Just upgraded to M10-P - Buy 35mm Summilux or Summicron + other lenses

[Phillip_Meyer]

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Hi,

A few days ago I upgraded from a very old M8 (which I am keeping) to a brand new M10-P. (First reactions are that it’s a fantastic improvement)

I have a 50mm Summilux lens that’s as old as the M8 (about 10 years or so) and I absolutely love shooting with that wide open (f1.4). It (like all my other lenses) are like completely different lenses compared to using it on the M8 so I’m a bit lost as to what lenses to buy.

I also have a 24mm Elmarit f2.8 and a 90mm and a 90mm Summicron f2. Both are about 10 years old but I almost never used them on the M8 because I felt the 24mm wasn’t wide enough and the 90mm was just such a long zoom on that sensor.

I really want to buy a 35mm lens and I keep reading in the forum that the 35mm Summicron is actually fantastic so I’m tempted to buy one of those but I historically shot f1.4 on my 50mm lens (which was pretty much the only lens I ever used on the M8) that I think I might regret buying the Summicron over the Summilux.

Any thoughts on the two 35mm options and also on how much use I will get from the 90mm (I’m tempted to sell or trade in the 24mm and maybe the 90mm). I’m not a pro and just use the camera for photos of family, friends, street photography and similar.

[otto.f]

19 minutes ago, Phillip_Meyer said:

I have a 50mm Summilux lens that’s as old as the M8 (about 10 years or so) and I absolutely love shooting with that wide open (f1.4). It (like all my other lenses) are like completely different lenses compared to using it on the M8 so I’m a bit lost as to what lenses to buy.

I can follow you completely, you know what? I sold my 50 Summilux asph after I stepped over from M8 to M9. I also swapped my Summicron 28 asph for the 35mm Summilux FLE. For me it is the ‘king of colors’ in 35 Leica M lenses.

I still have my Elmarit 24 and I will never part from it. I used it not so much on my M8. So in full format it really is a different lens. In your place I would rather swap your 90. But I think the APO 90 is unsurpassed. I’m not very 50 minded so I can do now with the 50 Elmar-M, which I find stunning. 

[a.noctilux]

Phillip,

I don't know which Summilux-M 50mm you use, just two things different (out of much more) M8/M10:

- while on M8, we try to use to 640 ISO, on M10 (I don't have M10-P), I can use to 6400 ISO and more if need be

so F/1.4 lens is not required so now I just use this nice Summarit-M line in 35/50/75mm cheaper/lighter but as good as other Leica lenses at same aperture,

I'm lucky to have those Summilux-M lenses when I need (but now very little use on those digital M)

- the difference field on each has two effects :

a - in M8 the good center part of the lens is recorded but in M10, the borders are also recorded with their aberrations

like curvature of field, CA or coma (and so on) not seen in M8 files with same lens, same aperture

b - in most lenses (so Leica too), the wider apertures are affected with those aberrations more than closed down

 

so if I need to use my Summilux or Noctilux, I must live with those "flaws" or "effects" and with lenses less wide open f/2.5 or f/2.8, I can use them with peace of mind

I conclude that by what you wrote, Summicron-M 2/35mm can be the best compromise for your new M10-P.

Arnaud

[Phillip_Meyer]

Now I don’t want to part with any of my existing lenses but still want a new 35mm 😂

Thanks for the feedback.

[M11 for me]

Well, I would never sell one of my lenses either.

Now it is still open wether to go for Summilux or Summicron or Summarit . . .

[lct]

Only you can know if you need/want  f/1.4. Do you plan to shoot indoor or at night? If yes better take a Summilux of course. If not a Summicron will be smaller, lighter and less expensive anyway. As for being fantastic it is a matter of tastes needless to say. AFAIC i prefer my 35/1.4 FLE for its speed and sharpness and my 35/2 asph v1 for its size and OoF rendition. FWIW.

[M11 for me]

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The difference in weight is less than 50g !! (from lux to cron)

[Phillip_Meyer]

I would definitely shoot indoors and at night a lot which is why I often used the f1.4 on my 50mm with my m8. So I’m very tempted to do that with the 35mm but as was mentioned, I can use a much higher ISO with the M10-P. However, I really like having the background blown out at f1.4 so I think I’m selling myself the summilux.

However, aside from never selling a lens (which I hate to do), will I really get the use oft of a 24mm Elmarit and a 35mm Summilux?

