New Firmware 1.3.0 for Leica M11 (and Fotos app updated to 3.1.0)

[anickpick]

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vor 4 Minuten schrieb SrMi:

How do you determine that you have blown-out highlights?

raw, Lightroom classic, no changes, areas of white are blown out (alt method)

 

[rim_light]

2 hours ago, SrMi said:

The highlight-weighted metering seems more usable than with non-Leica cameras (e.g., Nikon). It looks like it simulates ETTR, as it always protects the highlights but increases exposure in low contrast scenes.
I will try to use it as default metering. However, it may be less useful for JPG shooters.

As a beta tester I made a lot of tests with this metering and can second that. The headroom with the new sensor is very good and that might irritate long term Leica users, because that's not usual with the M sensors. For my finding, Leica did a good job here.

[SrMi]

1 minute ago, anickpick said:

raw, Lightroom classic, no changes, areas of white are blown out (alt method)

 

Lightroom cannot detect blown highlights reliably. You need Rawdigger for that. However, if you apply max negative highlights and exposure and still do not see details, the highlights are likely blown.

[LBJ2]

Woot Woot ! Just what I was waiting for...M11 Firmware update via the FOTOS app is now live.

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Easy update OTA. Just a few minutes, then a restart and Voila M11 @ v1.3.0.0. I like it ! Hope Leica will enable this for the SL2 as well. 

Edited March 29, 2022 by LBJ2

[Sean ASA]

3 hours ago, Overgaard said:

The glitch of slow Low continuous speed has been fixed, I meant. Do you agree on that?

The missing shots with Single is still there, I thik we agree on that: And I think I will conclude by now that it will never be fixed. Because of all the shutter movements to take a single photo, there is a limit for how fast you dan do the next single. And as the shutter movement is not predictable (sometimes it stays open, sometimes it closes after a single shot), it's just a bad idea to use the Leica M11 in single shooting mode (when you need to fire more fast because something is happening). 
Not that I like it, but I think that is it. That's how it works, and the way to not have to worry about it is to set the Leica M11 to Low continuous. 

Would this be a reasonable single shot FW option. All of the movement is 'caused' by the meter reading off the sensor. From open to closed/fire re-open. I don't always need a new exposure reading when conditions are steady. Would you favour an option via FN button to close the shutter and disable the meter.  Keep the manual settings you last set and simply fire the shutter with an opening / closing action, in the traditional manor.   

[Overgaard]

5 hours ago, Tailwagger said:

On the plus side, I just did a quick torture test with the 28mm 'lux and I'm pleased to report that is would appear as though the severe fringing problems have been addressed. SooC DNG no processing. Yes, there's some fringing, as should be expected, but no where near the amounts I was previously encountering.   

 

I just did a test similar to the time yesterday, and I don't see the purple fringing of the 28/1.4 is likely to have improved. In my example/test photo it is actually worse, which is likely because I did this one an hour later (different setting of the sun). 

Not going to post the photos now, will do another round that show the actual difference, if any. 

I tested the 21/1.4, 50APO, 50/1.4 and Noctilux as well yesterday. 28/1.4 and Nocti have the most purple fringing. Will get back to it later with samples 

 

[Tailwagger]

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20 minutes ago, Overgaard said:

I just did a test similar to the time yesterday, and I don't see the purple fringing of the 28/1.4 is likely to have improved. In my example/test photo it is actually worse, which is likely because I did this one an hour later (different setting of the sun). 

Not going to post the photos now, will do another round that show the actual difference, if any. 

I tested the 21/1.4, 50APO, 50/1.4 and Noctilux as well yesterday. 28/1.4 and Nocti have the most purple fringing. Will get back to it later with samples 

Hmm... As I said, quick test, only a couple of shots and of course not controlled conditions.  I deleted most of them, but the couple I have left really do seem improved to me.  There's definitely purple, but no OoF translucent purple branches.  I was shooting wide open, but with the focus distance around 6-8 meters which perhaps was too deep when checking branches at infinity.  I'll try to do some more tomorrow. 

[scott kirkpatrick]

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Highlight metered, max shadow uplift applied in COne to bring up the foreground.  Exposure correction my normal -0.3 stop.  I didn't shoot all metering modes, but I estimate that Highlight shifted things down about two stops.  Even when I pointed the camera down so that only the upright columns (the brightest part of the image) were in the picture, it only increased the exposure by half a stop.

