rumors SL2 with 36MP sensor only

[Ken Abrahams]

Advertisement (gone after registration)

I don’t mind the SL ergonomics. The buttons in the right places and when RRS L bracket fitted and extended out a little for extra handle/grip it is even more sturdy.  I must admit to only using M lenses, but the 90 M APO must get close in weight to SL lens? 

[Chaemono]

Double post

Edited September 8, 2019 by Chaemono

[nicci78]

APO-Summicron-M 90 asph is 570g (adapter included) with 1m minimum focusing distance MF only.

APO-Summicron-SL 90 asph is 700g with 0.6m minimum focusing distance AF/MF 

Only 23% heavier, weather sealed with much better focusing distance and fast AF for the SL version 

Edited September 8, 2019 by nicci78

[nicci78]

APO-Summicron-M 50 asph is 370g (adapter included) with 0.7m minimum focusing distance MF only.

APO-Summicron-SL 50 asph is 740g with 0.35m minimum focusing distance AF/MF 

Twice heavier, but half the price. weather sealed with much better focusing distance and fast AF for the SL version 

 

[nicci78]

Double post sorry 

Edited September 8, 2019 by nicci78

[nicci78]

Triple post. Connexion issue. Sorry 

Edited September 8, 2019 by nicci78

[nicci78]

Advertisement (gone after registration)

Summilux-TL 35 asph asph is 428g with 0.35m minimum focusing distance AF/MF

APO-Summicron-SL 50 asph is 740g with 0.35m minimum focusing distance AF/MF 

312g heavier, twice the price. Weather sealed and faster AF for the SL version  

Taking into account SL weight of 847g vs 403g for the CL. The difference between 24x36 and APS-C is quite huge. 1587g vs 831g.

SL set is twice heavier, bulkier and more expensive. We should wait for higher resolution SL2 to get definitive advantages against CL. 

 

 

Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here…

Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!

[Jeff S]

I think Leica might be afraid to provide weather sealing in the CL.

Jeff

[bags27]

11 minutes ago, Jeff S said:

I think Leica might be afraid to provide weather sealing in the CL.

Jeff

Because? 

it adds weight? a couple of ounces, I think if we compare the Q and Q2.

it would close the gap too much with the SL?  presumably they can still "space" the SL2 and CL2.

or something else? curious what you think here. Of course the TL lenses are not weather sealed, so there's a limiting factor....

Edited September 8, 2019 by bags27

[FlashGordonPhotography]

Size and weight are certainly important. Personally they come further down the list than balance, handling, ergonomics and layout. Otherwise I might actually like something Sony make..

Plus there are many other advantages to the SL that outweigh the weight issue.

I have a grip and Thumbie permanently attached to my CL. Still it's not as nice to use as the SL. I find the SL very well balanced and the button positions superb. After a 12 hour wedding my hands are fine with an SL over each shoulder. Heavy? Yes. Uncomfortable? No. But having carried two bodies (and sometimes a CL as well, before the 16-35 existed) I find a single body and a 24-90 a doddle. I also refuse to use a normal shoulder strap. My modified sling straps make a huge difference to long days with a larger body. Even the Panasonic S1R with the Leica lenses is fine, for me. Would I like them smaller? Yes, but not if it sacrifices balance and usability. I have a Z7 kit that's half the weight of the S1R with the Leica zoom trio. Mostly I prefer to carry the Leica glass if photography is on the agenda. The IQ from the Nikon is excellent. The usability of the S1R and SL are much better though.

I've done the small/light camera thing, several times. From a full Canon system to M's. Fuji XPro, so I could have zooms. m43. If you want small, m43 is THE system. Just add a couple of the new Pana Leica zooms for insane range and Olympus primes for spectacular optics.

I think each of use has a slightly different set of tolerances when it comes to what we're prepared to carry and what's ideal. I know for me it's about 6kg, if photography is important. And 2-3kg if I'm just out and about. Or a body and a 50 when I want to practice *seeing*. My 6kg figure comes from the trips I've done. To that I'll add my tripod, bag and filters. In a good bag with my body on a sling strap I can walk all day, comfortably. Some will carry more. Most will carry less. Would I carry the Z7 more often? Only if it had what the S1R, X1D and SL have that I find important. But it doesn't. Not quite.

*If* the SL 2 is slightly smaller and has improved ergonomics I will be very pleased. I'm all for saving some grams. BUT... Not if it loses the superb usability of the original. Not if Leica retain mandatory LENR (which they probably will). Not if they drop the long exposure times of the original. Not if it handles like a Sony because it's too small for the lenses.

Gordon

p.s. I should qualify my earlier post by saying while I like the SL handling I positively HATE the vertical grip. Used it once. Was repulsed. It sits in the closet, unloved. Horrible thing. Like many others I use an RRS base plate.