[lct]

19 minutes ago, Phillip_Meyer said:

I would definitely shoot indoors and at night a lot which is why I often used the f1.4 on my 50mm with my m8. So I’m very tempted to do that with the 35mm but as was mentioned, I can use a much higher ISO with the M10-P. However, I really like having the background blown out at f1.4 so I think I’m selling myself the summilux.

However, aside from never selling a lens (which I hate to do), will I really get the use oft of a 24mm Elmarit and a 35mm Summilux?

In practice you won't shoot much above 3200 iso i suspect as 6400 iso is rather noisy on the M10-P, at least it was so on the M10 i tried a couple years ago. Then at 3200 iso, f/1.4 is more than useful in low light to avoid motion blur on moving subjects. Otherwise, never sell a Leica lens my grand mother said . Seriously 24 feels significantly wider than 35 actually and you might be happy to keep your 24 if you are tempted by a Visoflex, an SL or a digital CL soon or late.

Edited August 14, 2019 by lct

[lct]

35 minutes ago, M10 for me said:

The difference in weight is less than 50g !! (from lux to cron)

You must have a thin lux or a fat cron then .

[Jeff S]

Looks like you’re in London... maybe you can find a friendly dealer to demo options. A lot comes down to personal taste, ergonomics and handling, not just speed and optics.  The M10 provides a lot of file flexibility.  And there really are no bad choices.

Jeff

[Phillip_Meyer]

Thanks, I’m going to drop into a shop and look in the morning.

[lykaman]

Don't forget, Uncle Amex - Doubles Your Warranty (Certain Stipulations).  L

[6bit]

6 hours ago, Phillip_Meyer said:

Now I don’t want to part with any of my existing lenses but still want a new 35mm 😂

Thanks for the feedback.

This is my problem. I have more 35s than I can count. I have both the Cron and Lux. Both are great, but I go Lux every time. I also enjoy the CV 1.4/35 I and II a lot. 

[gotium]

Have gone through a collection of 35 mm lenses, and favorite by a good margin is the ZM 35/1.4 distagon. It is a little large though. 

[ChicagoMatthew]

My vote is a 35mm summicron asph with the clip on hood. Now that a newer “better” version is out the prices have gone down a little. But honestly, you don’t really need as fast lenses with the m10, like you did with the m8. You’re getting at least 3-4 stops with the camera upgrade. So, theoretically if you shot just like you did now, with a summicron over a summilux you’d still be up 3 stops and you’d have a sharper image with less field curvature. 

[otto.f]

10 hours ago, Phillip_Meyer said:

Now I don’t want to part with any of my existing lenses but still want a new 35mm 😂

Thanks for the feedback.

Very wise, swapping leads more often to disappointment than keeping. And on the long run you loose more money than keeping and expanding your collection of lenses. The problem is however, that people are not inclined to feel that loss on the long run, but can feel the pain of buying expensive lenses at the short term. This can all be bypassed with buying secondhand lenses that hold their value. You can also invest in an M2, 3 or 4, they keep on growing in value; this compensates for the acquisition of ‘too expensive’ lenses. Btw the value of a Summicron 35 iv keeps on growing in value too, probably the most of all old lenses. 

[otto.f]

9 hours ago, Phillip_Meyer said:

will I really get the use oft of a 24mm Elmarit and a 35mm Summilux?

Maybe you overlook the fact that you have a certain image of your 24 because of your experience of the M8 with it. You can always sell it later if it doesn’t suit you on full format. 

But I don’t think that ‘’using oft’’ is an argument. I use my Elmarit 24 not often, perhaps even seldom. But among the prints on the wall the 24 is more present than others. 

About ISO: for me ISO is not at all an argument to choose for 1.4, 2.0 or 2.8, only the character of out of focus area’s. I do not have the 50/2.8 because I have higher ISO’s nowadays, it’s just how it draws. 

Edited August 15, 2019 by otto.f

[M11 for me]

vor 10 Stunden schrieb lct:

You must have a thin lux or a fat cron then .

We speak of the 35mm Summicron weighing 280g versus the 35mm Summilux with 320g. This is according to the specifications of Leica on their Website. Do I mix up something?

Based on that little difference in weight I decided for the Summilux as I use it inside as well. 

Edited August 15, 2019 by M10 for me

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Hallo,

Look here: Leica M

[lct]

According to my Leica specs (black anodized, sans hood):
Summicron 35/2 asph v1: 35mm x 53mm, 255g
Summicron 35/2 asph v2: 36mm x 54mm, 252g