Servicing R cameras: the end of the story for R8 and R9

[cpclee]

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The end of serviceability of the R8 / R9 sounds legit to me.  I called Wetlzar near the end of 2017 and they said they were about to run out of parts for these cameras.   Personally I’m not worried.  If my R9 dies I will just buy another R camera as they are priced quite reasonably.  I can be happy with any good condition R6-R9 body.    

On a totally separate note, I saw on YouTube a recent interview of Norbert Rosing (famed German nature photographer and a famous Leica R user) who after a few years with S and SL bodies seems to have gone back to using his R8 / R9.  In the interview he confesses to not “get” digital.   The only digital he seems to use at the moment is the M monochrome now that he is shooting some black and white as well.  He was exclusively a Leica R / color slide shooter throughout most of his career.

Edited May 14, 2019 by cpclee

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[wlaidlaw]

Sadly there is probably not a big enough pool of R8/9 users to generate a cottage industry of new parts being made, as has grown up for old Porsche 911's. I waited months for gearbox parts for my 1977 911 RSR to arrive from Stuttgart. I found that a company in the USA makes perfect parts and from a  higher spec steel than the factory ones were ever made of, then heat treated by aircraft part makers. 

Wilson

[james.liam]

19 hours ago, wlaidlaw said:

Sadly there is probably not a big enough pool of R8/9 users to generate a cottage industry of new parts being made, as has grown up for old Porsche 911's. I waited months for gearbox parts for my 1977 911 RSR to arrive from Stuttgart. I found that a company in the USA makes perfect parts and from a  higher spec steel than the factory ones were ever made of, then heat treated by aircraft part makers. 

Wilson

35,000 R8s and 10,000 R9s were produced. That's a sizable pool.

20 hours ago, cpclee said:

The end of serviceability of the R8 / R9 sounds legit to me.  I called Wetlzar near the end of 2017 and they said they were about to run out of parts for these cameras.   Personally I’m not worried.  If my R9 dies I will just buy another R camera as they are priced quite reasonably.  I can be happy with any good condition R6-R9 body.   

They are a steal when you consider what Contax or Olympus P&S film cameras are being sold for. And they too are equally unserviceable nowadays.

[cpclee]

1 hour ago, james.liam said:

35,000 R8s and 10,000 R9s were produced. That's a sizable pool.

They are a steal when you consider what Contax or Olympus P&S film cameras are being sold for. And they too are equally unserviceable nowadays.

Yes i have a contax t3 and that baby is now one to two thousand dollars on the used market.

At some point some manufacturers might find it profitable to re enter the premium film P&S market. I for one would love to have a refreshed Leica CM.

Edited May 15, 2019 by cpclee

[wlaidlaw]

4 hours ago, james.liam said:

35,000 R8s and 10,000 R9s were produced. That's a sizable pool.

They are a steal when you consider what Contax or Olympus P&S film cameras are being sold for. And they too are equally unserviceable nowadays.

......but how many are still in active use. I would guess it is a fraction of this. I occasionally see another R9 user and other R but I cannot remember the last time I saw an R8 in use, probably in my wife's godfather's hands 15 years ago. 

Wilson

[wagner]

Well, Wilson, 45000 cameras have been made and sold worldwide. How big was then even the chance 20 years ago to meet someone with a Leica R8/9? I actually only have seen one photographer - a DOP on a film commercial (2003) - with a Leica R8....

How often have I seen someone with a Leica SL?  Never. But I still suppose, they get used....

I actually think, that Leica R cameras, in relation to their production number, are still getting used more than cameras of other manufacturers.

[wlaidlaw]

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I suspect sadly, that most of the R's are sitting on shelves or in cupboards, gathering dust. 

Wilson

PS on a recent 3 week trip to India, I met 2 folk using M cameras, one MP (film), one M10; 1 person using a Q-P and 1 using a digital CL. The person with the Q-P was not a happy bunny as he had bought the Q-P 2 days before the Q2 was announced. I had my R9 and digital CL. W.

