MP240 vs. Nikon Z6

[Henry Taylor]

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I am a little disappointed while trying to accurately quick focus my new MP240. I just bought a new 50mm  Summicron- m E 39  expecting to take advantage of its known sharpness but having trouble nailing it... I even pick up a VF-2 but not nearly as effective as using a mirrorless camera. Tonight I tried the Summicron with an adapter with my Z6 and low and behold what a difference. I could see must better and with the sharp  eye level viewing I nail ever shot . It's running late and I'm going to bed but  tomorrow i  will put together some shots for comparison. 

P.S. Still love my 240.

Thanks

Hank

Edited October 15, 2020 by Henry Taylor
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[Maarten]

Hank, try again in the morning. When you keep having problems, test your MP240 lens combination as follows:
Point the camera to a distant object (at least 1 mile distance), turn the lens to infinity and check in the viewfinder if the two images of the rangefinder fully overlap.
If not either your camera or lens is in need of calibration. Usually it's the camera and with a little patience you can do the calibration yourself.

But do the test first and see what you get.

Edited October 15, 2020 by Maarten

[Luke_Miller]

I shoot with both the Z6 and M240.  The Z6 is the best body I've used for manual focus with my Nikon lenses. Focus aids make up for a variety of vision issues and its design has little to get out of alignment.  I do fine with my M240 as well, but It took a while.  Initially my hit rate was less than desired, but the correct eyepiece diopter and cataract surgery resolved that.   Manual focus with optical finder cameras really puts a premium on good vision.  If I need to focus my M240  quickly (which is pretty much always the case in my photography) I stop down a bit to give a bit more depth of field.  Experience really helps.  My hit rate has steadily improved over time and recently I was able to capture images of my granddaughter as she walked down the aisle at her wedding.  Every shot in the sequence was in focus.  Maarten's advice is spot on.  You can't do your job properly if the camera/lens is out of calibration.

Edited October 15, 2020 by Luke_Miller

[Henry Taylor]

7 hours ago, Maarten said:

Hank, try again in the morning. When you keep having problems, test your MP240 lens combination as follows:
Point the camera to a distant object (at least 1 mile distance), turn the lens to infinity and check in the viewfinder if the two images of the rangefinder fully overlap.
If not either your camera or lens is in need of calibration. Usually it's the camera and with a little patience you can do the calibration yourself.

But do the test first and see what you get.

 

7 hours ago, Maarten said:

Hank, try again in the morning. When you keep having problems, test your MP240 lens combination as follows:
Point the camera to a distant object (at least 1 mile distance), turn the lens to infinity and check in the viewfinder if the two images of the rangefinder fully overlap.
If not either your camera or lens is in need of calibration. Usually it's the camera and with a little patience you can do the calibration yourself.

But do the test first and see what you get.

 

[Henry Taylor]

Thanks Maarten  got up this morning and rechecked for calibrations both the lens and body are on -  its my eyes that I'm sure is giving me the problem 

 

[Henry Taylor]

Hi Luke, good to see someone else had a similuar problem. I know I will be needing  cataract surgery   and in the meantime will look into getting a diopter. Glad to. hear you were able to shoot your granddaughter's wedding  in focus 😃

Here is a shot this morning with the MP240 and Summicron 50

looks like if I take a little more time I 'm in focus . 

PS still love shooting with the Z6 for weddings especially if I want flash fill when I need it.

Thanks

Hank

Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here…

Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!

Edited October 15, 2020 by Henry Taylor
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[jdlaing]

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14 minutes ago, Henry Taylor said:

Hi Luke, good to see someone else had a similuar problem. I know I will be needing  cataract surgery   and in the meantime will look into getting a diopter. Glad to. hear you were able to shoot your granddaughter's wedding  in focus 😃

Here is a shot this morning with the MP240 and Summicron 50

looks like if I take a little more time I 'm in focus . 

PS still love shooting with the Z6 for weddings especially if I want flash fill when I need it.

Thanks

Hank

Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here…

Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!

Don’t press too far forward with a diopter if your cataract surgery is soon as the lens implant may correct for that.

[Jeff S]

Be sure to correct for any astigmatism as well; a  standard Leica diopter will not do that.  I wear glasses to correct for distance and astigmatism and still use a +.5 diopter to optimize viewing. Note that the M focus patch is set to a virtual distance of 2m.
 

For calibration tests, best to use a tripod and compare RF focus vs live view (actual on-sensor  focus) at different distances and apertures (to account for focus shift). Always best to try multiple lenses to distinguish between camera vs lens related issues.  

Jeff

Edited October 15, 2020 by Jeff S

[pippy]

1 hour ago, Jeff S said:

...Always best to try multiple lenses to distinguish between camera vs lens related issues...

+1 to this!

Philip.

[jaeger]

Z takes any lens in the world.

[Henry Taylor]

Thanks all for your input and help... . It was a lot easier when I got my first Leica 30 years ago , had no problem using  the rangefinder. Thanks for the advise with regards to getting  a  diopter. I'll wait until after cataract surgery  

[martinot]

On 10/15/2020 at 5:12 AM, Henry Taylor said:

I am a little disappointed while trying to accurately quick focus my new MP240. I just bought a new 50mm  Summicron- m E 39  expecting to take advantage of its known sharpness but having trouble nailing it... I even pick up a VF-2 but not nearly as effective as using a mirrorless camera. Tonight I tried the Summicron with an adapter with my Z6 and low and behold what a difference. I could see must better and with the sharp  eye level viewing I nail ever shot . It's running late and I'm going to bed but  tomorrow i  will put together some shots for comparison. 

I think it is a little unfair to compare the two EVF. The VF-2 technology is about 10 years old now, and the EVF in the Nikon Z6/7 is state of the art, and together with the Leica SL2 (and Panasonic) EVF, one of the absolutely best EVF you can get today.

