lct Posted August 26, 2016 Share #1181 Posted August 26, 2016 Advertisement (gone after registration) The EVF speed is irrelevant for the basic M concept, but a Q with an M mount would be highly attractive for a camera to pair with an M. The EVF is more than relevant in a live view camera like the M240. It is an essential part of it. Best of both worlds as Mr Kaufmann used to say if memory serves. As for your Q with interchangeable lenses, call it a mini SL if you wish but a Q it would not be and an M either. A mini SL could interest me by the way but it would have to be better than my Sony A7s mod so i don't hold my breath without disrespect to anybody. 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted August 26, 2016 Posted August 26, 2016 Hi lct, Take a look here New Leica M in September 2016? The speculations.. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
Giulio Zanni Posted August 26, 2016 Share #1182 Posted August 26, 2016 The question is not how many pixel you have - the question is what the camera and the lens in combination make out of the pixels. Well it is if you have to print big Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted August 26, 2016 Share #1183 Posted August 26, 2016 The EVF is more than relevant in a live view camera like the M240. It is an essential part of it. Best of both worlds as Mr Kaufmann used to say if memory serves. As for your Q with interchangeable lenses, call it a mini SL if you wish but a Q it would not be and an M either. A mini SL could interest me by the way but it would have to be better than my Sony A7s mod so i don't hold my breath without disrespect to anybody. I wouldn't say so; the way the live view and EVF are implemented in the M make them auxiliary systems, not a part of the basic camera concept. No, of course that Q could't be an M, but it would combine well, especially if it functioned without adapter. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ski542002 Posted August 26, 2016 Share #1184 Posted August 26, 2016 I wouldn't say so; the way the live view and EVF are implemented in the M make them auxiliary systems, not a part of the basic camera concept. No, of course that Q could't be an M, but it would combine well, especially if it functioned without adapter. How about am M with an electronic rangefinder/EVF? An EVF is already an electronic image. It should not be too difficult to integrate an electronic rangefinder as a custom profile on the EVF. You'd have the option to see just a nice very large rangefinder patch, or just EVF with magnified view, or both; your choice. The cam used to initiate the mechanical rangefinder would integrate with electronics, before you need to get to all of the mechanical rangefinder mechanism, and all of it's faults should the camera get bumped knocking it out of focus/alignment. Imagine an electronic rangefinder with a 90 or 135mm M lens. You'd still get a live view full frame image without parallax, but the accuracy and focusing speed of a rangefinder patch that would be many times larger than the mechanical version. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
otto.f Posted August 26, 2016 Share #1185 Posted August 26, 2016 Don't see so soon how Leica can beat a Sony A7S II with the price of € 3599, which is already quite expensive. History proves that a new Leica M has to be painfully expensive to be attractive for their aficionados, so will cost around €7500 I guess. This Sony also weighs around 625grams, so in terms of weight and compactness, I don't know how Leica can intervene there with something 'less = more'. 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted August 26, 2016 Share #1186 Posted August 26, 2016 How about am M with an electronic rangefinder/EVF? An EVF is already an electronic image. It should not be too difficult to integrate an electronic rangefinder as a custom profile on the EVF. You'd have the option to see just a nice very large rangefinder patch, or just EVF with magnified view, or both; your choice. The cam used to initiate the mechanical rangefinder would integrate with electronics, before you need to get to all of the mechanical rangefinder mechanism, and all of it's faults should the camera get bumped knocking it out of focus/alignment. Imagine an electronic rangefinder with a 90 or 135mm M lens. You'd still get a live view full frame image without parallax, but the accuracy and focusing speed of a rangefinder patch that would be many times larger than the mechanical version. I wouldn't want to lose the optical viewfinder. An electronic rangefinder system would be good, but the construction is devilishly difficult, it seems. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
CYBORA Posted August 26, 2016 Share #1187 Posted August 26, 2016 Advertisement (gone after registration) Leica would continue the M with only built-in OVF and may create a new line as an EVF version of Q body like camera, because of the fact that Leica is a company to make profits and it is certain that most M users will also buy that Q like body as we can see that in this forum , most users have more than one Leica camera for different purposes. Different models mean more profit for the company. Combining all the wished technology in one body is no good for Leica We can remember this from the Nokia days also. 3 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Giulio Zanni Posted August 26, 2016 Share #1188 Posted August 26, 2016 (edited) I wouldn't say so; the way the live view and EVF are implemented in the M make them auxiliary systems, not a part of the basic camera concept.I wouldn't have bought my 246s without live view, so for me is key. I think it's just a matter of different point of view and how you use the camera. I am convinced that live view and the evf will be maintained and refined in the next model. They should rather think of getting rid of the video function as I never met anybody that shoot video with the M. Edited August 26, 2016 by giulioz Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted August 26, 2016 Share #1189 Posted August 26, 2016 Well, yes, I also bought the M240 for the EVF option, otherwise I would have stuck with the M9. I find it good enough for my use - just. The improved RF/VF was an unexpected bonus. I do shoot video with the M - nice to meet you - to supplement my wife's videocam with long lens wildlife footage. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