[ZHNL]

Looks like half press shutter lock exposure works now. Before I can only lock once, now it locks as long as I half press the shutter. 

Start up with Uncoded lens seems works fine as well during my brief test. (however, this one didnt show up all the time, it requires more test to confirm) 

[cldp]

WARNING:  Leica has sent the following message to M11 dealers telling them to tell their customers NOT to install the Firmware Update 1.3.0.0 that is STILL on their website for downloading and installing. Makes me wonder if anyone is in charge there.

 

Our sincere apologies but the firmware availability outlined in Leica Camera Memo 2022 - 40 has been delayed. Due to technical issues we cannot ensure the availability of the M11 Firmware Update 1.3.0.0 on the corporate website. Please do not communicate the latest firmware update until further notice. We will provide additional information on the firmware release when the launch date becomes available from Germany.

[scott kirkpatrick]

Installed the 1.3.0.0 manually, then went to my two iPads to try the new edition of Fotos.  One worked, one didn't  (an older 12" Pro worked right away, an iPro Mini that is newer did not work.  It connected and then disconnected on several tries.)  I tried, on the working iPad, setting highlight Weight metering, but Fotos does not offer that.  The camera came up in highlight, but Fotos could not say what mode this was.  I changed to other modes (with visible change in results, and disconnected, leaving it in Matrix, which was confirmed to stay set that way after Fotos shut off.  So Fotos sorta works...  I could not try firmware installation.

[harmen]

2 hours ago, Tailwagger said:

Hmm... As I said, quick test, only a couple of shots and of course not controlled conditions.  I deleted most of them, but the couple I have left really do seem improved to me.  There's definitely purple, but no OoF translucent purple branches.  I was shooting wide open, but with the focus distance around 6-8 meters which perhaps was too deep when checking branches at infinity.  I'll try to do some more tomorrow. 

I also just repeated my test with a desk lamp and the 28 lux.  I see exactly the same amount of purple as I had before.  At the time I already concluded that what I see is likely true chromatic aberration caused by the lens: aperture has a strong impact, while exposure does not.  Also I do not use automatic white balance.  I remember you commented in another discussion that you suspected that what you see may partially be the automatic white balance.  Combining all these different observations, I suspect that:

1. True chromatic aberration (lens not focusing all colours onto the same plane and/or projecting different sizes) is still there.  After all that is due to the lens.  (I personally also do not find it annoying, as it's tiny and just because the sensor resolves so much detail.)
2. Automatic white balance has been fixed
3. Blooming / over exposure may or may not have been addressed with some kind of defringing, though I doubt it.  Not even sure it was an issue to start with.

I hope your red mist is now gone 😜

Edited March 30, 2022 by harmen

[scott kirkpatrick]

32 minutes ago, cldp said:

WARNING:  Leica has sent the following message to M11 dealers telling them to tell their customers NOT to install the Firmware Update 1.3.0.0 that is STILL on their website for downloading and installing. Makes me wonder if anyone is in charge there.

 

Our sincere apologies but the firmware availability outlined in Leica Camera Memo 2022 - 40 has been delayed. Due to technical issues we cannot ensure the availability of the M11 Firmware Update 1.3.0.0 on the corporate website. Please do not communicate the latest firmware update until further notice. We will provide additional information on the firmware release when the launch date becomes available from Germany.

Well, it came out kind of late in the month.  Maybe there had beeninternal communication expecting an earlier date, and this message, which took some time to arrive was a warning.

[Tailwagger]

2 minutes ago, harmen said:

I also just repeated my test with a desk lamp.  I see exactly the same amount of purple as I had before.  At the time I already concluded that what I see is likely true chromatic aberration caused by the lens: aperture has a strong impact, while exposure does not.  Also I do not use automatic white balance.  I remember you commented in another discussion that you suspected that what you see may partially be the automatic white balance.  Combining all these different observations, I suspect that:

1. True chromatic aberration (lens not focusing all colours onto the same plane and/or projecting different sizes) is still there.  After all that is due to the lens.  (I personally also do not find it annoying, as it's tiny and just because the sensor resolves so much detail.)
2. Automatic white balance has been fixed
3. Blooming / over exposure may or may not have been addressed with some kind of defringing, though I doubt it.  Not even sure it was an issue to start with.

