Trying to decide on my first Leica (M2 vs. M4-p)

[thorcaption5]

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Hello, I'm trying to decide on what Leica I should buy. I'm stuck between buying a really good condition M2 first version for just about $1000 or waiting and saving up for an m4-p. Realistically the only reason I'd choose the M4-p over the m2 is the color of the actual camera, since I don't like the idea of drawing attention to myself with a chrome leica. Which is probably dumb because there are plenty of photographers who have used chrome Leica's all over the world in all sorts of situations and made really good work. Still though, I'm not entirely sure which to choose. I don't mind the button rewind since I'm used to annoying rewind functions (my other camera is a Retina IIIc). All that being said, which would you choose?

 

 

[Michael Hiles]

I like the uncluttered viewfinder of the M2. I have lived happily with one for 50 years.

[thorcaption5]

5 hours ago, thorcaption5 said:

Hello, I'm trying to decide on what Leica I should buy. I'm stuck between buying a really good condition M2 first version for just about $1000 or waiting and saving up for an m4-p. Realistically the only reason I'd choose the M4-p over the m2 is the color of the actual camera, since I don't like the idea of drawing attention to myself with a chrome leica. Which is probably dumb because there are plenty of photographers who have used chrome Leica's all over the world in all sorts of situations and made really good work. Still though, I'm not entirely sure which to choose. I don't mind the button rewind since I'm used to annoying rewind functions (my other camera is a Retina IIIc). All that being said, which would you choose?10.0.0.0.1 192.168.1.254 happymod 

 

 

The M2 is superior to the M4-P if you want to have the "clean" three-frame-finder, a clicky film reminder dial or you experience a lot of issues with VF flare (I haven't, a few have). Otherwise - the M4-P has a superior gear train, advance, frame counter, rewind, loading, frameline set (literally twice as many: adds 28, 75, 135), hot-shoe flash support, motor drive or lever wind compatibility and the far nicer black-chrome finish. I call it the best M for fun, but the truth is every M has benefits and drawbacks - and there is no M that is "best"*. It just comes down to personal needs and preferences.

[Mute-on]

I have an M2 and a BP M4. 

I would buy another M2 before I bought another M4 (or an M4-P for that matter). 

However, if you need the 28, 75 and 135 only the M4-P has all three. 

OTOH an M2 with a 35mm is Leica nirvana in my opinion. 

Edited August 3, 2020 by Mute-on

[Pyrogallol]

I had/have an M2 and an M4P. Then I bought a second M2, at a real auction back in the pre covid days when you could go to an auction and put your hand up and in the blink of an eye the bids jump up ! Then a button rewind M2 was put in front of me by my local classic dealer so I have that one as well.

i would describe the M2 as a classic feel M camera and an M4P as a “modern” M. I suppose from the time starting in the 70’s and 80’s when cutting manufacturing costs took over from quality control, not to say that the M4P isn’t a nice camera, but it has a different feel.

Buy both, if you can, they are going up in value quicker than money in the bank. I had an M6 as well but did not like the blinking meter lights in the viewfinder telling me to change the exposure, it doubled in value while I had it and the profit paid for the M4P.

Edited August 3, 2020 by Pyrogallol

[bcorton]

Interesting discussion, but why is it in the Leica X threads?  You'd probably get more participation in the "Film M" category.  'Just a thought.

Cheers

[L.Richard]

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I have an M2. Excellent camera.

[jaapv]

Moved

[Yaakov]

I would take the M4-P only if 28mm was my main focal length, in all the other scenarios I would take the M2.

[carbon_dragon]

I chose an M2 (and later a 2nd) simple because of cost and was never sorry. But the M4 is a great camera too and I'm sure you'll like that one too. Loading is a little complex in the Ms, but not as bad as the Leica IIIs. Plus I got an M2 that actually had the quickload kit and it's easier yet. They're all sweet cameras and they last basically forever since there are no electronics to break. Though I do like having a light meter and I bought a Voigtlander clip on meter which looks great on it.  I also have the selenium meter that was made for the M2 and it works but it's just a bit more difficult to clip on than the Voigtlander.

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[satijntje]

Why not an M3?

[a.noctilux]

...or plain M4

 

...

waiting for M-A like me

since late 1970's to 2014 my preference went to M4

since late 2014 ...M-A replaced M4 😉

 

side note, each film M can give same output with same lens and film 😇

[earleygallery]

Or an M4-2

[plaidshirts]

M2 all the way.

[BradS]

Too much fuss over minor details. The simple fact is the two are far more alike than different. Be informed about the differences - framelines, hotshot, weight, etc... and buy the one that better meets your needs or if the differences don’t matter to you, buy the one that is in better condition or the one that has been recently serviced by a reputable professional (with evidence of such). If you really cannot decide, then hold each in your hands, close your eyes and see which one speaks to you. 
 

For me, the hot shoe and 28mm frame line on the M4-P made it a very easy, even obvious choice and the light meter in the M6 in addition to all the great features of the M4-P made the M6 the winner for me. 
 

and I think you’ll find that your concern about chrome vs black is a little over blown. Most people won’t notice, wouldn’t know a Leica from a toaster oven and don’t care. People who do know really won’t care either. 

Edited August 20, 2020 by BradS

[andrew01]

The best M Leicas are M4 and earlier.  After that the quality is not as nice.  I wouldn’t pay a premium for an M4-p over an M2. If you are happy with the lesser build quality of the later cameras you may as well get an M6 and get the convenience of the built in meter.

[carbon_dragon]

On 8/18/2020 at 4:19 PM, satijntje said:

Why not an M3?

The only issue with an M3 is the lack of a 35mm frame line. Great camera otherwise. If you intend to use mostly 50 and 90 framelines (and maybe even 135) it's even better.

[Mucleica]

Start with a M2. Perfect design and functionality. It's the peak of perfection. Leica could have stopped producing other cameras after the M2. Nothing more to add or take away. But that's not how the economy works.

[Matlock]

I have a M2 and, apart from the usual scratches from a badly mounted Leicameter MR, it is an excellent camera. However if you need to use any thing wider than a 35mm lens in the future, then a M4-P or M-A would be a better bet.

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Hallo,

Look here: Leica M

[UltraDan]

Don't be hard on yourself, it's not dumb to want a black camera for keeping yourself inconspicuous, part of the joy of a small Leica is that you keep a low profile when your doing your thing 👍🏻