Code Name "Clooney"

[Guest VVJ]

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No, just amused at the speculation. With what's being asked for by some learned members, I suspect there is a high percentage of this forum who believe in Father Christmas ..... oh, no I've let the cat out of the bag.

 

On a serious note, I await the announcement with interest as from what I've read it looks as though the (whatever it's called) could be an improvement on the T, TL and even TL2.

 

Cheers, Tom

 

Tom,

 

I will almost certainly get the new CL and the new TL-18mm lens.

 

My reasons are simple.  I passionately hate the Visoflex and 28mm eq is one of my favorite focal lengths.

 

With that out of the way, do I believe that forum members are asking for too much?  No, I don't...  On the contrary I find they are quite soft and apologizing on Leica.

 

Leica has proven with the Q and the SL cameras that they can make excellent easy and fast AF cameras and it is about time they start doing it for the APS-C format as well.

 

And although the TL2 is an improvement over the T it is not the camera it could and should have been...

 

Also, with a price tag of $3K the CL better be good.  That is more than 3 times the Fuji X-E3 and very close to the Sony a7rIII....

 

And there is nothing the CL does that the X-E3 doesn't do, so it better deliver on what it does do...

 

Best, Joris.

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[dkCambridgeshire]

A 'pro' spec APS-C body from Leica would be groundbreaking for them.

 

A made over X1 isn't.

 

James Please tell all the forum members why in your opinion the new CL is 'a made over X1'.

 

You've actually handled one of course  … and used it? 

 

If you haven't, please leave assessments to the Jonos  of this world … i.e.  those who have actually seen and handled and used the camera and who really can give expert opinions next Tuesday.

 

 

dunk 

[earleygallery]

Dunk, I'm talking in terms of styling and apparent functionality from what I can see.

 

I doubt I'm going to be blown away enough by Jono's opinion to want to go out and buy one but I'll let you know.

[dkCambridgeshire]

Dunk, I'm talking in terms of styling and apparent functionality from what I can see.

 

I doubt I'm going to be blown away enough by Jono's opinion to want to go out and buy one but I'll let you know.

 

 

And now you're assessing / commenting on, Jono's field test of the CL before it's been published!! 

 

Maybe you should WAIT … instead of jumping to conclusions. 

 

Please give Leica Camera AG the chance to actually release the camera and advise everyone of its full specification … and maybe read some full reviews … before dismissing it.

 

dunk 

[earleygallery]

Good grief Dunk, are you on commission or something?!?!

 

As I said I'll wait for the full lowdown but I doubt it's a camera I'd want. What's wrong with that!

[tritentrue]

It appears that peerless APS-C image quality--of which the T and TL2 are eminently capable--is of no relevance to those for whom the sun never never seems to shine brightly enough.

 

Having an integrated EVF with the hot shoe left available for an SF-40 will probably be enough to get me to buy the new model, assuming its feature set is no "worse" than what's been speculated so far.  Any other improvements over the TL2 will be icing on the cake.

[Guest VVJ]

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It appears that peerless APS-C image quality--of which the T and TL2 are eminently capable--is of no relevance to those for whom the sun never never seems to shine brightly enough.

 

If you work at a slow pace (manual focus or very deliberate AF) the TL2 is brilliant.

 

If you want fast and snappy AF without hunting the TL2 falls short, especially in low light.

 

Image quality is excellent.  I never said the contrary.

Edited November 19, 2017 by JorisV

[Keith (M)]

Tom,

 

I will almost certainly get the new CL and the new TL-18mm lens.

 

My reasons are simple.  I passionately hate the Visoflex and 28mm eq is one of my favorite focal lengths.

 

 

 

Best, Joris.

Superb built-in EVF & 28mm?  Hmm, let me think about that...  Oh yes, the Q - & full-frame to boot!

[lanetomlane]

Tom,

 

I will almost certainly get the new CL and the new TL-18mm lens.

 

My reasons are simple.  I passionately hate the Visoflex and 28mm eq is one of my favorite focal lengths.

 

With that out of the way, do I believe that forum members are asking for too much?  No, I don't...  On the contrary I find they are quite soft and apologizing on Leica.

 

Leica has proven with the Q and the SL cameras that they can make excellent easy and fast AF cameras and it is about time they start doing it for the APS-C format as well.

 

And although the TL2 is an improvement over the T it is not the camera it could and should have been...

 

Also, with a price tag of $3K the CL better be good.  That is more than 3 times the Fuji X-E3 and very close to the Sony a7rIII....

 

And there is nothing the CL does that the X-E3 doesn't do, so it better deliver on what it does do...

 

Best, Joris.

 

 

Hi Joris

 

From what I've read I'll probably end up with one also, but not the 18mm. I've had a T for a few years and really like it but think the CL will be a good upgrade for me.

 

Agree with you about the Visoflex, it's not bad to use but it keeps coming out of the hotshoe and I'm amazed I've not lost it before now.

 

I had a Q for about a month but couldn't really "connect" with it. The results from it were great but I didn't like the 28mm (much prefer 35 or 50) and I didn't feel as creative using it as I do with the M's. I traded the Q for an SL and absolutely love that camera.

 

I was tempted with the TL2, but heard the rumours about the new camera and have decided to wait until I can actually try one.

 

Regards, Tom

[Guest VVJ]

Superb built-in EVF & 28mm?  Hmm, let me think about that...  Oh yes, the Q - & full-frame to boot!

