verendus Posted May 13, 2015 Share #1 Posted May 13, 2015 Advertisement (gone after registration) I've been using the M240 since January. Although I've loved all the features of the new camera, I've been really missing the skin tones that M9 produced. I have shot through thousands of images, and I always end up going back to the archive M9 images wanting to reproduce the look in my M240 images. M240 images are truly cleaner and better in terms of dynamic range and high ISO, but the skin tones seemed to be on the hot side with too much orange and red tint no matter what the lighting condition is. WB adjust hasn't helped as it changes the color balance globally. After trying a number of different profiles, custom as well as canned, and spending many hours tweaking HSL and Profile setting, I've settled on a default setting that gives me a very pleasing skin tones and color balance. In fact, I now prefer the color out of this setting better than the color from my old M9 and M8. It does mute red and pink tones a little bit, but I always found the reds of M240 too hot and oversaturated. It's often the first channel to blow. Here are the settings I use as an import default. I wanted to hear feedback from any color experts here. I don't hold a degree in color management, but consider myself pretty well-versed and critical and use color-managed work flow from screen to print. HSL - Saturation Red -9 Orange -20 Split Toning - Highlights Hue 222 Saturation 10 Camera Calibration - Red Primary Hue +10 Saturation -10 This setting will not affect non-red/orange color. Split toning helps with slightly warmer highlights of the M240. Depending on your subject, if reds are the primary subject, you may want to bring Hue and Saturation back to 0. So far this setting has given me a far more pleasing and consistent color out of camera than any other profiles I've used. I'd love to hear everyones feedback on this. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted May 13, 2015 Posted May 13, 2015 Hi verendus, Take a look here Taming the Skin Tones of M240. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
Peter Kilmister Posted May 13, 2015 Share #2 Posted May 13, 2015 I just shoot and then use LR to develop. Maybe I am weird but all this stuff is way above my head. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted May 13, 2015 Share #3 Posted May 13, 2015 Much too complicated, life is too short - I use Dan Margulis' PPW workflow and just hit the skin desaturation button, adjust the layer fill and done. LAB is much more powerful for this type of correction anyway. For importing I use a dual-illuminant camera profile that I made some time ago. And, of course - an IR cut filter. IR light plays havoc with Caucasian skin tones. http://www.moderncolorworkflow.com/blog/ppw-tools-panel-version-4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bocaburger Posted May 13, 2015 Share #4 Posted May 13, 2015 I guess after 40 some years with film I'm used to accepting some compromises, as long as the skin tones aren't blatantly off. I find most of the time the default jpeg setting is fine...colors always look a bit different from one monitor to another, or on the TV, or in a print...otherwise a little tweak in CS2. With the M9 if I shot jpeg I got results I often had to attempt adjusting, and many times could never get it to where I wanted without skewing other colors. So I shot DNG and that worked, but meant I had to go home and develop the shots. With the M240 I typically can download jpgs onto someone's laptop and they're happy and I'm done. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lct Posted May 13, 2015 Share #5 Posted May 13, 2015 Even with IR-cut filters on and in spite of improvements since firmware 2.0.0.11 in 2013, i still find both Leica and LR default renderings too reddish for my tastes so i use C1 in linear mode and adjust with P'shop if need be but i don't shoot jpegs anymore so in-camera settings don't interest me sorry. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
farnz Posted May 13, 2015 Share #6 Posted May 13, 2015 Thanks for sharing this, verendus. Like Jaap I prefer to use LAB colour space for colour workflow (and other things) because it separates the luminance data from the chroma data and offers 4-colour manipulation (RGBY) rather than RGB so altering skin tones can be done without affecting their relative brightness. Pete. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
thrid Posted May 14, 2015 Share #7 Posted May 14, 2015 Advertisement (gone after registration) I noticed the same thing when processing of 240 files in LR. Reds and magenta are quite got and difficult to control. I should note that I have not yet created a profile for my 240. Recently I downloaded the demo for Capture One 8 Pro and was very surprised by what I saw. The temperamental reds, magenta and orange all seemed to fall into place and the toolset allowed easy and very accurate manipulation of skin tones. I also think I am getting better results in Capture One with mixed and artificial light. The problem with Capture One is that the library function is not anywhere as good as LR. I'm still digging in to that aspect of the program, but based in the image quality I'm tempted to switch to Capture One. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lct Posted May 14, 2015 Share #8 Posted May 14, 2015 The C1's M240 profile has some yellow cast though i feel so i prefer developing in linear mode with it. YMMV. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lct Posted May 14, 2015 Share #9 Posted May 14, 2015 The problem with Capture One is that the library function is not anywhere as good as LR. Yes but C1 offers "sessions" as well : http://tinyurl.com/l3pz2lk. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkP Posted May 14, 2015 Share #10 Posted May 14, 2015 Thank you for that Verendus. I'll give it a go. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LocalHero1953 Posted May 14, 2015 Share #11 Posted May 14, 2015 I've found the M240 skin tones better than the M9, with which I had some horrendous blotchy skin and red lips under the wrong lighting. I find a custom dual illuminance profile helps most of the time, though I still have a "Red Skin Reduction" custom Lightroom preset for emergencies: Red Hue +25, Red Luminance +25, occasionally combined with Red Saturation -20. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
