Vieri Posted June 20, 2019 Share #101 Posted June 20, 2019 Advertisement (gone after registration) 23 minutes ago, xiaubauu2009 said: Pffff.... coming from users of Leica S and talking about purpose, rich amateur toys etc is not at all un-convincing Oh, are you off the mark here I wish I were an amateur, and I could buy my gear just because I wanted to without having to justify it for my business. I think that's one of the best way to enjoy photography, and I have nothing against that - as long as one is clear about it. I just don't see why people have a desperate need to rationalise their purchases even when they are lucky enough to have the luxury not to have to Unfortunately, as a working professional my gear choices have to be purpose-oriented. While I am lucky enough and successful enough with my photography to be able to afford anything I want, I still cannot throw money down the drain when I choose a camera system - it simply wouldn't make any sense business-wise. And, while I have been a Leica Ambassador using a Leica SL for three years, that ended when I resigned in December 2018. Even then, I only used a Leica S briefly because, as it happens, I found out that it wasn't good for my purpose... Best regards, Vieri Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted June 20, 2019 Posted June 20, 2019 Hi Vieri, Take a look here 007 vs Hassy x1-D . I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
xiaubauu2009 Posted June 20, 2019 Share #102 Posted June 20, 2019 3 minutes ago, Vieri said: Oh, are you off the mark here I wish I were an amateur, and I could buy my gear just because I wanted to without having to justify it for my business. I think that's one of the best way to enjoy photography, and I have nothing against that - as long as one is clear about it. I just don't see why people have a desperate need to rationalise their purchases even when they are lucky enough to have the luxury not to have to Unfortunately, as a working professional my gear choices have to be purpose-oriented. While I am lucky enough and successful enough with my photography to be able to afford anything I want, I still cannot throw money down the drain when I choose a camera system - it simply wouldn't make any sense business-wise. And, while I have been a Leica Ambassador using a Leica SL for three years, that ended when I resigned in December 2018. Even then, I only used a Leica S briefly because, as it happens, I found out that it wasn't good for my purpose... Best regards, Vieri I get where you are coming from. And I will leave it at that. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daedalus2000 Posted June 20, 2019 Share #103 Posted June 20, 2019 4 hours ago, Vieri said: Again, I don't "keep" doing anything, I just posted my thoughts once and, yet again, you don't refute any of my points - which by itself kinda proves them. Sorry, but this is very very weak logic. All your points boil down to the fact that the camera is too heavy for you, and that is all. Everything else you said is about not needing some of the great properties/options that the GFX 100 has. Fair enough, but options are not a weakness, lack of options is. Also if you calculate the total cost (body and lenses) the X1d II is as expensive as the GFX100 with a lot less features. But it is a beautiful camera and lighter so I am sure it will be a good choice for many people. By the way you spend a lot of money getting an XD1 and now it lost most of its value. Are you not upset at Hasselblad for that? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daedalus2000 Posted June 20, 2019 Share #104 Posted June 20, 2019 39 minutes ago, Vieri said: On a side note, Iceland has the fifth per-capita income in the World (GDP), so the fact that Fuji sold more in Iceland than in the whole of South America or something, kinda proves my point about the target buyer of the GFX 100, unless Iceland is full of professional photographers whom all need 100 MP... Best regards, Vieri You have a very arbitrary way of "proving" your points.... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vieri Posted June 20, 2019 Share #105 Posted June 20, 2019 1 minute ago, Daedalus2000 said: Sorry, but this is very very weak logic. All your points boil down to the fact that the camera is too heavy for you, and that is all. Everything else you said is about not needing some of the great properties/options that the GFX 100 has. Fair enough, but options are not a weakness, lack of options is. Also if you calculate the total cost (body and lenses) the X1d II is as expensive as the GFX100 with a lot less features. But it is a beautiful camera and lighter so I am sure it will be a good choice for many people. By the way you spend a lot of money getting an XD1 and now it lost most of its value. Are you not upset at Hasselblad for that? Hello Daedalus, not really, weight was just one of my points. The list was longer, and he didn't refute any of them. By the way, I don't think I ever said that features/options are a weakness, can you please quote me where I supposedly said that? About the X1D, no I am not. I never consider buying gear as an investment, they are tools and a business expense for me. Best regards, Vieri Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
xiaubauu2009 Posted June 20, 2019 Share #106 Posted June 20, 2019 5 minutes ago, Daedalus2000 said: You have a very arbitrary way of "proving" your points.... Just leave it at that, mate. To each it’s own？did I used it right? 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vieri Posted June 20, 2019 Share #107 Posted June 20, 2019 Advertisement (gone after registration) 2 minutes ago, Daedalus2000 said: You have a very arbitrary way of "proving" your points.... I just connect different information & facts and draw conclusions, it's a pretty interesting exercise. Fact. Iceland has a population of 340.000 people give or take; South-America on the other hand has 422 million people, give or take; Fact. Iceland has the fourth-to-sixth highest per-capita GDP of the world (depending on which agency you trust); Fact (according to Stuart, which I trust implicitly). Fuji sold more GFX MF cameras in Iceland than in the whole of South America. Assuming that Iceland has a comparable percentile of professional photographers as any other country, you tell me what this means when it comes to the demographics of the average buyer of high-priced MF gear in Iceland. Best regards, Vieri 