Certainly #1 is inarguable. I'm reserving judgement around WB until I get more time, but it so far it does seem improved.  Can't say about #3 either way. I recall reading that BSI sensors can be more prone to such things, so it could easily be, as was so often the case in my former life, that as much as we'd like a singular explanation for the 'bug', it may be that the purple problem is exacerbated by an combination of issues. More hands and eyes will hopefully help to characterize things better.

[Tailwagger]

44 minutes ago, cldp said:

WARNING:  Leica has sent the following message to M11 dealers telling them to tell their customers NOT to install the Firmware Update 1.3.0.0 that is STILL on their website for downloading and installing. Makes me wonder if anyone is in charge there.

Well, at least my camera hasn't bricked itself... yet.  Given the cat left the bag and is roaming around in the wild, it might be nice if they let us know a little about what problems those of us who've installed it might run into.  Makes me curious if there are any LUF beta testers helping out or if they're choosing to keep all the testing in house at the moment. 

[M Journey]

1 hour ago, cldp said:

WARNING:  Leica has sent the following message to M11 dealers telling them to tell their customers NOT to install the Firmware Update 1.3.0.0 that is STILL on their website for downloading and installing. Makes me wonder if anyone is in charge there.

 

Our sincere apologies but the firmware availability outlined in Leica Camera Memo 2022 - 40 has been delayed. Due to technical issues we cannot ensure the availability of the M11 Firmware Update 1.3.0.0 on the corporate website. Please do not communicate the latest firmware update until further notice. We will provide additional information on the firmware release when the launch date becomes available from Germany.

Hmm, I was just going to install the firmware.  The new file save options for SD and internal memory are what I’ve been wanting.  Guess I can wait a few more days to make sure the firmware doesn’t have any bugs.

[JimKnopf]

vor 2 Stunden schrieb cldp:

WARNING:  Leica has sent the following message to M11 dealers telling them to tell their customers NOT to install the Firmware Update 1.3.0.0 that is STILL on their website for downloading and installing. Makes me wonder if anyone is in charge there.

 

Our sincere apologies but the firmware availability outlined in Leica Camera Memo 2022 - 40 has been delayed. Due to technical issues we cannot ensure the availability of the M11 Firmware Update 1.3.0.0 on the corporate website. Please do not communicate the latest firmware update until further notice. We will provide additional information on the firmware release when the launch date becomes available from Germany.

so the currently delivered version 1.3 is faulty and should not be installed?

i dont understand this method. Dammm

[harmen]

A delay in availability is what that message was about... doesn't sound like it's about a bug.  Who knows when that message was sent?

[scott kirkpatrick]

1 hour ago, Tailwagger said:

Well, at least my camera hasn't bricked itself... yet.  Given the cat left the bag and is roaming around in the wild, it might be nice if they let us know a little about what problems those of us who've installed it might run into.  Makes me curious if there are any LUF beta testers helping out or if they're choosing to keep all the testing in house at the moment. 

There were LUF beta testers, and the firmware has been stable for a while.  Some serious bugs got squashed ("stability improvements" is code for, hopefully, no more bricks).  Some annoying idiosyncracies remain, but as far as I am aware they have workarounds.  And access to the two storage chips, one internal and one external, is still incomplete.  There is one more,  sensible way to put the data away, but getting it back out is very restricted.  I expect that is still in the pipeline.  

I would chalk the scary message up to the fact that Leica had promised new firmware in March and was having trouble deciding just when to cut off and double-check everything before release.  Plus bureaucracy.

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[hmzimelka]

4 hours ago, Tailwagger said:

Well, at least my camera hasn't bricked itself... yet.  Given the cat left the bag and is roaming around in the wild, it might be nice if they let us know a little about what problems those of us who've installed it might run into.  Makes me curious if there are any LUF beta testers helping out or if they're choosing to keep all the testing in house at the moment. 

I was concerned initially and kept telling myself to hold off updating for a few days. This message kind of confirms that this is perhaps the most reasonable thing to do with Leica. 

Reminds me of Garmin sports and cycling devices, where users have update anxiety... new updates are risky business. 

Ugh. Hope it's nothing serious, and that it only has to do with availability for download. My download failed 4 times before I successfully downloaded the entire file.

Edited March 30, 2022 by hmzimelka