Useful to shoot some slide film – BEOON+M10

[Guest]

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I wondered about this when digitising film. Ideally the analogue characteristics should be visible in the scan, eg grain, softness, but sadly I would expect the digitisation to inflict its own personality on the outcome. B&W film for example has a nice slightly S shape transfer characteristic curve, whereas digital is a straight line, with concern especially about highlight management.

 

From what I see in BEOON digitalizations of transparency film, the contrast and gradation and colors really do come through, as well as the color rendition. With the M10, there is little correction that is necessary — surprisingly, less than with the Imacon Precision III scanner. The highlights also come out a lot like the slides. A good proportion of my slides were shot is harsh tropical light, and in those cases, remain as harsh as in the original slides, but lowering the contrast somewhat improves those images considerably.

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Alone in Bangkok essay on BURN Magazine

[Guest]

This thread is about digitalizing transparency film. Someone pointed me to this article on camera scanning, which has a good description of the differences between color negative film and slide film. I've read the first section, down to the heading "1. The Tools You Will Need".

 

I haven't yet dealt with digitalizing color negative film with the M10. With the M9, I used MakeTIFF and then passed the files through ColorPrerfect, with final adjustments in Lightroom. I'll see what I end up doing with the M10...

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Alone in Bangkok essay on BURN Magazine

[plasticman]

 

From what I see in BEOON digitalizations of transparency film, the contrast and gradation and colors really do come through, as well as the color rendition...

I assume the BEOON copy stand endows the scans with a Leica glow as well?

[Guest]

Cute, but, obviously, I'm referring to using the Focotar 2 lens + M10, as well as the Autograph LightPad 920 LX (color temperature of 6000–6500K) — although I don't know whether a lower color temperature of about 5000K would be preferable.

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Alone in Bangkok essay on BURN Magazine

[Guest JMF]

 

Cute, but, obviously, I'm referring to using the Focotar 2 lens + M10, as well as the Autograph LightPad 920 LX (color temperature of 6000–6500K) — although I don't know whether a lower color temperature of about 5000K would be preferable.

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Alone in Bangkok essay on BURN Magazine

 

 

 

My guess is that the M10 color temperature should be set accordingly then, at 6000 - 6500 K.

[Steve Ricoh]

Anyone using an El-Nikkor 50 f/2.8 ?

 

I'm interested in corner performance, what should I expect, anyone have examples to share?

 

The El-Nikkor 50 f/2.8N is the plastic version, which is better, or doesn't it matter ?

[a.noctilux]

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Steve, it depend mainly on your slides/negatives and not the lens used to have top quality.

 

I thought the same as you (lens is the must/the best) before trying some various lenses with same slides.

As said my references are as handy as can be "projected the Kodachrome 25/64 or Velvia 50 slides" (with Pradovit CA2502 for example).

 

So with the BEOON, macro and enlarging lenses were used with different Ms or other digital cameras :

 

- some macro lenses are better than other but for 1:1 they are all "good for the job"

- most 50mm lenses like f/1.4 or 2 are not the best option even at f/8 or f/16 ... not flat field at all

- all enlarging lenses I have tried are the best quality at 1:1 with less field curvature than 50/55/60mm macro lenses

 a - three (3) Focotar 4.5/50mm of wide time span production = looking for "the best one" = last conclusion they behave mostly same way

 b - EL-Nikkor 2.8/50 N was my second choice and not really different from Focotar results = more flare than Focotar scans dense/black slides

 

- Elmar 3.5/50 (maybe 5/6 tried ?) LTM are very "good with less contrast" depend on conditions

 

- Summar 42mm Repro lens is the best IQ for most slides but sadly the BEOON's colum is too long for 1:1 mask (focus is 2-4cm nearer than 50mm lens)

 

My last conclusion is there is no way to find "best-ideal-lens" as always !

 

If you can buy for cheap EL-Nikkor 2.8/50 give it a try or wait for the "best" (Focotar II or what else) only you can decide.

Have a look here, http://extreme-macro.co.uk/el-nikkor-50mm-28n/

 

I've read the blog and found some ideas...

Maybe my "less contrast/more flare" come from the illuminated F stop or UV sensitivity ?

 

Have fun to find your way .

Edited August 30, 2017 by a.noctilux

[wlaidlaw]

I presume the Focotar lenses are M39 x 26 tpi i.e. standard LTM. If I can find the correct extension tubes to get it to work, I suspect the Elmar 65mm/f3.5 Visoflex lens, designed for copying work, would be good but do I have the correct extension tubes? I do have an M mount 41mm extension tube (a Visoflex replacement tube) but I may run out of BEOON stem height. 

 

Wilson

[Guest]

Much simpler to stick with a 50mm lens, for which the BEOON was designed. Indeed, the Focotar uses the M39 screw mount.

Edited August 30, 2017 by Guest

[wlaidlaw]

I feel the other important consideration for copying of colour slides is the apochromatic correction of the lens. This would be to reduce chromatic aberration softening at the edges and corners of the slide. None of my enlarging lenses are the APO versions (given how little I paid for them, hardly surprising). My 65 Elmar being a mark 1 is colour corrected to some extent but not to the same extent as the 65 Elmar Mk.2 I had but which was stolen by school kids, when I was working in a museum. I will try the enlarging lenses I have but I would be happy to buy an APO Rodagon or APO Companon S if that were to improve the results with the BEOON. 