indergaard Posted May 14, 2015 Share #12 Posted May 14, 2015 I've been using the M240 since January. Although I've loved all the features of the new camera, I've been really missing the skin tones that M9 produced. I have shot through thousands of images, and I always end up going back to the archive M9 images wanting to reproduce the look in my M240 images. M240 images are truly cleaner and better in terms of dynamic range and high ISO, but the skin tones seemed to be on the hot side with too much orange and red tint no matter what the lighting condition is. WB adjust hasn't helped as it changes the color balance globally. After trying a number of different profiles, custom as well as canned, and spending many hours tweaking HSL and Profile setting, I've settled on a default setting that gives me a very pleasing skin tones and color balance. In fact, I now prefer the color out of this setting better than the color from my old M9 and M8. It does mute red and pink tones a little bit, but I always found the reds of M240 too hot and oversaturated. It's often the first channel to blow. Here are the settings I use as an import default. I wanted to hear feedback from any color experts here. I don't hold a degree in color management, but consider myself pretty well-versed and critical and use color-managed work flow from screen to print. HSL - Saturation Red -9 Orange -20 Split Toning - Highlights Hue 222 Saturation 10 Camera Calibration - Red Primary Hue +10 Saturation -10 This setting will not affect non-red/orange color. Split toning helps with slightly warmer highlights of the M240. Depending on your subject, if reds are the primary subject, you may want to bring Hue and Saturation back to 0. So far this setting has given me a far more pleasing and consistent color out of camera than any other profiles I've used. I'd love to hear everyones feedback on this. Thanks. I'll try it out and let you know a bit later. Personally I use three different profiles for my M240 that I've created with my SpyderCheckr Pro. These profiles also tames the red and magenta issues, but at the expense of overall loss of saturation. C1 Pro is great, but I find it's profiles tend to lean too much on the green/yellow side of things as well. I love the colors of the M240 when there's no people in the shots. If my wife is in one of them I don't like the colors. She has a yellow/reddish skintone as well, so the reds and orange are just completely out of whack with the default profiles. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
algrove Posted May 14, 2015 Share #13 Posted May 14, 2015 I say the M240 was made for the American SW with red/orange sunrises/sunsets and earth to match. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
tenmangu81 Posted May 14, 2015 Share #14 Posted May 14, 2015 Recently I downloaded the demo for Capture One 8 Pro and was very surprised by what I saw. The temperamental reds, magenta and orange all seemed to fall into place and the toolset allowed easy and very accurate manipulation of skin tones. I also think I am getting better results in Capture One with mixed and artificial light. The problem with Capture One is that the library function is not anywhere as good as LR. I'm still digging in to that aspect of the program, but based in the image quality I'm tempted to switch to Capture One. I have had the same experience with C1, and I couldn't pull through with the library. This function doesn't work quite well, contrary to LR. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
indergaard Posted May 14, 2015 Share #15 Posted May 14, 2015 Thanks. These settings actually work quite well. My only question is if you base these settings on using the "Adobe Standard" Profile or if you use the "Embedded" profile in the Camera Calibration panel? I find these settings might desaturate the skin a lot by using the Adobe Standard profile, but with the Embedded profile it looks OK. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
verendus Posted May 14, 2015 Author Share #16 Posted May 14, 2015 Thanks. These settings actually work quite well. My only question is if you base these settings on using the "Adobe Standard" Profile or if you use the "Embedded" profile in the Camera Calibration panel? I find these settings might desaturate the skin a lot by using the Adobe Standard profile, but with the Embedded profile it looks OK. Thanks for the feedback. Yes, I use it with the embedded. Adobe works for really red/orange faces, but I based it off embedded profile. It does desaturated red a little but preserves the rest of color pretty well. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
verendus Posted May 14, 2015 Author Share #17 Posted May 14, 2015 Here are a couple of examples. The top is with the generic LR Adobe Profile straight out of camera. The bottom shot is with the embedded profile using the above settings. Both images with the same white balance and slight boost of clarity, no other adjustment. Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/245002-taming-the-skin-tones-of-m240/?do=findComment&comment=2816254'>More sharing options...
jaapv Posted May 14, 2015 Share #18 Posted May 14, 2015 A bit cool for my taste- but note the word “taste”. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
algrove Posted May 14, 2015 Share #19 Posted May 14, 2015 I agree with Jaap and I just calibrated my 30" screen. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted May 14, 2015 Share #20 Posted May 14, 2015 Looking through a recently calibrated Eizo GC here. Maybe the OP should check his screen calibration. Guess - is he using a Retina screen? I do notice users compensating for the vivid rendering. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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