1 hour ago, darylgo said:

As you say, fuhgeddaboudit.  We are talking Leica here where nuance counts.  Nuances compared to two copies of the v2 made in Canada:  modern coatings give a higher contrast image and less glow.   Perhaps the v2's have a bit of haze, although they look good when I look through them, not the flashlight test.  Unless I compare them side by side I really don't notice the difference and perhaps the other can be duplicated in post.  A second nuance, the reissue steel rim looks so cool on a black body M.....for those that like that.   

It does look cool on black, but it definitely looks the coolest on M10-P Safari. Pure  pottery  poetry.

Edited June 22, 2023 by Al Brown

[darylgo]

40 minutes ago, Al Brown said:

It does look cool on black, but it definitely looks the coolest on M10-P Safari. Pure  pottery  poetry.

Aw yes! I was looking at a used M10-P Safari a few weeks back.  When I went back it was too late, a very sad day.  So, will Leica release an M11-P Safari or will they switch to Reporter cladding?  Enjoy the Safari, it is the coolest.  

[Al Brown]

29 minutes ago, darylgo said:

Aw yes! I was looking at a used M10-P Safari a few weeks back.  When I went back it was too late, a very sad day.  So, will Leica release an M11-P Safari or will they switch to Reporter cladding?  Enjoy the Safari, it is the coolest.  

Oh, the Safari is not mine, I have the M10-P Reporter. @TheGodParticle/Hari and @KFo have the Safari...

[kivis]

On 6/18/2023 at 11:39 PM, hjddd said:

My reissued steel rim was sent back to Wetzlar from China to fix the wobbly aperture ring ， they said it will take half a year to get it back……

My Nokton 35mm f1.4 MC although 10 or 12 years old is looking better and better. I was about to pull the trigger on the steel rim reissue.

[darylgo]

1 hour ago, Al Brown said:

Oh, the Safari is not mine, I have the M10-P Reporter. @TheGodParticle/Hari and @KFo have the Safari...

I can barely keep track of my own cameras, let alone others.  Please post a picture of the lens on the Reporter.  

 

3 hours ago, kivis said:

My Nokton 35mm f1.4 MC although 10 or 12 years old is looking better and better. I was about to pull the trigger on the steel rim reissue.

You have the requisite back up for the purchase of the reissue.

[Al Brown]

1 hour ago, darylgo said:

Please post a picture of the lens on the Reporter.  

Yes Sir!
 

Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here…

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[darylgo]

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9 hours ago, Al Brown said:

Yes Sir!
 

Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here…

Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!

Apologies if my request sounded like a command, thank you for posting the image.    This looks pretty cool, and the finder makes it more so.  My reissue sits in a dry cabinet with a red rear lens cap from the 50/2 Apo Red lens.  I'll try to post an image.  

[Al Brown]

The finder is for 21/24, but it lives on the Reporter.

Edited June 23, 2023 by Al Brown

[Al Brown]

Mammatocumulus. This lens vignettes strongly even without any filter or hood.

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[Al Brown]

Made a better pic.

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[graphlex]

On 6/21/2023 at 10:47 AM, Al Brown said:

No offence, but that simply is not true. There is import tax and customs duties everywhere in the world (except maybe Canada) for items shipped from USA. Maybe people import rare and otherwise unobtainable items from BH, some also do not care about customs duties and taxes and buy there or jump into the NYC store when they find themselves in the neighborhood  like I do but faaaaaaar from "much of the world" ordering there. Also much of the world does not ship to DAG for repairs like almost all members from USA presume here in the LUF forum....

A mere quibble, but the comments on B&H’s website do reflect a customer base on which the sun never sets.

[nitroplait]

On 6/19/2023 at 11:54 AM, Al Brown said:

Because that mostly works in USA only.
In EU there is no replacement, the dealer will send for repairs and take care of it under warranty, but will not replace nor refund (unless you bought online and no more than 14 days have passed). That's the legal procedure here. Of course sometimes - at the delarer's DISCRETION - he/she would replace for you, if you are a REALLY GREAT customer, but under no obligation to do so.