 

Wilson

[a.noctilux]

Wilson, BEOON is optimum use with 50mm lenses:

not only the adapter lengths are calculated for 50mm, using other focal lengths need variable length "ring" like OTZFO

I don't have tried the 3.5/65 so no experience to share

 

...

For Steve:

a bit more on "rejected" enlarging lenses http://extreme-macro.co.uk/reject-enlarger-lenses/

[Soden]

Hmmm, I was lost in this conversation for a bit as to why everybody was talking about older lenses... I have the M version of the BEOOM or the BEOOM-M as it were...

[a.noctilux]

Hmmm, I was lost in this conversation for a bit as to why everybody was talking about older lenses... I have the M version of the BEOOM or the BEOOM-M as it were...

 

This is "A" ring fault .

 

look here post #9 ... https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/276151-beoon-advice-please-functional-checks-prior-to-purchase/

Edited August 30, 2017 by a.noctilux

[Guest]

Soden - the BEOON can be used with either M-Mount or M39 screw mount lenses. Have a look at the manual, easily available online.

[Soden]

Soden - the BEOON can be used with either M-Mount or M39 screw mount lenses. Have a look at the manual, easily available online.

Then I fail to see the advantages of using older lenses. Wouldn't more modern lenses have a flatter field and better corner to corner sharpness?

[Steve Ricoh]

Much simpler to stick with a 50mm lens, for which the BEOON was designed. Indeed, the Focotar uses the M39 screw mount.

I have the Summilux 50mm f1.4 ASPH, so this should work? or is the comment meant for the 50mm DR?

 

Incidentally, I like your Alone in Bangkok photo essay and the words (which are elegantly written)!

[wlaidlaw]

I did quite a lot of copying/archival work for museums of old hand written documents, illuminated manuscripts etc, using various rigs, Visoflex,Novoflex Bellows, M8, M9 and M240 with digital Visoflex, and assorted lenses. I generally found enlarging lenses (e.g. APO Companon 90mm) were better due to their intentionally flat fields, essential for enlarging work to produce edge to edge sharpness of an enlargement. The only two Leica lenses I found satisfactory were the 65mm/f3.5 Elmar in Visoflex mount (the Mk2 noticeably better than the Mk1) and the 75 mm/f2.5 Summarit, which seems to have an exceptionally flat focus field. I have more Leica 50mm imaging lenses than is sensible for any single person, from 1920's right up to the present but I will still be using enlarger lenses with the BEOON. 

 

Wilson

Edited August 30, 2017 by wlaidlaw

[Guest Nowhereman]

I have the Summilux 50mm f1.4 ASPH, so this should work? or is the comment meant for the 50mm DR?
Incidentally, I like your Alone in Bangkok photo essay and the words (which are elegantly written)!

 

Steve - Thanks for the kind words.

 

As far as I know, from the comments of people who have tried, enlarger lenses will work better in the corners than normal 50 mm lenses. I have only tried the DR Summicron and the Focotar 2 and the latter was much better in the corners, but I only realized how much better the first time I digitalized slides last week, because I had a direct comparison with the slide as a reference. Before that, having only digitalized Tri-X on the BEOON, shot in a rough, street photography style, I only had the impression that the Focotar 2 was "somewhat better." Using a test negative that one used to buy for focussing enlargers would also have made the comparison obvious. 

 

You can certainly start with your Summilux 50mm f1.4 ASPH, say, at f/11 and see how you like it. It also depends on the type of photographic style that you want.

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Alone in Bangkok essay on BURN Magazine

[wlaidlaw]

I have just ploughed through Ctein's Post Exposure book on photo printing and enlarging. He did a very extensive technical test of enlarging lenses. Sadly he did not include either the Focotar 50mm or Focotar 2 50mm lenses. However what is interesting is that the Schneider 50mm non-APO Componon S comes out a little better in most tests than the considerably more expensive Rodenstock 50mm APO Rodagon-N, although these are the two best of the 50mm lenses he tested. From trawling through the internet today most folks subjective (very!) opinions put the Focotar 2 as very highly rated. The problem with them, is that even the newest of these is old, with production of the Focotar 2 finishing in 1979, 38 years ago. Both the Componon S and Rodagon-N were made considerably later than this, with the Rodagon-N 50 still available. 

 

From the Coin Imaging technical tests, the lens in the focal length (or nearly) that stands out is the Schneider APO 45mm with the Componon S not far behind. Sadly neither the Focotar 2 nor the APO Rodagon-N were tested. Would the APO 45m work with the BEOON, I suspect the answer is yes as I note some of the other so called 50mm lenses have true focal lengths of up to 54mm. The APO 45 is still available new, if not in Schneider's current catalogue. Not cheap new at around $900. 

 

Wilson

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Hallo,

Look here: Interesting Leica gear

[a.noctilux]

Wilson, just an idea : lens is only part of the system and far from the "bottle neck".

 

The slides (fine grain like Velvia or Kodachrome) showed, in M10 scans, film grain with almost all my "test 50mm" even the old Elmar 3.5/5cm of 1930's.

 

So, when I use Focotar 50mm, I have some margins in my slide's scans.