It is like comparing a 10 year old Ford Fiesta with the latest high performance Tesla. 😀

That said, I just bought myself an VF-2 and got it delivered this Friday (got it on Ebay for a very low price, and could not resist). Even if it is slow in refresh rate, low resolution and low contrast (which match my expectations) , I do not think it is useless at all.

On the contrary, I think it will still be a very helpful complement and focus aid in special situations. For example in landscape photography (easy to take photos with camera low over the ground thanks to the tilting EVF), and great to check focus with some lenses with focus shift (like my new Zeiss 50/1,5, which I do love for its unique old style character and rendering), and also great for wider angle lenses not supported by the cameras range finder view of field.

But I think one really need to have very different expectations on a 10 year old cheap EVF, and a modern state of the art EVF. 

Even with the EVF option being a great complement in some cases (very wide lenses, or tele lenses), I think M cameras and most M lenses will be best focused with the RF OVF.

Enjoy the two very different, but also truly fantastic cameras you have!

[mmradman]

Speaking as former owner of both, now only the latter, M240 and M246 are excellent RF cameras but the EVF is poor, it was already poor at the time M240 was launched back round 2012/2013 if memory serves, even M10's EVF which is improved in resolution, faster and provides movable focus patch is still sluggish compared to true mirrorless cameras.

M cameras are first and foremost RF cameras, using either add-on EVF or live view on the rear screen should be secondary focusing aid, and useful it can be if one can live with the limitations.  If user expects any of the past or current M-EVF to equal current mirrorless camera EVF, any brand including Leica own CL and SL's,  performance than it is a wrong choice.

[cboy]

On 10/15/2020 at 1:12 PM, Henry Taylor said:

am a little disappointed while trying to accurately quick focus my new MP240. I just bought a new 50mm  Summicron- m E 39  expecting to take advantage of its known sharpness but having trouble nailing

Have you tried a 1.25 or 1.4 magnifier? The focus patch can be somewhat faint though, but adding a translucent adhesive film over the rangefinder window adds contrast. Otherwise a contrast lens would help too.

Goodluck with your surgery. All the best

[Henry Taylor]

I appreciate your comments and agree, I should not compare the two two systems, they both have their place and agree the  V-2 is not perfect, but as pointed out, is necessary when using wide angle and telephoto lenses . I must admit using it to shoot low angle shots really is quite handy.

 

Thank you all 

Hank

[martinot]

On 10/19/2020 at 12:45 AM, mmradman said:

Speaking as former owner of both, now only the latter, M240 and M246 are excellent RF cameras but the EVF is poor, it was already poor at the time M240 was launched back round 2012/2013 if memory serves, even M10's EVF which is improved in resolution, faster and provides movable focus patch is still sluggish compared to true mirrorless cameras.

I agree it is a very slow, low resolution, poor contrast EVF.

But the EVF was not new when Leica introduced in to the market around 2012/13. The EVF is just a rebranded Olympus EVF, made originally around 2009 IIRC. They are both produced by Epson. Even if not great by todays standards, remember that it is over 10-11 years old technology, and it was never any high end EVF even from start. It was a quite cheap plastic low performing EVF build for the lower priced cheaper range of Olympus cheaper m43 cameras (even in 2009/2010).

But despite that is was a cheap EVF already by 2009 years standards, I still find it useful to use today. For a mirror less camera I would not accept the low quality and really slow update rate (it is really sluggish), but as I mainly use the OVF when I take photos with my range finder M, I do not mind that much.

I find it to still be a valuable complement in some situations (for example; you want to really nail focus exact, have a lot of time for your photo, and the light is too bright to use the normal screen). It is absolutely not a mandatory or really necessary accessory for an M camera, but it is still a nice extra if you can get it for cheap.

Is it usable as a prime or as the only VF? No really. That is what I use the rangefinder VF on my M camera for.

Is it usable as a secondary VF in some cases? Yes, I do think it has some value in some situations and for some lenses.

Edited October 21, 2020 by martinot

[martinot]

I do not totally share all his opinions, but I agree with a lot of the examples when an EVF potentially could be useful even on a rangefinder camera.

 

 

Edited October 21, 2020 by martinot

[martinot]

Also a nice case for (some times) using an EVF: https://www.overgaard.dk/Leica-M-Type-240-aka-Leica-M10-digital-rangefinder-camera-page-44-Focusing-the-Leica-M-with-Manual-Focus-EVF2-Visoflex-Electronic-Viewfinder.html

[eyeheartny]

On 10/14/2020 at 8:12 PM, Henry Taylor said:

I am a little disappointed while trying to accurately quick focus my new MP240. I just bought a new 50mm  Summicron- m E 39  expecting to take advantage of its known sharpness but having trouble nailing it... I even pick up a VF-2 but not nearly as effective as using a mirrorless camera. Tonight I tried the Summicron with an adapter with my Z6 and low and behold what a difference. I could see must better and with the sharp  eye level viewing I nail ever shot . It's running late and I'm going to bed but  tomorrow i  will put together some shots for comparison. 

P.S. Still love my 240.

Thanks

Hank

How long had you been shooting the MP240 before you posted this? Curious how long your learning curve had been. 

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Hallo,

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[Henry Taylor]

Good point, I jut got the MP240 about a month before, however I have been shooting with Leica's Since 53 and  as a matter of fact, I still use the Leitz IIIf I pick up in 56. I think part of my problem is that I will be needing cataract surgery shortly.

Must admit, the Mirrorless system with the Leica does take some getting use to.

Also almost forgot Martinot, thanks for adding on the good info on the VF-2

Thanks

Hank

Edited October 22, 2020 by Henry Taylor
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