[Jeff S]

19 minutes ago, bags27 said:

 

it would close the gap too much with the SL?  

...Of course the TL lenses are not weather sealed, so there's a limiting factor....

This... body and lenses.

Jeff

[tom0511]

I think one thing could improve the success of the Cl-system a lot: A more serious midrange zoom. Starting at 16mm instead of 18mm and f2.8-4.0 (instead of 5.6).

The other thing would be either sensor stabi or a IS version of the 55-135.

As soon as on starts using primes the CL/TL system moves closer to the SL system, compared when using zooms.(except the UWA 11-23 which is great IMO).

With a higher MP SL body (or the s1r) the Cl lenses are quite attractive as light addition for the times when one doesnt need the full resolution.

[colonel]

13 hours ago, nicci78 said:

Summilux-TL 35 asph asph is 428g with 0.35m minimum focusing distance AF/MF

APO-Summicron-SL 50 asph is 740g with 0.35m minimum focusing distance AF/MF 

312g heavier, twice the price. Weather sealed and faster AF for the SL version  

Taking into account SL weight of 847g vs 403g for the CL. The difference between 24x36 and APS-C is quite huge. 1587g vs 831g.

SL set is twice heavier, bulkier and more expensive. We should wait for higher resolution SL2 to get definitive advantages against CL. 

 

Hmmm, so difference is just justified by number of pixels

Funny, I measure cameras completely differently, by weight, so that makes SL 91% better then the CL, and easily justifies the higher cost

 

Edited September 9, 2019 by colonel

[nicci78]

if weight was the only factor, M lenses would be total trash. 

[Tailwagger]

Just now, nicci78 said:

if weight was the only factor, M lenses would be total trash. 

Not so, the Summiluxes would be quite good. The summicrons would be trash.

[NicholasT]

15 minutes ago, tom0511 said:

I think one thing could improve the success of the Cl-system a lot: A more serious midrange zoom. Starting at 16mm instead of 18mm and f2.8-4.0 (instead of 5.6).

The other thing would be either sensor stabi or a IS version of the 55-135.

As soon as on starts using primes the CL/TL system moves closer to the SL system, compared when using zooms.(except the UWA 11-23 which is great IMO).

With a higher MP SL body (or the s1r) the Cl lenses are quite attractive as light addition for the times when one doesnt need the full resolution.

+1

I'm very pleased with CL (particularly when using 35 1.4...hard not to be).

If Leica were to do the things you outlined, the CL would become an even more compelling stand alone platform while also becoming even more attractive as a companion to the SL. Using faster CL glass on SL is the single best way to add flexibility to SL platform.

Accepting lower resolution in exchange for portability is not really much of a compromise (in most cases) that is if one accepts the premise that with few exceptions (landscape / large prints / studio work etc) a great photograph is not defined or limited by its resolution.

A great photograph is a great photograph whether at 12MP,  24 MP or 50MP.

What we subsequently do with that photograph is what defines the need for resolution. Very few great photographs ever get viewed or printed at a size that truly requires high resolution. It's as though we make the decision to saddle ourselves with impractical camera and lens selections in order to preserve the possibility that at some point we may need or want that high resolution. The bigger question we should be asking ourselves is how many great photographs never get taken because the gear wasn't available or too much trouble to access (change lens etc). 

Every photographer is likely to have his/her own view of these tradeoffs, just can't help but wonder if the question gets asked often enough. This is just my personal perspective. Before I get taken to task let me state that I respect all those who disagree with this point of view and want to see a 47MP SL2 and then a 65MP+ SL3 etc etc.

Bringing this point full circle to the main topic of this thread, I'm hoping for SL2 with 36MP to 41MP (max) which should be more than sufficient resolution for use with SL lens while not unnecessarily slowing down the camera. The added resolution will more easily facilitate the use of TL lens at more than acceptable resolution, which of course will be further enhanced if Leica produces more prime lens like the TL 35mm 1.4. I would venture a guess this could ultimately please both CL and SL owners.

[colonel]

The CL has been held back by its lenses. You could say the same for the SL. I hope Leica’s new SL roadmap (to be announced with new camera) will be cool

one light in the CL space, are the excellent 7artisans lenses. I have been using the 55mm f1.4 and it’s brilliant

at least the SL has excellent Sigma and Panny lenses. Waiting for 7artisans full frame L mount. And hello Voigtlander - anyone there

 

Edited September 9, 2019 by colonel

[Capnord]

First photo of SL2 by Nokishita. 47MP and 4K video

Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here…

Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!

[Capnord]

 

[Advertisement]

Hallo,

Look here: Leica L-Mount

[frame-it]

i hope "Cine mode" refers to the ASC-M10 "Cine-looks"