Will we see a SL2-M?

[snooper]

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Wouldn't that be a fantastic camera?

[ajmarton1]

I think an SL2-M would be impractical as it is a pro level camera and you would be limiting its utility value.  I can get pretty close to the quality of my M10 Monochrom in post editing.  I suspect that would be true with the SL-2 as well.  

[Jeff S]

Not for me. B&W conversions from the SL2 are already superb.  The M Monochrom more than satisfactorily provides my all- mono experience and file quality.

Jeff

[jplomley]

Can’t even get the bloody wide angle Summicrons out the door let alone an M variant of the SL2. My feeling is that Leica have throttled back on their interest in the L-alliance. Would not be surprised if they did not hand it all over to Panasonic

[jaapv]

1 hour ago, snooper said:

Wouldn't that be a fantastic camera?

No. The M mount is not suitable for an EVIL mirrorless - no electrical connections, no aperture communication - and no space for them.

[Jeff S]

Delete

Edited November 20, 2020 by Jeff S

[Jeff S]

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10 minutes ago, jplomley said:

Can’t even get the bloody wide angle Summicrons out the door let alone an M variant of the SL2. My feeling is that Leica have throttled back on their interest in the L-alliance. Would not be surprised if they did not hand it all over to Panasonic

Panasonic L mount business, and overall still camera business (in its appliance division, separate from video) seems to be struggling significantly. I’d be more worried that they exit the alliance, which could sink it all.

Jeff

[SrMi]

What should an SL2-M be: an SL2 with M mount or an SL2 Monochrom  ? Or both 🤣?

 

 

[Chaemono]

An SL-M or an SL2-M. It was speculated about it before. It’s an SL with an integrated collapsible M mount adapter.

Edit - found the post. #108 from 2018 here: https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/291311-does-sl-need-more-megapixels/page/6/#comments

 

Edited November 20, 2020 by Chaemono

[snooper]

I would definitely go for it. Assuming it would benefit from the M10M / Q2M sensors:

1/ Use the L lenses without the need to carry the M10M plus lenses too, so basically you carry just one system. 

2/ So far I had every iteration of Monochromes (except Q2) and found out that - for my usage at least - a B&W EVF is very useful. Visoflex drags the M10M's battery and is a bit... you see what I mean.

3/ Bonus: you only carry one type of batteries, one type of charger, etc.

Would really love to see that Cron L35mm with a Mono sensor...

[Jeff S]

10 minutes ago, snooper said:

I would definitely go for it. Assuming it would benefit from the M10M / Q2M sensors:

1/ Use the L lenses without the need to carry the M10M plus lenses too, so basically you carry just one system. 

2/ So far I had every iteration of Monochromes (except Q2) and found out that - for my usage at least - a B&W EVF is very useful. Visoflex drags the M10M's battery and is a bit... you see what I mean.

3/ Bonus: you only carry one type of batteries, one type of charger, etc.

Would really love to see that Cron L35mm with a Mono sensor...

You can essentially accomplish most all of that with the SL2 (albeit lesser high ISO compared to M10-M), including the ability to set EVF to b/w (even with DNG only), and additionally benefit from use of color channels in post.  And of course you have option for color.  A jack of all trades, one body option,  already.
 

Jeff

Edited November 20, 2020 by Jeff S

[Jon Warwick]

1 hour ago, snooper said:

Would really love to see that Cron L35mm with a Mono sensor...

+1 indeed. I do see a beneficial tonal difference for B&W prints from the Monochrom sensors, and I also think the SL Summicron primes are Leica’s best lenses ....the pairing would potentially be incredible for very fine B&Ws.

[ardbeg]

Given that an exclusively B&W camera appeals to a specialist niche (albeit a worthwhile one) which is mostly about tonal detail and that we already have small form factor options with the M monochromes and now the Q2M, I’d personally rather see the ultimate in B&W rendering and dynamic range, i.e. an S3-mono rather than an SL2-mono. 

Edited November 21, 2020 by ardbeg

[Jeff S]

23 minutes ago, ardbeg said:

Given that an exclusively B&W camera appeals to a specialist niche (albeit a worthwhile one) which is mostly about tonal detail and that we already have small form factor options with the M monochromes and now the Q2M, I’d personally rather see the ultimate in B&W rendering and dynamic range, i.e. an S3-mono rather than an SL2-mono. 

Old thread, but not exactly a rousing response...

But, given that the M10 Monochrom sensor was derived from the S3 sensor architecture, a true S3 Mono would likely be a tonal tour de force, at least in big prints.