 

I do already own the Q.  It almost certainly will have to go once I buy the CL and 18mm.  I personally don't see much difference in image quality between Q, SL and TL2.  

[Guest VVJ]

I traded the Q for an SL and absolutely love that camera.

 

I love the SL as well but the lenses are heavy... and the image quality of the TL2 is more than sufficient for me...

 

I personally would love a fast and easy to use APS-C camera that would allow me to sell most of my other gear...  I hope the CL comes close... 

[rosuna]

I expect a very good EVF... I don't believe the rumor about the 020 Viso type EVF. 

 

For Leica is very important to offer the best viewing experience: the best EVF on the SL; the best OVF on the S007; and the superb viewfinder on the M10, improving the already great one on the M240 or M9. 

 

I think Leica will offer a viewfinder at least as good as the Q viewfinder or an improved version of it (higher refresh rate, lower latency).

 

(The 020 Viso could be the best clip-on viewfinder possible when the M10 and TL2 where on the drawing board).

[dkCambridgeshire]

I expect a very good EVF... I don't believe the rumor about the 020 Viso type EVF. 

 

For Leica is very important to offer the best viewing experience: the best EVF on the SL; the best OVF on the S007; and the superb viewfinder on the M10, improving the already great one on the M240 or M9. 

 

I think Leica will offer a viewfinder at least as good as the Q viewfinder or an improved version of it (higher refresh rate, lower latency).

 

(The 020 Viso could be the best clip-on viewfinder possible when the M10 and TL2 where on the drawing board).

 

 

 

Yes it was and likely still is … but unfortunately there are those who do not appreciate just how good the VISO Type 020 is.  

 

When I last used my faulty TL2 (long story … it's gone back to Wetzlar) I was also using my SL ... both cameras were used with the same manual focus R lens.  The TL2 VISO was easier to focus with than the SL's EVF; both finders offered superb images.

 

Likely that the VISO Type 020 is made by EPSON … it's manufactured in Indonesia. 

 

dunk 

Edited November 20, 2017 by dkCambridgeshire

[ropo54]

Yes it was and likely still is … but unfortunately there are those who do not appreciate just how good the VISO Type 020 is.  

 

 The TL2 VISO was easier to focus with than the SL's EVF; both finders offered superb images.

 

 

 

With all due respect, I have a much easier time with the EVFs on the Q and the SL.

Rob 

Edited November 20, 2017 by ropo54

[IkarusJohn]

I'd have to agree - the EVF 020 on the TL2 is fine, but not a match for the SL.

 

I'm surprisingly happy with both - they're not the final image ...

[dkCambridgeshire]

The VISO 020's clarity surprised me at the time; both cameras were being focused on the same distant subject using the same 800mm R lens.  

 

https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/226003-post-your-t-shots-here/?p=3363609

 

dunk 

Edited November 20, 2017 by dkCambridgeshire

[vikasmg]

It appears that peerless APS-C image quality--of which the T and TL2 are eminently capable--is of no relevance to those for whom the sun never never seems to shine brightly enough.

 

Having an integrated EVF with the hot shoe left available for an SF-40 will probably be enough to get me to buy the new model, assuming its feature set is no "worse" than what's been speculated so far.  Any other improvements over the TL2 will be icing on the cake.

If the latest speculation on Leica Rumors are correct, I’m glad I have not put away my the boxes and manuals for the TL2. Might be time to use the services of eBay again.

 

- Vikas

[ropo54]

If the latest speculation on Leica Rumors are correct, I’m glad I have not put away my the boxes and manuals for the TL2. Might be time to use the services of eBay again.

 

- Vikas

 

I suspect there will be an initial flood of TL2s hit the market, causing prices to take a big hit.

 

Of course, this begs the question: is the TL2 going to still appeal to new customers? I suppose the price savings (without buying the visoflex 020) might still have some appeal, but what is the TL2's future?

 

And/or can Leica come up with a more improved EVF and can software updates make AF even faster? 

 

Rob

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[IkarusJohn]

Flood?  Price taking a big hit?  TL2's future?

 

Crikey, that's getting a bit carried away, don't you think?  That new camera isn't even released yet, and you're burying the TL2, which hasn't been out for more than a few months?

 

I get it that some might want a built in EVF, but that's all we're (possibly) talking about.  I'm rather hoping there's more to this release than another APS-C camera and lens, I'd have to say.

[ropo54]

Flood?  Price taking a big hit?  TL2's future?

 

Crikey, that's getting a bit carried away, don't you think?  That new camera isn't even released yet, and you're burying the TL2, which hasn't been out for more than a few months?

 

I get it that some might want a built in EVF, but that's all we're (possibly) talking about.  I'm rather hoping there's more to this release than another APS-C camera and lens, I'd have to say.

 

 

So, your thoughts are that the 2 systems can each generate enough interest with the public to both survive; that there will be enough different buyers for each; that the improvements (as has been speculated here - superior to the TL current evf, and extremely fast AF) will not 'kill off' the TL2 system?  (Obviously, Leica thinks that both can survive).

 

It is a simple question . . . and if there is "more to this release than another APS-C camera and lens" what impact might you imagine it would have on the existing TL2?  From the tone of your reply, it would seem you do not think it will be a major issue for the TL2.  I'm not so sure that I agree with you, but we shall soon see.