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Photon42 Posted June 20, 2019 Share #108 Posted June 20, 2019 5 minutes ago, Vieri said: About the X1D, no I am not. I never consider buying gear as an investment, they are tools and a business expense for me. Which is precisely what I would call an investment, if I were a professional photographer 😉 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vieri Posted June 20, 2019 Share #109 Posted June 20, 2019 27 minutes ago, Photon42 said: Which is precisely what I would call an investment, if I were a professional photographer 😉 I think we just gotta agree on the term, my bad, I was thinking financial investment when I said it rather than investing in developing my business I expect to make money on the former, while I write off gear expenses over a few years and I am not concerned if the gear I bought loses resale value - I just know it does, it's just the way it is and I don't expect otherwise, and I by the time I wrote it off (5 years in Italy to completely write it off my taxes) anything I sell it for is extra money. Best regards, Vieri 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Likaleica Posted June 20, 2019 Share #110 Posted June 20, 2019 1 hour ago, xiaubauu2009 said: I think that's what they are going to have anyway. My chinese friends are all salivating at the 907x and X1Dii, it will sell like hotcakes... Crazy, but I had dreams about this set-up all last night. I certainly don't need it and haven't had GAS ever since I got my M10 2 years ago. But I do have 2 old Hassy bodies that would look sweet with that new CFV and it would be really sweet to have a 907x to go along with it. Probably will wait for a few people to get bored with theirs and offer them up on eBay before I consider it, though. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
alan.y Posted June 20, 2019 Share #111 Posted June 20, 2019 Here's a "wealthy amateur" if there ever was one! I think this ad is only marginally more tasteful than the Leica Tiananmen one. 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mgrayson3 Posted June 20, 2019 Share #112 Posted June 20, 2019 1 hour ago, alan.y said: Here's a "wealthy amateur" if there ever was one! I think this ad is only marginally more tasteful than the Leica Tiananmen one. Fortunately, I've never seen a Leica ad. The one above, though, made me deeply ashamed of being a Hassy owner. I watched it because I was hoping for information. Instead, I need a vaccine booster against "smug". 1 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Photon42 Posted June 20, 2019 Share #113 Posted June 20, 2019 Would you drive an E-Mustang ... but well. I take it as self-ironical. In a way, it is funny. And it isn't a moral spinal cracker for the company which is already behind the great firewall. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stuart Richardson Posted June 20, 2019 Share #114 Posted June 20, 2019 (edited) Anyway, regarding Iceland, it is true that it is a wealthy country, and I am sure that they sold the GFX to a bunch of amateurs as well. But the point I was trying to make was less about Iceland versus South America. Most South American countries have far less wealth per capita than Iceland, and photography as a full time profession is also more common in wealthier countries, so I think there are probably a much higher percentage of pros in Iceland who can justify a GFX than might in most places in South America. I am also not sure to what extent this was true or an exaggeration. My point was much more about how popular the GFX50 was with professionals here, (at least 10 that I know of use one) and by comparison how few X1D's I have seen (0). This is not a condemnation of the X1D. Edited June 20, 2019 by Stuart Richardson Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stuart Richardson Posted June 20, 2019 Share #115 Posted June 20, 2019 That ad is hilarious! All I can think of are two things: 1. Who puts on a record and leaves immediately? 2. How far did he have to drive his electric mustang to get from his verdant suburban home to that industrial district? 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff S Posted June 20, 2019 Share #116 Posted June 20, 2019 And a guy like that would surely use an expensive classic bag. The ad folks must not follow forums. Jeff 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
peterv Posted June 20, 2019 Share #117 Posted June 20, 2019 Vieri, aren’t rich amateurs your target market since you went in the workshop-business? I would guess the people who attend those meetings are not wealthy old professional photographers either, for that matter. And I would think that the fashionable highly saturated long exposure, Fine Art prints that you’re trying to sell aren’t aimed at poor landscape collectors? What is this, DPReview? Where everyone seems to feel the urge to come in and do a I’m-a-Pro-and-I-know-best act? The ‘wealthy amateur’ may very well be the person who keeps the MF business - and yours - alive. She/he deserves a little less disdain. All IMHO, of course. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pico Posted June 20, 2019 Share #118 Posted June 20, 2019 38 minutes ago, Stuart Richardson said: regarding Iceland, it is true that it is a wealthy country, Iceland also has an unfortunate record of public health. Balance. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
alan.y Posted June 20, 2019 Share #119 Posted June 20, 2019 (edited) Above all I'm just dumbfounded by the literal-mindedness of the video. It's almost insultingly childish. Every single motif, including the protagonist's photograph, is a combination of digital and analogue. Also note that the protagonist is called JACK GUY. Who the hell came up with this stuff? I don't believe Vieri meant to expressed "disdain" towards wealthy amateurs. His overall point, as I take it, is that one should be more thoughtful and deliberate about gear choice, which is salutary. Also for balance, one of the X2D promo videos below. It's nice to see a female professional photographer featured. Edited June 20, 2019 by alan.y 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
peterv Posted June 20, 2019 Share #120 Posted June 20, 2019 The Hasselblad promo video is just that, looks like a small budget local job to me. The camera operating, props and casting of the model, etc. all shout ‘low budget’ to my eyes. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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