menos I M6 Posted June 7, 2015 Share #61 Posted June 7, 2015 Advertisement (gone after registration) Does the 1930s Contax Zeiss have the same look as the modern Zeiss 50mm 1.5 ZM Sonnar? It is the same optical design and this old lens is still in production today 80 years later! Is there any reason to get the older 1930s version? The most immediate difference one can see on the spot is the different coatings on the lens element and of course different glass, used. There are other major differences in it's mechanical construction (especially making the very coveted wartime aluminum lenses so extremely small and lightweight). Personally, if one cannot find an original vintage CZJ Sonnar there are a few good choices to "hold you over" until you find one. The current CV Zeiss 50/1.5 is surely among them as a modern interpretation. Others are the vintage Canon 50/1.5 Sonnar LTM and of course the very epitome of Japanese Zeiss Sonnar interpretations, the famous Nikkor 50/1.5 and later 50/1.4. There are many, many endless threads about this very topic on RFF, which are highly recommended to read up about knowledge on Sonnar designs and Sonnar derivatives. My own Sonnar favorite among many of those is surely the Nikkor 5cm f1.4 with close focus ability (a little bigger and as of its massive brass construction, heavier than the wartime CZJ Sonnar): 5cm f1.4 Nikkor-S.C LTM @ ~ f2: wide open on the M8.2 (wide open these glow quite a bit, stopped down to ~f2 character completely changes with lots of contrast and bold colors - when properly adjusted though these are truly sharp): 5 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted June 7, 2015 Posted June 7, 2015 Hi menos I M6, Take a look here Smallest and Most Versatile Leica M Lenses. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
farnz Posted June 7, 2015 Share #62 Posted June 7, 2015 Does the 1930s Contax Zeiss have the same look as the modern Zeiss 50mm 1.5 ZM Sonnar? It is the same optical design and this old lens is still in production today 80 years later! Is there any reason to get the older 1930s version? I am also fortunate to have the Zeiss 50/1.5 ZM, which has a more modern look in the same way, for example that a 35/2 Summicron asph has a more modern look than the sought-after 7-element 35/2 Summicron version 1. Broadly I think of the difference as gentle versus robust in terms of the steepness of change from soft edges to sharp edges and from bright to dark; some refer to this as microcontrast, which is true but this is an overall concept of how much detail is available in shadows and highlights whereas I'm talking about the degree of graduation (or the rate of change) between shadows and highlights. The modern Zeiss 50/1.5 Sonnar ZM - to my mind - produces a contrastier look than the CZJ owing, as Dirk pointed out, to modern lens coatings that control flare and internal reflections better and to the formulas of glass used. The CZJ is a sharp lens (and I don't wish to define the word "sharp" here or end up in a discussion about accutance and resolution) but the ZM's pictures look sharper (if that's your thing) but also contrastier. I use the ZM as my walkabout lens because it's very compact and offers speed when I need it; I use one of my CZJ's if I'm shooting a retro-style event where fabric colours, and low contrast work better to produce a look that is closer to the time of the event. I suppose I've suggested some reasons for acquiring one of the 1930's versions but of course it's subjective; what I like you might not and vice versa. My advice is to try one and see if you like it because you're unlikely to lose your shirt on it if you decide it's not for you later on. The first from the Zeiss 50/1.5 Sonnaar ZM and the second from the CZJ 50/2 Sonnar. Pete. Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! 9 Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/245580-smallest-and-most-versatile-leica-m-lenses/?do=findComment&comment=2829435'>More sharing options...
Mornnb Posted June 7, 2015 Share #63 Posted June 7, 2015 (edited) The modern Sonnar does appear to have a slightly different layout of elements compared to the original 1932 design. The original design attempted to minimise air to glass surfaces to control flare and minimise contrast loss, in an age before coatings. This is of course not a concern with the modern lens which likely gave them more flexibility. So it looks to be an updated design. Note below: Edited June 7, 2015 by Mornnb 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
menos I M6 Posted June 8, 2015 Share #64 Posted June 8, 2015 Pete, those two samples show perfectly the difference in character between the old and new Sonnar, labelled Zeiss ;-) That pre war Sonnar though is the perfect companion for your classic themed events - just brilliant match! 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
richfx Posted June 10, 2015 Share #65 Posted June 10, 2015 35 Cron v. 4. Amazingly compact and light. It is tiny compared to the 35 Lux ASPH FLE and only one stop slower. I now understand why it is so loved. 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
james.liam Posted June 10, 2015 Share #66 Posted June 10, 2015 Pete, great demonstration of the difference. My personal taste of course, but these lenses don't seem to 'dance' as nicely with modern color sensors than they did with slide, B&W film and do with the Monochroms. Maybe its the subtle CA more apparent of digital color sensors? The way grain & emulsions deal with the quirks of these older lenses? I don't know. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
asiafish Posted June 11, 2015 Share #67 Posted June 11, 2015 (edited) Advertisement (gone after registration) Pete, great demonstration of the difference. My personal taste of course, but these lenses don't seem to 'dance' as nicely with modern color sensors than they did with slide, B&W film and do with the Monochroms. Maybe its the subtle CA more apparent of digital color sensors? The way grain & emulsions deal with the quirks of these older lenses? I don't know. They "dance" beautifully with the M9 sensor. Leica M-E with 1937 (uncoated) Carl Zeiss Jena 5cm f/1.5 Sonnar, wide open. L1000241.jpg by Lawman1967, on Flickr L1000202.jpg by Lawman1967, on Flickr Edited June 11, 2015 by asiafish Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
