Leica IIIb CLA by Youxin Ye

[BenG]

Advertisement (gone after registration)

Here are photos of a camera I got back in the mail from Youxin Ye today. He "cla'd" the camera for $190 and replaced a bad screw on top of it for an addition $20. He said in email that the camera had a lot of mold in it, and it is my guess that it still does, along with much else that does not belong in it. I have training as a watchmaker, where I was taught how to take a mechanical watch apart, clean it, examine all the parts for wear, then repair or replace the parts and oil the watch as it was being put back together. I did not attempt the work on this camera myself because if someone else reputable would do it for $190 there would be no reason to. I am just pointing out that I know what a CLA on a precision machine entails and looks like. When you assemble a fine mechanical watch, the oil goes into the pivot points where the gear-shafts run in the jewel-bearings or bushings, and there is no excess oil anywhere as if it gets in the wrong place on the watch it will stop it from being accurate. This camera is literally dripping oil, oil is everywhere. The first thing I did after unboxing it was take the bottom plate off and there were oil drops on it, I smeared them with my finger to see what they were as I did not expect them there. But in the body of the camera it is now coated with a film of oil in most places. I was surprised when looking at the camera from the outside that I could see specs of dirt and hair inside the lens mount and inside the viewfinder, when I shined a flashlight inside the camera it looked filthy as if there was a lot of dirt in it, to back this up I put a cotton swab into two places in the camera and it easily made the swab dirty, with dirty oil and small and large specs of dirt etc.. Youxin Ye had this camera for over three months, I don't know what he was doing those three months, but he was not cleaning this camera. I told him I did not want the camera covered because a friend of mine offered to do it with some custom leather. I am extra glad he did not cover it now as there was no attempt to remove dirt or oxidation from the outside of this camera. You can see where the bottom-plate sits on the camera a line of crud which I can easily remove with a fingernail, but Youxin Ye could not be bothered to even attempt to make the exterior of the camera any cleaner at all. The only improvement I can see in the cameras operation is now the low-speed range works where before it did not, and I would not put money on the speeds being accurate going by the "clean" part of this "cla". I think there is a good chance that if you put a fine clean lens on this camera it has a good chance of being infected with mold and/or being covered with oil mist and dirt, and the film you put in it certainly will get oil and dirt on it. I sent these photos to Mr. Ye and his reply was "I did the best I could.". If I can remove dirt easily with a cotton swab or a fingernail, that is a statement I can not believe.

Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here…

Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!

[Advertisement]

The Leica Q3 is available for pre-order at B&H Photo Video and Adorama

[BenG]

Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here…

Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!

[prk60091]

I have had a M4 and M2 and some lens CLA'd with him in the past...there is something definitely wrong here.

[250swb]

That is pretty bad if all a lube means is covering everything in oil. And that debris isn't acceptable at all, repairers can fake a lube job but they can't fake cleaning the camera of the years of crap.

[LocalHero1953]

A sign of someone having taken on more work than they can handle? Or taken on an apprentice, inadequately supervised?

[stray cat]

My M2 is with Youxin at the moment. He's done exemplary work for me in the past and I expect that I'll get exemplary work back this time. I am sorry to see that this has been your experience, and I suspect that Paul is correct in what he speculates (above). Certainly well below the standard you could expect and I am both surprised and disappointed.

[BenG]

Advertisement (gone after registration)

   It does not matter if he has taken on more work than he can handle,  and guessing that he has an apprentice is meaningless as making any other wild guess. I sent him these photos, and he emailed me more than once with his input on the camera, so saying he did not work on it or see it 100% false.

     There is zero excuse for this. I looked at the camera more since I made the original post and found much more dirt and crud and corrosion in places there should not be.

      My educated guess with my background in watchmaking and many other mechanical disciplines,  is that most of the cameras he works on are not that dirty and have intact covers or he recovers them for the customer, and that makes it much easier to hide shoddy work.

      The smart thing for a con-man to do would be to go the extra mile on an uncovered camera that would be less able to show the lack of care and shoddy work, so to have this camera delivered in this state, and to have him say nothing after being sent these photos and asked about it, just makes it much more of a sure thing that when he is sent very clean looking cameras, he is doing no more to them or even less. This camera was not cleaned, not lubricated competently, and with those two strikes only a fool would assume that it is competently adjusted either.

        I will make sure that neither I, nor anyone I know well, ever gives Youxin Ye another penny.

