mjh Posted September 3, 2015 Share #721 Posted September 3, 2015 Advertisement (gone after registration) I don't believe this statement about Michael's guidance is correct. He has said, oh, 15 pages back or so -- yeah, I checked -- that if Leica's 3-year M release cycle holds, we wouldn't see deliveries until 2016. Yep, that was my point. Leica is under no obligation to stick to a product cycle of 3 years (Stefan Daniel never suggested this was a law, it is more like a guideline), but if they do they wouldn’t need to announce the next M three years after the announcement of the current model; rather the new model would need to ship three years after the current one did. Actual release dates are the hard currency in this market, not mere announcements. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted September 3, 2015 Posted September 3, 2015 Hi mjh, Take a look here NEW M.. This year.. This Fall.... I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
lct Posted September 3, 2015 Share #722 Posted September 3, 2015 For the new camera to ship in 2016, it has to be announced in 2015 [...] Why so? It can be announced and shipped in 2016. Given that the M240 began shipping in 2013, 2013 + 3 = 2016. Quod erat demonstrandum. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
IkarusJohn Posted September 3, 2015 Share #723 Posted September 3, 2015 And yet, if there's one thing Leica used to struggle with it was actual deliveries. It took until October 2010 for me to get my M9, and I'm still waiting for my 28 Summilux. The one thing they do have control over is the release date - deliveries may be "hard currency", but it is currency Leica has sorely lacked in the past. I guess the first indication will be when the select few get their invitations to the Leica release event. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alan Aurmont Posted September 3, 2015 Share #724 Posted September 3, 2015 Why so? It can be announced and shipped in 2016. Given that the M240 began shipping in 2013, 2013 + 3 = 2016. Quod erat demonstrandum. Leica M was announced in 2012, shipped in 2013. Similarly, "M11" should be announced in September-October 2015 for it to ship in early 2016 (unless, of course, it's announced in early 2016, which I highly doubt). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndreasAM Posted September 3, 2015 Share #725 Posted September 3, 2015 Good question … If you take a closer look at the mount sizes of mirrorless systems for APS-C or MFT, you see that these are similar to the mount diameters of 35 mm SLR systems introduced in the previous century. That is the ratio between throat size and image circle diameter has changed, from about 1.0 for 35 mm SLRs to between 1.5 and 2.0 for newer mirrorless systems (according to Olympus’ calculations, 2.0 would be the ideal ratio). So there is a general trend towards short flange distances and wide mounts – a wide mount fits a large rear element that is required for a (near) telecentric lens delivering light rays that are near perpendicular up to the edges of the sensor. Now if one would design a 35 mm mirrorless system along the same lines, the mount size would resemble those of existing medium-format systems. It might turn out that no vendor dares to actually go this route and that they will all try to make do with smaller mounts. That’s what Sony has done. If the ratio throatsize and image circle diameter is ideally between 1.5 and 2, how does this relate to the flange distance of the mirrorless with an 35 mm SLR's. That is to say, will a camera along these ideal guidelines, when the ratio is below 2.0, becomes thicker to accommodate the increased flange distance, if you compare this to the T and M/Q measurements? Would this explain the rumour for a Leicaflex mimicked thicker middle section? This would also rule out a T-mount for FF, because it is 45 mm wide, thus a ratio of 1.0 with the image circle of a M or R. Not the ideal 1.5 to 2.0 ratio you are talking about when developing a new Ideal futureproof FF- mount. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rijve044 Posted September 3, 2015 Share #726 Posted September 3, 2015 I believe the camera coming this year is not the new M. I had a look these days at Panasonic latest the GX8. See preview at dpreview. This camera reminds me of the Digilux 2 (except for the grip) and is considerably larger, stated by dpreview, than the GX7. And why? Only for MFT? One could suggest, put a T bayonet and the sensor of the Q. The camera is already there. AF lenses!!!!! Sounds plausible. Just my few thoughts. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alan Aurmont Posted September 4, 2015 Share #727 Posted September 4, 2015 Advertisement (gone after registration) Edward from Moscow is telling the truth. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
IkarusJohn Posted September 4, 2015 Share #728 Posted September 4, 2015 Edward from Moscow is telling the truth. So he's not just right, but he's telling the "truth" - yeehaa! Time will tell, I guess. Before I (mis)read Michael's post, I had agreed with him - M8 in 2006; M9 in 2009; and M(240) in 2012 ... the projection is easy. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joakim Posted September 4, 2015 Share #729 Posted September 4, 2015 It's quite a stretch to firmly state a 3 year release cycle out of two measurement points. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