james.liam Posted June 12, 2015 Share #68 Posted June 12, 2015 (edited) Nice examples but the colors, at least in the first image, are blue-cast on my monitor. I suppose I'm too accustomed to the colors from a modern lens. I still stand by my contention that these early optics were by design intended to convey their images to B&W film and thats what they do best. Not knocking the colors shots but I personally wouldn't reach for these lenses unless destined for my MM. Edited June 12, 2015 by james.liam Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lct Posted June 12, 2015 Share #69 Posted June 12, 2015 Nice examples but the colors, at least in the first image, are blue-cast on my monitor. [...] Just a matter of white balance IMO. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
asiafish Posted June 15, 2015 Share #70 Posted June 15, 2015 Just a matter of white balance IMO. Actually white balance was accurate, it was the light bouncing off walls in the alley. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
tobey bilek Posted June 16, 2015 Share #71 Posted June 16, 2015 50 2.8 collapsible version 2, 90 macro, 28 2.8 ASPH, 35 2.0 asph, 75 APO all in that order Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
tobey bilek Posted June 19, 2015 Share #72 Posted June 19, 2015 2.8/28 Elamrit-M ASPH, 2.8/50 Elamr-M, 4.0/90 Macro-Elmar-M. Great light travel set and not much they can't do, except in low light. ...and of course the 2.0/40 Sumicron Agree fully. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dao De Leitz Posted June 19, 2015 Share #73 Posted June 19, 2015 ... Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Elmarit-M ASPH 2.8/28, Macro-Elmar-M 4.0/90, Summicron-C 2.0/40 - Thorsten Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stein K S Posted June 20, 2015 Share #74 Posted June 20, 2015 Smallest AND most versatile...? My 35 cron IV (since I am a 35 guy...)! However, I do also frequently bring along the 28 Elmarit asp and also the 50 Elmar-M on travels even if I do own the different cron alternatives to these... One comment though, is that I love the silver ones... and while not being bigger, they are all substantially heavier. Maybe not that big a deal on the 35 and the 50, but my "small" 90 Elmarit-M in silver feels often "to much" (heavy) to bring along... Stein Kjetil Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jennifer Posted June 21, 2015 Share #75 Posted June 21, 2015 28mm f/2.8 Elmarit-M, M246. Higher Resolution version Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! As some have said a nice little lens 4 Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! As some have said a nice little lens ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/245580-smallest-and-most-versatile-leica-m-lenses/?do=findComment&comment=2839615'>More sharing options...
uhoh7 Posted June 21, 2015 Share #76 Posted June 21, 2015 (edited) 50 APO is small? Seriously? Some people have the same answer to every question: 50 APO 50 APO LOL V4 cron tabbed would one great small M, but in the more interesting vein of the Sonnars: When My M9 goes out at night, this is often the lens that's on it (forgive A7 in pic) Sonne by unoh7, on Flickr Sonnetar: Under 200 grams 5cm f/1.1 with modern coatings. New about 1065USD new, at the moment. L1032674 by unoh7, on Flickr DSC03927 by unoh7, on Flickr Poodles by unoh7, on Flickr Middle shot is on A7.mod; I also have 1937 CZJ 50/1.5 and the Nikon 5cm 50/1.4 Each magnificent, small, and unique, but with common sonnar DNA. The M9 must have very fast glass to shoot well in the dim, but the usual suspects are all huge. I have and often use the very good CV 35/1.2 and 50/1.1, but yikes they are heavy. The Sonnetar is weaker at the edges but that's rarely an issue in dim social shots. It does have a very unique color signature as great care was used in the selection of glass and coatings. So my Sonnetar raws really stand out and are saturated way beyond the older ones. Horses for courses, and I still shoot the 1937 copy too. Love the examples from that lens above. Edited June 21, 2015 by uhoh7 7 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
leafster Posted June 22, 2015 Share #77 Posted June 22, 2015 Summaron 35mm f/2.8, Elmar-M 50mm f/2.8 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
asiafish Posted June 22, 2015 Share #78 Posted June 22, 2015 28mm f/2.8 Elmarit-M, M246. Higher Resolution version Fence.jpg As some have said a nice little lens My next lens purchase. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jennifer Posted July 2, 2015 Share #79 Posted July 2, 2015 Full Resolution Version Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! 28mm Elmarit-M f/2.8, M246 2 Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! 28mm Elmarit-M f/2.8, M246 ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/245580-smallest-and-most-versatile-leica-m-lenses/?do=findComment&comment=2846483'>More sharing options...
Printmaker Posted July 2, 2015 Share #80 Posted July 2, 2015 Nice Jennifer. I tried this lens on my old M8 years ago. It is tiny and sharp. Also, it is nice to see someone using modern lenses on the Monochrom. I keep going back and forth with older vs newer lenses on the Monochrom. Right now I like the look of the newer lenses most of the time... that is until I process a shot that would have benefited by a bit less edge sharpness. Lately I've been just moving the "clarity" slider into negative numbers to take a little micro contrast off the midtones. It is a simpler solution than bringing both of my 50 Summicrons along. Small lenses: 35 Summicron IV. It is my desert island lens. Too bad that a million tourists visit my desert island every year. Even smaller: 35 CV Skopar. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now