     

     

      

     

 

      

 

Edited March 8, 2022 by BenG

[Anbaric]

A poster in this old thread on RFF mentions something similar, and quotes Sherry Krauter's supposed opinion of the job. But to be fair, other posters were very pleased with his work on multiple occasions:

https://www.photrio.com/forum/threads/suggestions-for-minor-leica-repair.41485/

[Anbaric]

1 hour ago, Anbaric said:

A poster in this old thread on RFF mentions something similar, and quotes Sherry Krauter's supposed opinion of the job. But to be fair, other posters were very pleased with his work on multiple occasions:

https://www.photrio.com/forum/threads/suggestions-for-minor-leica-repair.41485/

RFF Photrio.

[Michael Hiles]

I am sorry to hear of your bad experience with Mr. Ye. He CLA’d my M3 and also my M2 (plus a recover). It was all done well. And both cameras feel like new. No issues.

[rfaspen]

I had an ambivalent experience.  Sent a lens to be cleaned up (haze) and focus tab attached.  A month or two later I sent the lens to Don. ( Much better now).  The focus tab fell off, so I sent the lens to Don just to be sure it would stay.  I can't tell if the lens internals are any cleaner.  Others report varying experiences with YY (both good and bad).  Don is more expensive, but my experiences have not varied.  So that's my current strategy.

[LocalHero1953]

7 hours ago, BenG said:

   It does not matter if he has taken on more work than he can handle,  and guessing that he has an apprentice is meaningless as making any other wild guess. I sent him these photos, and he emailed me more than once with his input on the camera, so saying he did not work on it or see it 100% false.

Hey, get angry with him, not me. I'm not offering an excuse for the bad work, just trying to suggest why your experience is bad while others' has been good.
Don't post here if you don't want any replies.

[nitroplait]

I recall that ~20 years ago when I first noticed YY's name on photo.net; there were very polarised opinions about his services.

The negatives where along the lines of "drenched in oil" and "learning to repair on customers cameras" and at least one reputable repair person that pointed fingers.
The positives were praising his low price and fast turnaround time as well as YY having less "attitude" than the usual repair suspects - often followed by the nodescript "works great", "smooth like butter" and other diffuse praise. 

The big problem is that very few are able to judge the quality of a repair job.

With all the neurotic Leica users sending off working cameras for preventive CLA's I thought of this business idea:

I will set up a repair service offering a "full preventive CLA service" for $175 with a 3 week turnaround time and a 6 month warranty.
I would promise a CLA but only open the top and remove dust from the rangefinder and wipe exterior surfaces, take peoples money and return the camera with a little piece of chocolate.
If people complain I would promptly refund their money.

I imagine I would have lots of happy customers and a comfortable side income.

[wizard]

vor einer Stunde schrieb nitroplait:

I imagine I would have lots of happy customers and a comfortable side income.

I bet you would.

[Anbaric]

2 hours ago, nitroplait said:

I will set up a repair service offering a "full preventive CLA service" for $175 with a 3 week turnaround time and a 6 month warranty.
I would promise a CLA but only open the top and remove dust from the rangefinder and wipe exterior surfaces, take peoples money and return the camera with a little piece of chocolate.
If people complain I would promptly refund their money.

I imagine I would have lots of happy customers and a comfortable side income.

If you go on the Leica factory tour, then demo an M-A in the shop and ask them to show you how to load a film, you can advertise yourself as 'Wetzlar trained'.

[250swb]

8 hours ago, nitroplait said:

 

With all the neurotic Leica users sending off working cameras for preventive CLA's I thought of this business idea:

 

And the knee jerk reaction when somebody comes to the forum to announce they've bought a Leica is to 'send it for a CLA' whether or not there is a problem with it, so we generally (but not me, and not you) are feeding this paranoia! So I hope your new business model fails in the nicest possible way, 😁 And hopefully we can reduce the worlds consumption of oil at the same time.

Edited March 8, 2022 by 250swb

[earleygallery]

8 hours ago, nitroplait said:

I recall that ~20 years ago when I first noticed YY's name on photo.net; there were very polarised opinions about his services.

The negatives where along the lines of "drenched in oil" and "learning to repair on customers cameras" and at least one reputable repair person that pointed fingers.
The positives were praising his low price and fast turnaround time as well as YY having less "attitude" than the usual repair suspects - often followed by the nodescript "works great", "smooth like butter" and other diffuse praise. 

The big problem is that very few are able to judge the quality of a repair job.

With all the neurotic Leica users sending off working cameras for preventive CLA's I thought of this business idea:

I will set up a repair service offering a "full preventive CLA service" for $175 with a 3 week turnaround time and a 6 month warranty.
I would promise a CLA but only open the top and remove dust from the rangefinder and wipe exterior surfaces, take peoples money and return the camera with a little piece of chocolate.
If people complain I would promptly refund their money.

I imagine I would have lots of happy customers and a comfortable side income.

