pippy Posted January 31, 2022 Share #181 Posted January 31, 2022 Advertisement (gone after registration) 2 minutes ago, Dennis said: I see you made the math 🙂 Impressive tiny weight... The whole shooting-match also fits in to a very small bag! The one I had today(*) measures (externally) only 260mm x 200mm x 150mm yet it contained the Monochrom with the Elmarit fitted; the M-D with my 35mm Summilux fitted; the 28 TTA; my '53 50mm f1.5 Summarit and my 75mm Summarit. All the lenses had filters and hoods fitted. I also had spare batteries, notebook, phone etc...etc...etc...and the bag was still not full! Philip. * A s/h Billingham f5.6 in their usual khaki (and not Olive and which was produced between 1991 and 1996) which I only received on Saturday so today was a 'test-day' for the bag, too; https://billingham.co.uk/products/f5-6-camera-bag 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted January 31, 2022 Posted January 31, 2022 Hi pippy, Take a look here TTArtisan 28mm f5.6. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
Photoworks Posted January 31, 2022 Share #182 Posted January 31, 2022 Here are some samples of the 28mm TTartison on the M11 it is very good for the price... Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! I didn't have a Leica lens handy, but here is a comparison to 21SEM, what is a better lens.. 28mm f 5.6 21 SEM at 3.4 7 Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! I didn't have a Leica lens handy, but here is a comparison to 21SEM, what is a better lens.. 28mm f 5.6 21 SEM at 3.4 ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/326776-ttartisan-28mm-f56/?do=findComment&comment=4373360'>More sharing options...
NigelG Posted January 31, 2022 Share #183 Posted January 31, 2022 Yes re the optical formula it’s obviously not similar to the Summaron - I was thinking that the external appearance might have “thrown” people who thought it would render similarly and were then disappointed... I haven’t tested it re flare but that’s not usually a big concern for me. I think there is some distortion but this is not a lens I’ll be using to shoot anything critical - it’s a “knockabout” alternative to my Summicron ASPH v2 - so I’m not too bothered. Bottom line is it’s decently made, cheap, tiny and almost turns my M9M into my GR II 🙄 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dennis Posted February 1, 2022 Share #184 Posted February 1, 2022 2 hours ago, Photoworks said: Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! 28mm f 5.6 21 SEM at 3.4 For a second I saw the last picture and I said Wow. Then I realize wasn't the TTA Of course SEM is SEM 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pippy Posted February 1, 2022 Share #185 Posted February 1, 2022 (edited) Just a little bit more (honestly) before I pack-away yesterday's test pics for good. I've looked for any traces of vignetting and distortion in my images and can't see anything to complain about at all. What did I do 'Right'?...Here is one typical frame which should show examples of both - if present - but these aberrations are notable by their absence. I've also dropped a 'virtual' ruler on many of the (Dutch-Angle) horizontals / verticals and they are all ram-rod straight; Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! FWIW the lens-profile is set to that of the 28mm f2.8 Elmarit v3; don't know if that had any effect on dialling-out any would-be issues or not from the end-result. I'd love to do a 'No-Profile' and as-shot comparison but it looks like I'm not going to have a chance for any snapping-fun today as my next work-project is arriving on the 'morrow and, as it's going to be a biggie (as in three or four months), I must spend today in studio-preparation and so on. Hopefully the weather this coming weekend will allow for a bit more TTA play-time?... Philip. Edited February 1, 2022 by pippy 1 Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! FWIW the lens-profile is set to that of the 28mm f2.8 Elmarit v3; don't know if that had any effect on dialling-out any would-be issues or not from the end-result. I'd love to do a 'No-Profile' and as-shot comparison but it looks like I'm not going to have a chance for any snapping-fun today as my next work-project is arriving on the 'morrow and, as it's going to be a biggie (as in three or four months), I must spend today in studio-preparation and so on. Hopefully the weather this coming weekend will allow for a bit more TTA play-time?... Philip. ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/326776-ttartisan-28mm-f56/?do=findComment&comment=4373687'>More sharing options...