platypus Posted August 27, 2016 Share #1190 Posted August 27, 2016 What is rangefinder photography? Never saw this category in the main contests. The only thing I know is that rangefinder is one of the mechanisms to focus a camera Rangefinder photography: a state of mind? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dkCambridgeshire Posted August 27, 2016 Share #1191 Posted August 27, 2016 Rangefinder photography: a state of mind? No … but arguably it's a skill which in its purest form does not necessarily require an EVF or a monitor. Not all photographers can develop that skill to its full potential - even if they claim to have done so. dunk Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter H Posted August 27, 2016 Share #1192 Posted August 27, 2016 (edited) I hope rangefinder photography is not widely regarded as a skill. A rangefinder coupled with an optical viewfinder is a worthwhile and useful thing because it makes some forms of photography easier, not because it requires special skills to use. There are different benefits in OVF/rangefinders and EVFs. I prefer to use the OVF probably over 90% of the time because it makes my style of photography so much easier and more pleasant, which is one reason why I prefer the M to the SL, but the ability to use the EVF when appropriate makes the M an exceptionally versatile camera. The Optical viewfinder doesn't need much if any improvement in my opinion, but the EVF certainly does if the potential of the M is to be realised. Edited August 27, 2016 by Peter H 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
edwardkaraa Posted August 27, 2016 Share #1193 Posted August 27, 2016 (edited) I think rangefinder photography is very unique and different from any other way of photography. The difference is in the way you see the world through the viewfinder which is always in focus and with inaccurate framelines, that force the photographer to take a loose approach on composition and put more emphasis on content and timing. Edited August 27, 2016 by edwardkaraa Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lct Posted August 27, 2016 Share #1194 Posted August 27, 2016 (edited) Hence the famous "loose approach on composition" of Cartier-Bresson. Just kidding Edited August 27, 2016 by lct 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Giulio Zanni Posted August 27, 2016 Share #1195 Posted August 27, 2016 Rangefinder photography: a state of mind? Definitively : typ 246 + M 24/1.4 hand-held with OVF Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! 6 Quote Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/252591-new-leica-m-in-september-2016-the-speculations/?do=findComment&comment=3102509'>More sharing options...
MarkP Posted August 27, 2016 Share #1196 Posted August 27, 2016 Definitively : typ 246 + M 24/1.4 hand-held with OVF Fabulous. What a weird photo :-) 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wlaidlaw Posted August 27, 2016 Share #1197 Posted August 27, 2016 Well it is if you have to print big I have printed to 48" x 72" from the SL's 24 MP and I don't see myself ever wanting to print bigger than this. This was done on an Epson 11880 using their rip engine, as a background for a school poster. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjh Posted August 27, 2016 Share #1198 Posted August 27, 2016 Imagine an electronic rangefinder with a 90 or 135mm M lens. You'd still get a live view full frame image without parallax, but the accuracy and focusing speed of a rangefinder patch that would be many times larger than the mechanical version. Only it wouldn’t. There are advantages to an electronic rangefinder but increased accuracy and focusing speed would not be among these. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjh Posted August 27, 2016 Share #1199 Posted August 27, 2016 I guess that the lack of angular resolution would make the technology useless for any camera designed to take M lenses, but it is interesting. It is hard to say how useful it will prove to be even for a Canon camera but I am curious (as always). Usually there are two steps: first a vendor introduces some new technology, then they try to identify ways of using that technology. For example, Ricoh/Pentax first implemented an in-body image stabiliser, and then they thought about ways to utilise a moveable sensor that went beyond image stabilisation – perspective control, astro tracer, enhancing resolution and reducing moiré etc.. Similarly, Canon started out by designing a sensor with two photosites per pixel to allow for a sensor-based phase-detection AF, then started to explore what else they could achieve with such a design. The new features of the EOS 5D Mark IV just go to show what a technology introduced three years ago is actually capable of. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
platypus Posted August 28, 2016 Share #1200 Posted August 28, 2016 No … but arguably it's a skill which in its purest form does not necessarily require an EVF or a monitor. Not all photographers can develop that skill to its full potential - even if they claim to have done so. dunk Oh but....I was speaking esoterically, maybe too much so? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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