SrMi Posted January 20, 2022 Share #1 Posted January 20, 2022 (edited) Advertisement (gone after registration) I am comparing M11 (top image) and SL2-S (bottom image) at ISO 12500. Same lens, same exposure. Both images with Cobalt Standard profile. Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Edited January 20, 2022 by SrMi 4 5 Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/328761-m11-vs-sl2-s-at-iso-12500/?do=findComment&comment=4361977'>More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted January 20, 2022 Posted January 20, 2022 Hi SrMi, Take a look here M11 vs. SL2-S at ISO 12500. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
SrMi Posted January 20, 2022 Author Share #2 Posted January 20, 2022 ISO, 12800, underexposed 3 stops and lifted in Lightroom +3. (M11 top, SL2-S bottom) Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! 5 8 Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/328761-m11-vs-sl2-s-at-iso-12500/?do=findComment&comment=4361986'>More sharing options...
digitalfx Posted January 20, 2022 Share #3 Posted January 20, 2022 THANKS! looks like they are great companions. The SL2S does a tad better job under stress, but looks like they nailed the colors on M11. Just a bit more contrast and color sat vs SL2S 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SrMi Posted January 20, 2022 Author Share #4 Posted January 20, 2022 9 minutes ago, digitalfx said: THANKS! looks like they are great companions. The SL2S does a tad better job under stress, but looks like they nailed the colors on M11. Just a bit more contrast and color sat vs SL2S The current M11 PROFILE colors are bad at high ISO. Therefore, I highly recommend Cobalt profiles (at least) until Adobe has updated their software. SL2-S is still the champ for post-processing acrobatics :). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
erudolph Posted January 20, 2022 Share #5 Posted January 20, 2022 The Cobalt profiles are better than Adobe Color. As for the embedded Profile M11, it seems to disappear and I can't get it back once I've chosen another profile in LR. That said, the colors using AWB, to my taste, are way off. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SrMi Posted January 20, 2022 Author Share #6 Posted January 20, 2022 11 minutes ago, erudolph said: The Cobalt profiles are better than Adobe Color. As for the embedded Profile M11, it seems to disappear and I can't get it back once I've chosen another profile in LR. That said, the colors using AWB, to my taste, are way off. I agree. I have Cobalt profiles for all my cameras. The embedded PROFILE M11 can be found when you click on Browse... and open Profiles group. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
adan Posted January 20, 2022 Share #7 Posted January 20, 2022 Advertisement (gone after registration) Thanks for these both. Most useful trials of really high ISO on the M11 I've seen yet. So M11 gets a tiny bit ratty with banding at an effective ISO 100000-ish (3-stop push: 12800 > 25600 > 50000 > 100000). But retaining quite good sharpness (fine print on the Colorchecker has clean edges) But that looks about like my vanilla M10(s) at an unpushed 12800-16000. So an advantage of somewhere between 2 and 3 stops over the M10. That's about as good as I could expect for a color sensor in 2022. 1.5-2 stops was my "target" (although one can never have too much ISO sensitivity ). And about what sold me on the M10 over my M9 five years ago. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chaemono Posted January 20, 2022 Share #8 Posted January 20, 2022 vor 1 Stunde schrieb SrMi: … SL2-S is still the champ for post-processing acrobatics :). That’s why an M11-S will be complementary. For tonal range and detail at high ISO M11, for post-professing acrobatics M11-S. That 33 MP α7 IV sensor m, were it to be used in an M11-S, would close the gap a bit for tonal range and detail, though. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
FrankX Posted January 20, 2022 Share #9 Posted January 20, 2022 To me, itI looks like the M11 is holding the colors at the highest ISO much better! Look, for example at the reddish/purple tones or the deep blues. Personally, I don't see too much difference (at this resolution!) regarding noise level, but colors seem to be way more stable at the pushed ISO photo. Thus, looking solely at these photos, for high ISO I would even choose the M11 over the SL2-S. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
shirubadanieru Posted January 20, 2022 Share #10 Posted January 20, 2022 5 hours ago, SrMi said: ISO, 12800, underexposed 3 stops and lifted in Lightroom +3. (M11 top, SL2-S bottom) Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! 12800 the SL2S does a much better job to my eyes, very clean with no banding at all. M11 colors are more contrasty but I prefer the approach of the SL2S. This would definitely not be an ISO setting I’d be comfortable using with the M11, so it seems that the ceiling might be 12500 for me. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chaemono Posted January 20, 2022 Share #11 Posted January 20, 2022 vor 18 Minuten schrieb shirubadanieru: 12800 the SL2S does a much better job to my eyes, very clean with no banding at all… +1. 24 MP seems to be the sweet spot for clean high ISO. From what I remember, there is also banding with the 33 MP sensor of the α7 IV at ISO 25600 and above. There is one 25000 ISO SL2-S picture here: https://www.smugmug.com/gallery/n-pFTMHP/ No banding in the dark areas whatsoever. It does lose color a bit, though. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