Huss Posted February 1, 2022 Share #186 Posted February 1, 2022 (edited) 17 hours ago, Photoworks said: Here are some samples of the 28mm TTartison on the M11 it is very good for the price... Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! I didn't have a Leica lens handy, but here is a comparison to 21SEM, what is a better lens.. 28mm f 5.6 21 SEM at 3.4 While the flare is very bad in the first pic - just a veiling mess - to be fair to the TT lens the angle is not the same. Nor is the distance from camera to subject - 28mm vs 21mm but filling the same frame. But if the lighting IS the same in both, then the TT is bad w re. to flare. Edited February 1, 2022 by Huss Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pippy Posted February 1, 2022 Share #187 Posted February 1, 2022 Advertisement (gone after registration) 1 hour ago, Huss said: ...if the lighting IS the same in both, then the TT is bad w re. to flare... I've no idea why there is so much veiling flare in that snap. I tried to introduce flare various times - both with the sun just outside and just inside the picture area - during my test 'thing' yesterday and the only time I succeeded was when the very bright late afternoon sun was well inside the frame and even then the flare only really affected the area immediately surrounding the sun. Here is an example. First-off is a crop from the following image. There is a slight amount of flare which is affecting the contrast on the top-right-hand area of the image... Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ...which is hardly surprising when the position of the exceptionally bright sun is taken into account; For anything less than this amount of exceptional sunlight there was never any issues whatsoever. I was using a coated filter and the supplied lenshood which certainly might have helped with those frames when the sun was outside the picture area but considering how well the lens coped with practically everything I tried I'd really like to know why the veiling flare in the 5th image in Photoworks' post is so terrible. Most odd. Philip. 1 Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ...which is hardly surprising when the position of the exceptionally bright sun is taken into account; For anything less than this amount of exceptional sunlight there was never any issues whatsoever. I was using a coated filter and the supplied lenshood which certainly might have helped with those frames when the sun was outside the picture area but considering how well the lens coped with practically everything I tried I'd really like to know why the veiling flare in the 5th image in Photoworks' post is so terrible. Most odd. Philip. ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/326776-ttartisan-28mm-f56/?do=findComment&comment=4374116'>More sharing options...
TomB_tx Posted February 1, 2022 Share #188 Posted February 1, 2022 I received the lens a few days ago, and can readily cause veiling flare even indoors if the light source is just outside a top corner of the frame. Light source directly above doesn't seem flare prone. Looking at the lens mount from the rear, that's a lot of flat bright brass facing the sensor. That might be part of the cause of flare, as Leica made a strong point that the back of the Summarit series had blackened these areas to reduce flare. I think I'll try to attach a flat-black paper shield to that back face and see what effect it has. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pippy Posted February 1, 2022 Share #189 Posted February 1, 2022 46 minutes ago, TomB_tx said: I received the lens a few days ago, and can readily cause veiling flare even indoors if the light source is just outside a top corner of the frame. Light source directly above doesn't seem flare prone... This is all very strange. Could you post any images which show the flare, Tom, and also, if possible, a second snap pulled back a bit showing the relative positions of the subject and light-source(s)? Having read your post I went around a few rooms in the house where there are different styles of light-sources in different situations and 'placed' (photographically speaking) in different areas outside and inside the frame and I STILL can't excite any flare in any of the two-dozen or so images I shot. I'd post some of them but, then again, there's nothing to see so not really much point! The only way I can get the thing to mis-behave at all is by removing the lens-hood which, of course, is simply asking for trouble. Philip. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pippy Posted February 1, 2022 Share #190 Posted February 1, 2022 (edited) Hang on a mo'... Can I ask Huss, Photoworks and Tom if they use / were using the hood as supplied in the box when they had / have flare issues? I've just listened / watched once more to Matt Osborne's review and at the 01:43 mark he states; "Being a pre-release lens this lens was supplied to me without a lens-hood but the final lens does come with a solid-brass vintage style hood..."