Edited May 15, 2019 by wlaidlaw

[mann61]

Well I'm going out with one of my R8s c/w 35-70/f4 or 90/2 this afternoon. If anyone of them gives up the ghost buy another they're cheap as chips.

What lasts forever? Maybe my Leicaflex😊

[thebarnman]

On 5/13/2019 at 9:50 PM, cpclee said:

I too very was upset when Leica abandoned the R system.  I sold off my 2 R cameras (R9, R6.2),  5 lenses and DMR.  

It's a shame you went through all that only to go through the trouble of getting them all back.  To me there's only a few R lenses worth hanging on to that is that are up to how you put it "SL lenses are typically phenomenal" as I would expect since they are much newer than all the R lenses.  Like I said, I think there are about three maybe four that hold up to today's (new) Leica lenses.  Of course the older R lenses do have a look to them that some like, and that's fine too.  I never felt that I had to abandon my R9 just because Leica was no longer supporting it...luckily however it still works, and I did get it worked on one time when it needed to be fixed when it was still being supported.  As some have mentioned; there are those out there who can still work on them, but of course you would need another R9 (or some other R camera) for parts.  Overall, the R system should last at least our lifetime and somewhat beyond.  

I have an old car that was abandoned years ago, but I still drive it.  Sometimes I'm able to get original part, but other times I had to get parts from a junk yard, and once installed; the car worked as expected again.  Actually what I think would be hard after a certain period of time is getting parts for a older digital camera.  Maybe I'm wrong about that, but with each new generation everything else before that is typically obsolete...even though people are still using them like the M9 for example.     

  

[thebarnman]

On 5/13/2019 at 10:04 PM, cpclee said:

The end of serviceability of the R8 / R9 sounds legit to me.  I called Wetlzar near the end of 2017 and they said they were about to run out of parts for these cameras.   Personally I’m not worried.  If my R9 dies I will just buy another R camera as they are priced quite reasonably.  I can be happy with any good condition R6-R9 body.    

On a totally separate note, I saw on YouTube a recent interview of Norbert Rosing (famed German nature photographer and a famous Leica R user) who after a few years with S and SL bodies seems to have gone back to using his R8 / R9.  In the interview he confesses to not “get” digital.   The only digital he seems to use at the moment is the M monochrome now that he is shooting some black and white as well.  He was exclusively a Leica R / color slide shooter throughout most of his career.

I pretty much like to use transparency film too.  Normally B&W negatives reversed processed for B&W positive slides to be projected onto the big screen.     

[thebarnman]

On 5/13/2019 at 11:14 PM, wlaidlaw said:

Sadly there is probably not a big enough pool of R8/9 users to generate a cottage industry of new parts being made, as has grown up for old Porsche 911's. I waited months for gearbox parts for my 1977 911 RSR to arrive from Stuttgart. I found that a company in the USA makes perfect parts and from a  higher spec steel than the factory ones were ever made of, then heat treated by aircraft part makers. 

Wilson

Damn, spare parts better than what was originally made?  That's hitting the bullseye! 

  

[thebarnman]

On 5/14/2019 at 7:00 PM, james.liam said:

35,000 R8s and 10,000 R9s were produced. That's a sizable pool.

They are a steal when you consider what Contax or Olympus P&S film cameras are being sold for. And they too are equally unserviceable nowadays.

When you consider at the time film was kind of on the way out, and from what I read not too many spare parts were made like in the kind of numbers you would see from the manufacture of M cameras.  So less people using the R series today and they've already run out of parts?  Sad, but at least we get by with what we can.   

[thebarnman]

On 5/15/2019 at 1:05 AM, wagner said:

I actually think, that Leica R cameras, in relation to their production number, are still getting used more than cameras of other manufacturers.

That's a good point.  More likely more being used when compared to most film point and shoots.

[thebarnman]

On 5/15/2019 at 1:55 AM, wlaidlaw said:

I suspect sadly, that most of the R's are sitting on shelves or in cupboards, gathering dust.

