Trying to identify this Leica IIIf accessory...

[midnightcommander]

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I just became the owner of a black dial/no self-timer Leica rangefinder. It came with its original leather case, a 50mm f2 Summitar lens, IROOA lens hood, and a curious item that I can't identify. It's labeled "E. Leitz, NY" but there's no identifying part number or other marking. Photo attached. What is it???

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[Anbaric]

Is there a filter thread on the other side? I think there was a Leitz NY variant of the SOOGZ, an A36 to E39 adapter.

[midnightcommander]

I don't see anything that I recognize as a thread of any kind, Anbaric. Essentially, it's two rings. One of static size and an inner ring that can be collapsed by twisting the know as if to tighten the outer ring around something. Most probably a lens but I can't imagine what function it serves. The rings are bolted together so I don't see a way to insert a filter.

[MarkP]

Can you please see show us the other side

Does the side with the clamp fit the Summitar?  There are quite a number of arcane adapters for Summitars to facilitate fitting filters, etc.

Edited November 6, 2022 by MarkP

[250swb]

Is it an adapter to allow for the use of Kodak filters? Kodak 'series' filters (probably a Series 6 or 7 for a Leica) are threadless filters that used push-on adapters or clamps to fit them, so the blank side is were the Kodak filter would be mounted. There were also push-on lens hoods that went with them.

Edited November 6, 2022 by 250swb

[Anbaric]

6 hours ago, midnightcommander said:

I don't see anything that I recognize as a thread of any kind, Anbaric. Essentially, it's two rings. One of static size and an inner ring that can be collapsed by twisting the know as if to tighten the outer ring around something. Most probably a lens but I can't imagine what function it serves. The rings are bolted together so I don't see a way to insert a filter.

The ring with the clamp probably does fit a lens. The commonest clamp-on standard was A36, designed to fit over lenses with an outer diameter of 36mm like the Elmar. The Summitar has an outer diameter of 41.5mm, a little smaller than the commoner A42 standard (Summicron, etc.). The Summitar accessories I've seen aren't clamp-on, but instead use the Summitar's filter thread (a peculiar tapering thread that I don't think Leitz used elsewhere). But it might make sense to have a clamp-on adapter, maybe especially if you could adjust it to accommodate lenses with either 41.5mm or 42mm outer diameters. Can you measure the inner diameter of the clamp ring?

If the other side of this accessory had a thread, I'd assume it was either a Leitz NY version of the SOOGZ (which allowed you to attach E39 filters to A36 lenses) or the SOOTF (which allowed you to use the filters designed for the Summitar on A36 lenses) but it sounds like this is not the case, so maybe a Series filter adapter as above? Can you measure the inner diameter of this side as well?

The most useful adapter for the Summitar, incidentally, is the SNHOO, which adapts common E39 filters and accessories to the lens's tapered thread. The originals are fairly rare, but replicas are available.

Edited November 6, 2022 by Anbaric

[Pyrogallol]

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Please show us the other side. It’s only guess work without seeing both sides.

[Anbaric]

By the way, what I assume is the the Leitz NY equivalent of the SOOGZ seems to have been given the obscure code ADSUMMI in some US catalogues, and their version of the SOOTF was presumably the ADSUM.

https://wiki.l-camera-forum.com/leica-wiki.de/images/4/40/Leitz-NY_Price_List_6-1953_total.pdf

https://www.pacificrimcamera.com/rl/00974/00974.pdf

But it won't be either of these if it has no thread on the other side.

The old Leica Accessory Guide (p98) mentions adapters with 34mm mounts with set screws for Wratten 32mm filters called MOUNT and CHROM. Not sure what lens they are supposed to fit if these measurements are correct.

https://www.cameramanuals.org/leica_pdf/leica_accessory_guide.pdf

There might be better information in the Laney Leica Collectors Guide if anyone has that handy.

Edited November 6, 2022 by Anbaric

[zeitz]

Leitz used several different ways to mount accessories to the front of lenses.  Accessories included filters, hoods, close-up devices and bellows shades.  The A series filters are slip-on and later clamp-on filters.  The E series filters are threaded filters.  Some lenses have circumferential groves like in the photo above for pinch-on hoods and the bellows shade.  

So Leitz made these adapters to allow lens accessories to be shared with lenses having different size fronts.  SOOGZ seems to be the most common.  But you may well have ADSUM, MOUNT or CHROME being it is of E. Leitz NY origin.

Laney's Second Edition has about 11 pages on this topic, starting on page 393.  There one can see how complex a topic this is.

[midnightcommander]

Good morning, all and thanks for the replies.

@MarkP and @Pyrogallol, here's the flip side. There's not a lot to see and I'm sorry I haven't taken the time to clean it up. There's no filter thread or thread of any kind. Whatever this is intended to attach to must be held in place by the screw's action on the clamp.

I agree with @Anbaric that it make sense that it'd attach to a lens but it's almost exactly the same diameter as the Summitar so it's not for this one. The agency that sold the lens also has a same-era 35mm lens for sale (out of my price range) so perhaps it and this camera/lens combo were part of the same photographer's kit and  this got separated and put up for sale separately.

@250swb, the camera came with a very nice IROOA that says it fits the 50mm f2, f2.8 and f3.5 lenses.

I'm going to presume it belongs to something no longer with the camera. Being new to Lecias I'd hoped I'd find some use for it.

Thanks, everyone.

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Edited November 6, 2022 by midnightcommander
Miss Spelling

[midnightcommander]

Thanks, too, for the reference links and assosicated tips!

[midnightcommander]

Here's the camera in question, BTW.

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[Pyrogallol]

Thanks.

Now it does look like an adaptor to fit the tapered Summitar filters onto an A36 lens. I think I can see the threads at the bottom of the smooth tapered front.

This is what a Summitar filter looks like, in chrome or black mount.

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[midnightcommander]

Thanks, @Pyrogallol. It's a shame I can't use this. It even came with its own leather case...

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[Pyrogallol]

You have got the Summitar lens. When you get a Summitar filter you can use it on a 50mm or 90mm Elmar lens, when you get them as well.

[midnightcommander]

I'm sure this obsession will be as hard to resist as all of my other obsessions but I've got to get the rubberized shutter curtain repaired on this before I start dropping cash on new gear for it.

[250swb]

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[Anbaric]

19 minutes ago, midnightcommander said:

I'm sure this obsession will be as hard to resist as all of my other obsessions but I've got to get the rubberized shutter curtain repaired on this before I start dropping cash on new gear for it.

Probably wise!

If you are tempted in future a 9cm Elmar would complement the Summitar very well, and isn't very expensive by Leica standards (you can also still find the matching viewfinder, SGVOO, for reasonable prices). So maybe your ADSUM/SOOTF will come in handy one day! But personally I've never bothered with the Summitar filters - with a SNHOO for the Summitar and a SOOGZ for any A36 lenses you can standardise on E39 filters and buy current ones with modern coatings. Unfortunately the SOOGZ is a bit expensive these days. The original SNHOO is less common, but if anything cheaper when it does turn up because you can get modern copies on ebay (I wish whoever makes these would do the same for the SOOGZ).

[romualdo]

this looks like a SOOTF (13079) / ADSUM (NY vers of SOOTF)

as per Laney p 398: Adaper to use bayonet mount Summarit and screw mount Summitar filters on 36mm (type "H") lenses

ie enables summitar filters to be used on 5cm Elmar

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[midnightcommander]

Thanks, @romualdo. I'll put it aside. Might come in handy sometime in the future.