Across EU borders that may hold true, but individual EU countries consumer law may well put you in a better position.

Where I live, the seller has to remedy a flawed product in "reasonable time" within the warranty period. For products not made-to-specification, that is normally defined as max. 5 weeks.

If the seller cannot comply, the consumer can demand a replacement or a refund (or accept to wait for the repair if they wish).

 

[Al Brown]

3 hours ago, nitroplait said:

Across EU borders that may hold true, but individual EU countries consumer law may well put you in a better position.

Where I live, the seller has to remedy a flawed product in "reasonable time" within the warranty period. For products not made-to-specification, that is normally defined as max. 5 weeks.

If the seller cannot comply, the consumer can demand a replacement or a refund (or accept to wait for the repair if they wish).

 

45 days is the EU norm as far as I remember.

Still, in America, they just exchange or you can return and get a refund. In Europe, this happens within a timeframe of two weeks if you buy online *only*.

[Winedemonium]

On 6/18/2023 at 2:54 AM, Al Brown said:

- Loose, not snug lens cap that does not stay on

 

- Stiff focusing ring near infinity

 

- Wobbly aperture ring that rattles

 

- Some samples are not calibrated/aligned with rangefinder (back or front focus)

 

- The use of filter with screw-in threaded lens hood leads to undesirable vignetting – design flaw, a problem recognized by Leica with a promised solution

 

- The clip-on hood does not stay on the lens/falls of at the slightest touch

- no problem

- no problem (I do feel expected resistance from the infinity lock cam when I get close, but its fine in practice)

- no problem

- not sure, my main issue is eyes poorly calibrated for rangefinder photography these days! Will do an OVF v EVF test and see if I can detect anything.

- yes. My Leica boutique in Paris says Leica is aware of the problem, but that they don't yet have corrected hoods to supply.

- yes, and sadly when I bought mine in November 2022 (man. 19/07/22) from a Leica boutique in Paris I thought this was just bad design, and so I didn't use the OLLUX. I took it back to them at the beginning of April, and they said it was faulty, and asked Leica Wetzlar to replace it. That took over 3 months, but I now have a confidence-inspiring OLLUX with a definite detent click. 

[graphlex]

4 hours ago, Al Brown said:

45 days is the EU norm as far as I remember.

Still, in America, they just exchange or you can return and get a refund. In Europe, this happens within a timeframe of two weeks if you buy online *only*.

Sometimes Leica will do better than that with the encouragement of a good dealer. They replaced an X-Vario for me after two months. Of course, they might have had warehouses full of X-Varios. A great camera, by the way.

[Qlan]

On 6/17/2023 at 11:54 PM, Al Brown said:

- Loose, not snug lens cap that does not stay on

- Stiff focusing ring near infinity

- Wobbly aperture ring that rattles

- Some samples are not calibrated/aligned with rangefinder (back or front focus)

- The use of filter with screw-in threaded lens hood leads to undesirable vignetting – design flaw, a problem recognized by Leica with a promised solution

- The clip-on hood does not stay on the lens/falls of at the slightest touch

My copy (dated Feb 2023) has wobbly aperture ring, back focusing (ruined my wife's graduation photos) from f/2 to f/5.6 at a distance from 1m to 3-4m (those are the settings I took pictures at) and the clip-on hood is not tight at all.

Sent to Leica for repair a month ago and setting my expectation low for repair time...

But now I'm worried that the back focusing I'm experiencing might just be the "normal" focus shift. Can someone re-assure me that when they focus using the rangefinder at f/2-f/5.6 close-mid range, the pictures are sharp? I don't use an EVF/LV and don't want to use the EVF/LV only for this lens.