I'm certain it's a winner. I previously offered a 'Leica spa' - send your Leica to me, with £££'s and I'll keep it for a few months, then return it to you in a fancy box/packaging with a signed certificate saying that it's been at the 'Leica spa' and is now fully refreshed.

Amazingly nobody took me up on the offer, yet they do continue to send perfectly good gear off for CLA's for god knows what!

[BenG]

13 hours ago, nitroplait said:

I recall that ~20 years ago when I first noticed YY's name on photo.net; there were very polarised opinions about his services.

The negatives where along the lines of "drenched in oil" and "learning to repair on customers cameras" and at least one reputable repair person that pointed fingers.
The positives were praising his low price and fast turnaround time as well as YY having less "attitude" than the usual repair suspects - often followed by the nodescript "works great", "smooth like butter" and other diffuse praise. 

The big problem is that very few are able to judge the quality of a repair job.

With all the neurotic Leica users sending off working cameras for preventive CLA's I thought of this business idea:

I will set up a repair service offering a "full preventive CLA service" for $175 with a 3 week turnaround time and a 6 month warranty.
I would promise a CLA but only open the top and remove dust from the rangefinder and wipe exterior surfaces, take peoples money and return the camera with a little piece of chocolate.
If people complain I would promptly refund their money.

I imagine I would have lots of happy customers and a comfortable side income.

 I believe that is very close to what Youxin Ye has going. Leica cameras are no expensive, trendy jewelry and most of those buying them up in recent years to participate in the fashion trend, especially those who dump thousands of dollars into the "hobby" are sending Mr. Ye very nice cameras which he has to do very little to almost nothing on before shipping them back to owners who have close to zero mechanical knowledge. It is easy to look good cleaning things that are already in good shape. But if you have to work on a turd like my Leica IIIB and you are not a real mechanic then it is going to show, and in my opinion that is what happened. In his last email to me Youxin Ye said he "did his best", and I believe what he said about his abilities is true, he is not up to anything more than easy repairs which most could do who have some mechanical ability and patience.

       I paid practically zero for this IIIB camera body, but now I have more in it than it is worth and aside from the low-speed range working it is no different than when I found it in a barn, it still needs a CLA. I am just going to throw it in storage until maybe next winter when I might have time to take it apart and do it myself.

 

[Advertisement]

Hallo,

Look here: Interesting Leica gear

[stray cat]

OK, you know what? I'm getting a little tired of reading comments on this thread to the effect that anyone who is happy with work that's been done by Youxin Ye has no idea what they're talking about and that all he's good for is "cleaning things that are already in good shape". I say again what I said before - he's done exemplary work for me in the past and I expect him to do no less with my M2 that is in his possession at the moment. If, when I get it back, this doesn't prove to be the case, then I'll be sure to post it here. I do have a very good idea what excellent work is, so please don't think you're the sole arbiter of that. I sent him a pair of hazy Summarons that had been worked on here in Melbourne and all that was done here was to kind of polish a little porthole of clear glass in the centre and leave the rest of the lens hazy. In frustration I sent them all the way to the USA, choosing Youxin Ye as my son was living in Boston at the time and I figured he could go pick them up or whatever if need be. However that didn't need to happen as I received the lenses back just three weeks after having sent them off and they were sparkling. Absolutely brilliant - still are. The M2 he has now was also worked on here by the Leica authorized service centre and came back with the frame counter spinning with no resistance, so no way to tell how many frames I'd use. I've asked him to fix that.

So, Ben, I think I speak on behalf of all of us that we're sorry to hear you had a bad experience, but please refrain from trying to colour those of us who have had good experiences with the man as dumbasses who've been tricked into thinking we had a good job done because we don't know any better. And to be honest, man, you've said your piece now so just suck it up and move on.

[BenG]

5 hours ago, stray cat said:

 I do have a very good idea what excellent work is,

 

This is why I put up my history of having training in repairing mechanical wrist-watches. My father was a mechanic who was a dealer for British motorcycles sixty years ago and I have been working on mechanical things since then, worked as a metal fabricator and am a union-trained electrician and went to school for the tool@die trade, so when I say I know what good work is it might mean something more than when everyone on the internet who is having others do work for them instead of doing it themselves saying they know what good work  is. And it is why I gave the reason for trying out Mr. Ye, his price for a CLA is so low that there is no way he is doing any extensive work on any cameras he is sent unless he charges extra so that he gets much more than his $190 base fee. A well-known Zeiss mechanic on the west coast of the USA can charge five or more times $190 to take a rangefinder apart, clean it, repair it and put it back together with lube, and he is not making a lot of profit on that service, so there is no way anyone charging $190 is dong anywhere near the same caliber work, but it was interesting to give them a try just to confirm that, a cheap gamble, and I got exactly what I paid for, nearly nothing.