Jeff

[FlashGordonPhotography]

13 hours ago, jaapv said:

No. The M mount is not suitable for an EVIL mirrorless - no electrical connections, no aperture communication - and no space for them.

I think the OP means Monochrom not M mount.

Not for me though. Happy with my M10M and SL2.

Gordon

[jaapv]

Ah- my mistake then. CB. In that case: How many Monochrom cameras  can the market absorb? 

[helged]

8 hours ago, Jeff S said:

Old thread, but not exactly a rousing response...

But, given that the M10 Monochrom sensor was derived from the S3 sensor architecture, a true S3 Mono would likely be a tonal tour de force, at least in big prints.

Jeff

A Leica-insider talked about S3M(onocolor) early this year, so a monochrome S has most likely been on the table. But this was before Corona... 

[snooper]

14 hours ago, Jeff S said:

You can essentially accomplish most all of that with the SL2 (albeit lesser high ISO compared to M10-M), including the ability to set EVF to b/w (even with DNG only), and additionally benefit from use of color channels in post.  And of course you have option for color.  A jack of all trades, one body option,  already.
 

Jeff

Hi Jeff,

We wont agree on this one. I've had a M10 before the M10M. The files produced by the M10M (for the sole purpose of B&W photography obviously) are totally different from the files the M10 delivers. It's most of all about how deep you can go in the low lights. For whoever is printing, it's making a huge difference, and to me B&W photography is more about blacks than whites.

The fact that the SL2 (just like the M10) can also produce stunning color DNGs is absolutely true. But when I count over the years how many color pics I've printed vs B&W I think I spent more time in the Mono side. I imagine I'm not the only one: just look on this forum, the (usual) majority of the "favorite images" tab are indeed B&W.

So yes, I would definitely enjoy having a SL2-M and I would totally be fine on trading it against the M gear. And I would still enjoy the wonders of the SL2 for color. And make substantial savings in terms of dinero (selling the M10M and the lenses) but also in terms of practicality - even if I'm the first one to complain about the actual weight of a SL system... 

[djmay]

The Monochrom cameras are extraordinary. Results are substantially better than the same generation M color camera. I have not tested M10M yet, however, I thoroughly tested M246 against M-P240 and S 006. Only the S was better, and the S3 more so. If I did not have the S3, the M10M would be appealing.

 I have a 90x60cm image from M246 on permanent display. Prior to Covid, visitors always commented on that print (good) and inspected it at nose distance.

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[Jeff S]

5 hours ago, snooper said:

Hi Jeff,

We wont agree on this one. I've had a M10 before the M10M. The files produced by the M10M (for the sole purpose of B&W photography obviously) are totally different from the files the M10 delivers. It's most of all about how deep you can go in the low lights. For whoever is printing, it's making a huge difference, and to me B&W photography is more about blacks than whites.

The fact that the SL2 (just like the M10) can also produce stunning color DNGs is absolutely true. But when I count over the years how many color pics I've printed vs B&W I think I spent more time in the Mono side. I imagine I'm not the only one: just look on this forum, the (usual) majority of the "favorite images" tab are indeed B&W.

So yes, I would definitely enjoy having a SL2-M and I would totally be fine on trading it against the M gear. And I would still enjoy the wonders of the SL2 for color. And make substantial savings in terms of dinero (selling the M10M and the lenses) but also in terms of practicality - even if I'm the first one to complain about the actual weight of a SL system... 

I don’t compare prints using mono/color versions of the same camera.  I just care about whether I can achieve my picture and print goals with any given camera.  For 35 years, I exclusively shot black and white, 25 of those years in my darkroom, and did my own framing and matting.  I also began collecting vintage silver prints in the late 70’s from some of the best b/w photographers/printers, so that I know what’s possible, and remain humble. My transition to digital began in 2009, and since that time I’ve still done my own printing and matting/framing, with about 80% in b&w, still my passion.
 

My style is to print small to moderate size, and often to let blacks go black, or close to it. ASA 400 was fine for my low light shooting in film days, and I wasn’t allergic to grain, so current digital cameras are already ridiculously capable for low light shooting by comparison.  A capable photographer/printer can produce superb b&w prints with lots of modern gear. When I do my part extremely well, viewers don’t know or care if I used my M Monochrom or my M10.  An M10 Monochrom would likely provide a better shooting experience than my M Monochrom (quieter, better built, better VF, etc), but I wouldn’t take better pics or make bigger or better prints given my style and preferences.  For those who want to shoot clean files at ISO 25,000, or make huge prints, or crop radically, I get the appeal; but not needed for me.  

Jeff