edwardkaraa Posted September 4, 2015 Share #730 Posted September 4, 2015 The person to ask is Jono, but good luck to get a reply His wife just bought him a Leicaflex , I think that's a sign from heaven Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Exodies Posted September 4, 2015 Share #731 Posted September 4, 2015 Does anyone know how much advanced information of a Leica announcement is worth? I mean, what would a gossip site pay for a leak? (Before y'all start sending me money, I must point out that I don't have any information). Would such a leak be more valuable to a gossip site than to another camera manufacturer or an investor? Some parts of "how things work" are very obscure. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevelap Posted September 4, 2015 Share #732 Posted September 4, 2015 If the ratio throatsize and image circle diameter is ideally between 1.5 and 2, how does this relate to the flange distance of the mirrorless with an 35 mm SLR's. That is to say, will a camera along these ideal guidelines, when the ratio is below 2.0, becomes thicker to accommodate the increased flange distance, if you compare this to the T and M/Q measurements? Would this explain the rumour for a Leicaflex mimicked thicker middle section? This would also rule out a T-mount for FF, because it is 45 mm wide, thus a ratio of 1.0 with the image circle of a M or R. Not the ideal 1.5 to 2.0 ratio you are talking about when developing a new Ideal futureproof FF- mount. If I've understood him correctly, In Michael's post the 1.5 and 2.0 ratio's were ideal for APS-C and Micro Four-Thirds respectively (with 1.0 for film SLR's as the reference). Using similar design thinking the ideal for 35mm Mirrorless might need a larger (MF sized) mount. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
colonel Posted September 4, 2015 Share #733 Posted September 4, 2015 The person to ask is Jono, but good luck to get a reply His wife just bought him a Leicaflex , I think that's a sign from heaven Quite The people who really know about Leicas next thing are completely absent from this thread. As it should be .... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevelap Posted September 4, 2015 Share #734 Posted September 4, 2015 I think you'll find that mjh usually knows a thing or two in this regard........ (There can be gentle hints here or there without breaking NDA's) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted September 4, 2015 Share #735 Posted September 4, 2015 Such as knocking impossibilities on the head... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted September 4, 2015 Share #736 Posted September 4, 2015 . It might turn out that no vendor dares to actually go this route and that they will all try to make do with smaller mounts. That’s what Sony has done. Well, the mount cannot be wider than the camera (nor, in reality, the lens...) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
likealot Posted September 4, 2015 Share #737 Posted September 4, 2015 I'd bet... sufficiently long to reach 50 pages of this thread (but not doubling... ) Considering that the speculation thread for the Lego Star Wars sets (in the Eurobricks forum) reaches somewhere in the region of 500 - 600 pages in one year (and that is just the hardcore collectors) 50 pages is not much really. We need more . I suppose building the hype is not really Leica's forte. Even when they have tried (remember the mini M hype that went wrong?) it has backfired on them so they have probably decided to maintain total silence. Wrong decision in my opinion but I suppose it's their choice. I do hope though that they announce the new products before Christmas because it would be a perfect sale boosting opportunity. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
robert blu Posted September 4, 2015 Share #738 Posted September 4, 2015 I like to read this thread because of the mix among technical infos, desires and hopes, alternatives ideas, speculations, design, irony...it's a good way to keep my brain working, thanks you all robert PS: honestly I never was so confused about which new camera to buy, but this is my problem ! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
edwardkaraa Posted September 4, 2015 Share #739 Posted September 4, 2015 Quite The people who really know about Leicas next thing are completely absent from this thread. As it should be .... Well, it is rumored that the new camera is modeled after the film Leicaflex. Jono is suddenly shooting with a film Leicaflex. I love the English subtlety Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjh Posted September 4, 2015 Share #740 Posted September 4, 2015 Leica M was announced in 2012, shipped in 2013. Generally there is no reason to announce a new model many months before it actually becomes available. There were cases where Leica wanted to announce a camera at photokina and thus announced early; this was true for the M (Typ 240) and the S (Typ 007). But there is no photokina in 2015 so if they wanted to introduce a new model in 2016 they could just as well wait for 2016 to announce it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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