...and, unsurprisingly as he had no hood, subsequently he went on to experience considerable amounts of flare! This little detail might explain a great deal of what has been typed here over the past few weeks... Philip. EDIT : Mr. Osborne also noted in the review that the lens does have some vignetting at f5.6 but that it's gone by f8. As I never shot any of my test snaps wide-open that would also explain why I had no issues with any vignetting. Edited February 1, 2022 by pippy 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Huss Posted February 1, 2022 Share #191 Posted February 1, 2022 Pippy, I do not have this lens but I am following this thread out of curiosity because I do like to shoot back lit subjects, and so far have not seen this lens handle it well. The hardest test is if the bright light source is just out of image. Tom's comments of being easily able to cause veiling flare indoors is striking! I've never been able to do that with any lens I have! Your flare shot is also indoors. What was the light source? And just to show how shallow I am, if this lens was made in black finish (similar to the limited edition black Summaron), I'd ignore my criticisms and cave in a second... 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomB_tx Posted February 2, 2022 Share #192 Posted February 2, 2022 1 hour ago, pippy said: This is all very strange. Could you post any images which show the flare, Tom, and also, if possible, a second snap pulled back a bit showing the relative positions of the subject and light-source(s)? Having read your post I went around a few rooms in the house where there are different styles of light-sources in different situations and 'placed' (photographically speaking) in different areas outside and inside the frame and I STILL can't excite any flare in any of the two-dozen or so images I shot. I'd post some of them but, then again, there's nothing to see so not really much point! The only way I can get the thing to mis-behave at all is by removing the lens-hood which, of course, is simply asking for trouble. Philip. OK - some examples. These were just quick OOC jpgs taken with live view trying to excite flare. The TTA 28 had the rectangular hood in place. First I moved the framing around until the flare was as bad as it could be: Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Then I shifted the view to put the light source more centered overhead: Then here's the frame shifted to show the bright overhead light location (letting the highlights blow): I don't have any other 28s for an M to compare, but here's a shot with a VC Nokton 35 II @ 1.4, again flare as bad as I could make it: 1 Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Then I shifted the view to put the light source more centered overhead: Then here's the frame shifted to show the bright overhead light location (letting the highlights blow): I don't have any other 28s for an M to compare, but here's a shot with a VC Nokton 35 II @ 1.4, again flare as bad as I could make it: ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/326776-ttartisan-28mm-f56/?do=findComment&comment=4374288'>More sharing options...
Huss Posted February 2, 2022 Share #193 Posted February 2, 2022 5 hours ago, TomB_tx said: OK - some examples. These were just quick OOC jpgs taken with live view trying to excite flare. The TTA 28 had the rectangular hood in place. First I moved the framing around until the flare was as bad as it could be: Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Then I shifted the view to put the light source more centered overhead: Then here's the frame shifted to show the bright overhead light location (letting the highlights blow): I don't have any other 28s for an M to compare, but here's a shot with a VC Nokton 35 II @ 1.4, again flare as bad as I could make it: Thanks for that Tom, you've cured my desire for one! (Unless they release it in black..) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pippy Posted February 2, 2022 Share #194 Posted February 2, 2022 (edited) 9 hours ago, Huss said: ...Your flare shot is also indoors. What was the light source?... Thanks, Tom and Huss, for getting back to me. It's appreciated! When I tried to excite flare I went through different rooms with a number of different sources which included Standard (floor-standing) Lamp with shade; table-top lamps (shaded); ceiling lights (unshaded) and pendulum-mounted double down-lights which have a shaded top and unshaded lower half. It was only after I had removed both the hood and the (multi-coated) filter when shooting the last scene which is when I caught some flare. So; 'Coatings'?... If, as in Tom's pictures above, the flare isn't killed when using the hood then I wonder if it has more to do with (not) using a multi-coated filter? Having a close look at the front element it appears to be a single coated design and this (possible!) lack of multi-coating might also be contributing to the tendency towards flare. Whilst trying to discover the actuality about the coating(s) used for the lens I came across the review of the lens by Philip Reeve - who, like Mr. Osborne, received a pre-production lens sans hood for testing purposes - and he experienced similar issues(*) to those mentioned by a few members here although in his case he seemed to be able to calm things down by shading the lens with his hand. I'll be in the studio today so will try to find the time to experiment a bit further in the name of Science! Fortunately for me and my 'real world' shooting I very, very rarely seem to shoot in contre-jour situations - nothing deliberate; it just doesn't seem to be how I 'see' things - so personally the flare situation is almost completely academic and even in those occasional situations when I will shoot such subject matter it seems that my current scoring-record for capturing flare is 'null points'... Interesting stuff going on here, though, and it would be useful to know exactly what is causing the effect and what can be done to minimise the issue. Philip. * EDIT : Forgot to include the Philip Reeve review for those who might not have seen it and might also be interested to do so. 