Yep, and they're going to be great for spare parts one day!  And hey, if all they are doing is gathering dust, they might be in better condition than what your trying to fix!  

 

[wlaidlaw]

1 hour ago, thebarnman said:

When you consider at the time film was kind of on the way out, and from what I read not too many spare parts were made like in the kind of numbers you would see from the manufacture of M cameras.  So less people using the R series today and they've already run out of parts?  Sad, but at least we get by with what we can.   

Leica did not actually run out of spare parts, they sold them all off. Leicaflex and R3-R7 to Paepke, who at least are using them to provide service for Leica Reflex owners. Sadly the R8 and R9 parts were all sold off to Photo-Arsenal who are neither selling them on at present or providing service. It might have been nice if Leica had offered them for sale only to companies who would give an undertaking to provide a parts service for R owners. That would have been the responsible thing to do for owners who have often shown great loyalty to Leica over the years and recently seem to be getting precious little in the way of reciprocation. I really cannot understand why these parts were not sold to the LHSA or to one of the service gurus like Don Goldberg. Perhaps a combination would have been the answer, where the LHSA members provided the purchase funds and the parts sales service was then contracted out to Don on a commission basis but it's too late anyway now. 

Wilson

[jaapv]

That R8 and R9 cameras lack spare parts is not really a problem. These cameras are so over-engineered that any repair is likely to be uneconomical anyway.

[earleygallery]

The story with my R3 (which developed an intermittent shutter fault) was that it simply couldn't be repaired, even if I provided a donor camera with a working shutter - apparently they don't have the technical instruments any more which would be required to make the auto shutter and metering gubbins. 

I suspect that any kind of electrical fault with the R cameras will render them useless. Something like a dented body etc. could be repaired (with donor camera spares).

[wlaidlaw]

1 hour ago, jaapv said:

That R8 and R9 cameras lack spare parts is not really a problem. These cameras are so over-engineered that any repair is likely to be uneconomical anyway.

Jaap, 

The problem is that something as simple as a broken hinge on the rear door, like I had on my M4-P could render an R8 or 9 useless. I had no problems sourcing a new rear door, still in its original factory packing for my M4-P, considerably older than my R9. I would like to get a battery compartment door for my R9, so that I could occasionally use it without the large and heavy motor drive (which replaces the original battery compartment door). I messaged and emailed Photo Arsenal twice and got no reply. I phoned and nobody picked up. 

Wilson

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[james.liam]

SHphoto-gmbh, which I think is part of the Jamtschik consortium of which Photo Arsenal is just one part of, might be a source. 

I recently bought a 1.4x R APO extender from them in what looked like an unused state. Problem was it had no rear cap and Leica NJ didn’t have them any longer nor did anyone in the US. Contacted SHphoto and they acknowledged the error of the listing and sent me the cap in a black and silver box.  Wondering if they’re sitting on the new-old stock of parts. 

[wlaidlaw]

21 minutes ago, james.liam said:

SHphoto-gmbh, which I think is part of the Jamtschik consortium of which Photo Arsenal is just one part of, might be a source. 

I recently bought a 1.4x R APO extender from them in what looked like an unused state. Problem was it had no rear cap and Leica NJ didn’t have them any longer nor did anyone in the US. Contacted SHphoto and they acknowledged the error of the listing and sent me the cap in a black and silver box.  Wondering if they’re sitting on the new-old stock of parts. 

James, at least they replied to you. I could not get any response from them. I am guess they are keeping the spares stock they bought from Leica solely to service their sale items and are not prepared to provide a parts service. I noticed that SH-Photo have a large number of old 50 R Summicron and Summilux lenses for sale of all different cam types, so I guess this was all in the grab bag of R stuff they bought from Leica. Some of their prices seem a bit ambitious, especially the brand new stuff but other prices are quite reasonable. I suspect they will have to drop the prices of old 2 cam lenses considerably further, if they want to move them on. Not a big market for those now. I really only buy ROM lenses. 

Wilson