[Al Brown]

4 minutes ago, Qlan said:

back focusing (ruined my wife's graduation photos) from f/2 to f/5.6 at a distance from 1m to 3-4m (those are the settings I took pictures at)

Sorry about your wife's graduation photos. Once in a lifetime event.
If a lens experiences back focus it will show across all the range, but mostly close up. Best test method is to try wide open. In your case and according to the data you gave I strongly suspect focus shift. Quite pronounced on the steel rim from f/2 to f/5.6, most prominent from f/2.8 to f/4.

Edited July 25, 2023 by Al Brown

[Qlan]

18 minutes ago, Al Brown said:

If a lens experiences back focus it will show across all the range, but mostly close up. Best test method is to try wide open. In your case and according to the data you gave I strongly suspect focus shift. Quite pronounced on the steel rim from f/2 to f/5.6, most prominent from f/2.8 to f/4.

Thanks. I didn't do a proper test at f/1.4 since the picture is too soft, but it was very noticeable at f/2.8 to f/4 (big focus position difference between rangefinder and LV). I didn't test apertures smaller than f/5.6 since depth of field start to get big enough to hide front/back focusing issues.

With such a strong focus shift, do you guys all focus with an EVF/LV? Otherwise portraits shot at f/2 to f/4 are too soft. I don't use this lens only for the glow at f/1.4. I also want to use it as a all-purpose lens that can deliver sharp pictures when stopped down a bit (and it does when correctly focused with LV).

Edited July 25, 2023 by Qlan

[Al Brown]

1 hour ago, Qlan said:

I also want to use it as a all-purpose lens that can deliver sharp pictures when stopped down a bit (and it does when correctly focused with LV).

This lens is a wonderful chamaeleon, I use it stopped down all the time, it really shines at f/8-f/11. Check one of the images here.

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[RexGig0]

9 hours ago, Qlan said:

Thanks. I didn't do a proper test at f/1.4 since the picture is too soft, but it was very noticeable at f/2.8 to f/4 (big focus position difference between rangefinder and LV). I didn't test apertures smaller than f/5.6 since depth of field start to get big enough to hide front/back focusing issues.

With such a strong focus shift, do you guys all focus with an EVF/LV? Otherwise portraits shot at f/2 to f/4 are too soft. I don't use this lens only for the glow at f/1.4. I also want to use it as a all-purpose lens that can deliver sharp pictures when stopped down a bit (and it does when correctly focused with LV).

I generally do not use Live View, or a Visoflex, with Leica M cameras*. If I even suspect focus shift, I shoot at apertures that I know to be predictable/acceptable. I am not any kind of expert, and only started using the Leica system five years ago, but focus shift, and other aperture-related problems, happen with other systems, too. My newly-received ‘22 Steel Rim’s aperture lives at f/5.6 to f/8, until I get a chance to set-up my three-dimensional focusing calibration target. (I can use a predictable Zeiss Distagon ZM, if I need to shoot at f/1.4 to f/4.)

I already do a related thing with my beloved Summilux-M 50mm ASPH, avoiding the aperture range at which “ninja stars” appear in the bokeh. The Floating Lens Elements in the Summilux-M 50mm ASPH solve focus shift, but, those aperture blades can be quite, well, interesting, at some apertures, so, I use this one either at f/1.4, or f/5.6 to f/8, in any conditions that might produce noticeable “bokeh balls.”

As Al Brown just stated, above, the ‘22 Steel Rim is quite the sharp lens, when stopped-down. I tend to “see” hilly and mountainous landscapes at 35mm, and look forward to leaving my native Texas Coastal Plain, soon, probably first to northern Alabama and Tennessee, then, as the budget allows, the great Southwest USA. In North America, the Rocky Mountains, in the West, are higher, but the more-eroded eastern mountain ranges have THE steep terrain, plus, more moisture to produce interesting clouds and mists. (Buying the ‘22 Steel Rim did take a big bite, from the travel budget.)

*If I predict needing to see what the lens is seeing, I am likely to simply bring a Nikon D850 or D5. My wife is a dedicated Nikon shooter, Nikon is our shared system, so, we share some quite nice F-mount lenses.

Edited July 25, 2023 by RexGig0