tom0511 Posted January 20, 2022 Share #12 Posted January 20, 2022 vor 5 Stunden schrieb SrMi: I agree. I have Cobalt profiles for all my cameras. The embedded PROFILE M11 can be found when you click on Browse... and open Profiles group. Which Cobalt profiles do you use? I am interested but dont know which one to buy/to get? 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sebben Posted January 20, 2022 Share #13 Posted January 20, 2022 (edited) The SL2-S sensor looks fantastic. It clearly has more exposure latitude, something that is missing from the M series. No banding on the +3 push, thats really nice to see as the M10 & M11show this. Maybe an M11-S with the SL2-S sensor would be just the ticket! Edited January 20, 2022 by sebben 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
FrankX Posted January 20, 2022 Share #14 Posted January 20, 2022 vor 4 Minuten schrieb sebben: The SL2-S sensor looks fantastic. No banding on the +3 push, thats really nice to see as the M10 shows the same thing as the M11 when you do that. Maybe an M11-S with the SL2-S sensor would be just the ticket! Usually, I do see banding if present. However, I don’t see it in the photos above. 🧐 Could you give me a hint where you see a banding effect? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sebben Posted January 20, 2022 Share #15 Posted January 20, 2022 (edited) 51 minutes ago, FrankX said: Usually, I do see banding if present. However, I don’t see it in the photos above. 🧐 Could you give me a hint where you see a banding effect? You can see the horizontal rows in the darker regions. Also the shadows have gone magenta. The SL2-S sensor doesn't have the lines and it doesn't go magenta ever instead keeps the shadows neutral. Perhaps your monitor is crushing the blacks ? Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Edited January 20, 2022 by sebben 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/328761-m11-vs-sl2-s-at-iso-12500/?do=findComment&comment=4362202'>More sharing options...
Chaemono Posted January 20, 2022 Share #16 Posted January 20, 2022 Unfortunately, anything above 24 MP in FF seems to have issues at high ISO. In case anyone is interested in ISO 12800 and above on 33 MP BSI sensor exposed to protect highlights, DSCO2538-DSC02540 ARW files for download here https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1oZzM7R3P6TAOUZM_PCRdXS8kKo3RwdJo No banding until exposure and/or shadows are pulled up but white pixels in the dark areas show. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SrMi Posted January 20, 2022 Author Share #17 Posted January 20, 2022 4 hours ago, tom0511 said: Which Cobalt profiles do you use? I am interested but dont know which one to buy/to get? I used Cobalt Standard, part of their Adobe and DNG Basic pack. In addition, I occasionally use Cobalt Repro (linear profile) when post-processing. With Cobalt, you must first buy the Adobe and DNG Basic pack. It is unique and different for each camera model. The film simulation packs can be shared between cameras. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SrMi Posted January 20, 2022 Author Share #18 Posted January 20, 2022 28 minutes ago, Chaemono said: Unfortunately, anything above 24 MP in FF seems to have issues at high ISO. In case anyone is interested in ISO 12800 and above on 33 MP BSI sensor exposed to protect highlights, DSCO2538-DSC02540 ARW files for download here https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1oZzM7R3P6TAOUZM_PCRdXS8kKo3RwdJo No banding until exposure and/or shadows are pulled up but white pixels in the dark areas show. Can you say that for all 24MP sensors (e.g., M10-P, Z 6) or is that for SL2-S (and S5) sensors? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SrMi Posted January 20, 2022 Author Share #19 Posted January 20, 2022 I am happy that forum members found this helpful. The different interpretation of the results was to be expected, so I posted them without an opinion. I compared M11 with SL2-S as I regard SL2-S as the "king of low light." IMO: The results from M11 look excellent, especially the non-pushed version. The banding is barely visible in the pushed tests and, depending on the scene, may not be visible at all. 1 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edax Posted January 20, 2022 Share #20 Posted January 20, 2022 5 hours ago, sebben said: The SL2-S sensor looks fantastic. It clearly has more exposure latitude, something that is missing from the M series. No banding on the +3 push, thats really nice to see as the M10 & M11show this. Maybe an M11-S with the SL2-S sensor would be just the ticket! M10-S would be great too 🙃 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now