'Flare' is discussed just before half-way down the page; https://phillipreeve.net/blog/review-ttartisan-28mm-5-6-m/ Edited February 2, 2022 by pippy 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pippy Posted February 2, 2022 Share #195 Posted February 2, 2022 (edited) I'm still struggling to find any images which suffer from veiling flare with a filter and hood fitted in a 'real-world' situation. This pair is also from the other day. Both snapped from the same spot just a few seconds apart with body swung through, at a guess, somewhere between 5 and 10 degrees. Even in the snap with the sun in shot the part to the left of the right-hand-side crane is pretty much unaffected. SOOC and apologies for all the crap on the sensor............ Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Unfortunately I don't have any image where the lens-position was shifted half-way to record the scene between these two frames but, to be perfectly frank, if I have to try So Hard to get some flare - and I'm certainly not getting any issues in 'Normal' shooting - then I'm simply going to be happy with the situation as it stands and let this (for me, obviously) non-issue drop. I've also, just now, tried to replicate the problem in the studio without any success whatsoever when filter and hood are fitted so, for me, that's an end to it and I'll refrain form touching on the matter again. Honest!...... I do, however, wish everyone who is still troubled by this phenomenon good luck in resolving the situation for themselves! Philip. Edited February 2, 2022 by pippy 2 Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Unfortunately I don't have any image where the lens-position was shifted half-way to record the scene between these two frames but, to be perfectly frank, if I have to try So Hard to get some flare - and I'm certainly not getting any issues in 'Normal' shooting - then I'm simply going to be happy with the situation as it stands and let this (for me, obviously) non-issue drop. I've also, just now, tried to replicate the problem in the studio without any success whatsoever when filter and hood are fitted so, for me, that's an end to it and I'll refrain form touching on the matter again. Honest!...... I do, however, wish everyone who is still troubled by this phenomenon good luck in resolving the situation for themselves! Philip. ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/326776-ttartisan-28mm-f56/?do=findComment&comment=4374560'>More sharing options...
erniethemilk Posted February 2, 2022 Share #196 Posted February 2, 2022 My experience with flair on the lens is very similar to yours @pippy from the initial testing I've managed to do with the lens and your photo samples above. This is an unedited RAW (simply resized in PS for here) and you can see a little bit of flare, but this was shot with the sun just about in the frame top right. Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! 1 Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/326776-ttartisan-28mm-f56/?do=findComment&comment=4374755'>More sharing options...
erniethemilk Posted February 2, 2022 Share #197 Posted February 2, 2022 M10-P & TT Artisans 28mm 5.6. I am really liking this little lens for what it does! Trying desperately to persuade my friend to sell it to me! 😂 Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! 2 1 Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/326776-ttartisan-28mm-f56/?do=findComment&comment=4374756'>More sharing options...
Dennis Posted February 2, 2022 Share #198 Posted February 2, 2022 Does it come in silver only? Not black version yet? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pippy Posted February 2, 2022 Share #199 Posted February 2, 2022 (edited) 29 minutes ago, Dennis said: Does it come in silver only? Not black version yet? As far as I know, Dennis, it is still only available in silver-chrome......but interestingly (perhaps!) on the outer-box there was a sticker indicating that mine was a silver example so perhaps(!) they have plans to release a black version if the lens proves to be sufficiently popular? I know you never use either a filter or a hood(*) but with the hood fitted and the lens mounted on a black body the chrome 'bit' all but disappears! If I get a bit of time... Philip. * BAD idea with this lens, apparently, but that's another discussion!............ Edited February 2, 2022 by pippy 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dennis Posted February 2, 2022 Share #200 Posted February 2, 2022 16 minutes ago, pippy said: As far as I know, Dennis, it is still only available in silver-chrome...... I know you never use either a filter or a hood(*) but with the hood fitted and the lens mounted on a black body the chrome 'bit' all but disappears! If I get a bit of time... Philip. * BAD idea with this lens, apparently, but that's another discussion!............ All my lenses and bodies are black. I also say NO to a used 28 Ultron II from a Leica fellow, because was silver. As you correctly said, I don't use filter, except for challenging situations or when ND needed. But I do use hood, as long as don't block all my VF 🙂 A 35mm Summicron asph I w/ hood attached it's my limit. I can resist to this! But apart from helping with flare, the hood it's the kind of protection I need! 21 minutes ago, pippy said: perhaps(!) they have plans to release a black version if the lens proves to be sufficiently popular? Glad you bought one, this lens is becoming very popular 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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