M9 to M-P sensor trade up question, was given a refurbished one instead

[Hiromsa]

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Sent my Affected sensor thru a local Leica store. Yesterday they called to pick up the "new" M-P. Paid $3750 plus tax. Got home and took a few test shots, and found out it had over 1590 exposures on the camera.

Is that what the trade up program all about?

I was never told during the whole transaction that I would be getting a refurbished camera.

Anybody had the same experience?

Please chime in. Thank you.

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[piblondin]

How do you know it's refurbished? Having the exposure counter at 1.5k does not make it refurbished. These could have been test shots. It if was 15k, I would question it.

[jdlaing]

Sent my Affected sensor thru a local Leica store. Yesterday they called to pick up the "new" M-P. Paid $3750 plus tax. Got home and took a few test shots, and found out it had over 1590 exposures on the camera.

Is that what the trade up program all about?

I was never told during the whole transaction that I would be getting a refurbished camera.

Anybody had the same experience?

Please chime in. Thank you.

 

What SD card did you use in the new camera?

[Hiromsa]

The camera looks otherwise, I used a brand new Sandisk Ultra SD card. The file number shows L100-1654 on the camera. I called B&H and they told me it could be a refurbished unit. I also called Leica Ginza in Tokyo, Japan, and was told by the store manager that it definitely is not brand new.

 

By the way, I used to be member of l-camera-forum 6 years ago, and a proud owner of Leica T and XV, and numerous film and D Lux models. Please be gentle.

[jaapv]

The file number on the card does not indicate the number of exposures, the camera remembers the highest number used. To find the real number of exposures you must look for the unique image ID in EXIF and convert the HEX number.

If, during the QC process, or maybe when showing the camera to a customer in the shop, a card with # L100-1653 was used, the camera will resume numbering at 1654, even if it had the normal number of 100-300 test shots on it.

[Lenshacker]

The file number on the card does not indicate the number of exposures, the camera remembers the highest number used. To find the real number of exposures you must look for the unique image ID in EXIF and convert the HEX number.

If, during the QC process, or maybe when showing the camera to a customer in the shop, a card with # L100-1653 was used, the camera will resume numbering at 1654, even if it had the normal number of 100-300 test shots on it.

 

This is exactly what I did to myself after using a card from the M8 in my (then) brand new M9. All of a sudden the filenames indicated over 10,000 exposures on the camera. I reset it, found instructions "somewhere" on this forum.

[Hiromsa]

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Got a call from a nice manager of the local camera store who spoke to Leica USA. According to Leica, the number does not reflect the actual shutter count. So case closed. Thank you everyone who provided answers and suggestions.

[earleygallery]

Got a call from a nice manager of the local camera store who spoke to Leica USA. According to Leica, the number does not reflect the actual shutter count. So case closed. Thank you everyone who provided answers and suggestions.

 

But you said Leica Tokyo told you it's not a new camera?….

[TonyField]

You need special software to determine the actual count of shutter actuations. This is different than and not related to the DNG file numbers. One programme I use to get the actual shutter release count is M9Info, version 0.61.:

 

It is on this web page: M9Info

[jaapv]

Yes, there is software, but it is not needed. Just open EXIF, read the unique image ID number and convert to decimal.

[Hiromsa]

The last 6 digits of the exif numbers are 099041, I don't know how to convert to decimal. Can you help?

 

By the way, I respect what the Leica USA said, so I decided not pursue any further. Leica Tokyo told me they make the number never go beyond 8.

[250swb]

099041 would make your exposure count over 620,000........

 

It is the number in the Unique Image ID part of the EXIF file, and if there are letters as well as numbers you need those as well. When you have them put them into the 'Hex' side of a free converter such as this

 

Hexadecimal to Decimal Converter

 

and press the button...

 

Typically for a new camera you would expect anything between 50 to 300 (sometimes more) shutter actuations that were done during the build.

 

 

Steve

[wattsy]

Yes, there is software, but it is not needed. Just open EXIF, read the unique image ID number and convert to decimal.

 

The OP is talking about an M-P not M9 derivative. My understanding is that with the M240 you cannot determine the shutter count from the unique image ID or any other means available to end user.

[jaapv]

Sorry, my fault. In that case there is no user way to determine the shutter count; the number written to the card is equally non-indicative.

[250swb]

Sorry, my fault.

 

Hardly, I did a double take on which forum the OP posted in so gave them the benefit of the doubt and thought it was simply a typo. Instead it is an example of the sort of problem encountered by the increasingly ambiguous way Leica name products.

 

Steve

[lanetomlane]

I didn't think there was a user way to determine the number of shutter counts; unlike previous digital M's.

________________

Regards, Tom

[thighslapper]

There isn't ...... or rather if there is, only Leica knows how.

 

There are several threads about this and despite hunting for some logic or pattern in the numbering no-one has come up with an answer (we did try)

 

Some users have reported 'unique image number' duplication..... so whatever algorithm is being used it is not generating 100% unique ID's.

[topoxforddoc]

As the M-P also does video with its CMOS sensor, the shutter count is not really helpful (even if you could find that out), as a video test would take up a large number of shutter counts.

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[wattsy]

As the M-P also does video with its CMOS sensor, the shutter count is not really helpful (even if you could find that out), as a video test would take up a large number of shutter counts.

 

I'm not sure about that. My Nikon DSLR has a CMOS sensor and also does video yet it also has a user determinable number for shutter actuations. Why does a video test take up a large number of shutter counts (doesn't the shutter open at the start of the video and then close when it has finished)?

[250swb]

It isn't Video that causes the anomaly but Live View and/or the advanced metering, both of which require the shutter to open, but not actually make an exposure. It would be absurd to be taking meter readings for them to count as a 'shutter actuation', unlike video in which the shutter opens then closes at the end of the sequence. For each advanced metering and exposure sequence the shutter opens (metering), closes, opens (exposure), closes, then opens again (metering) ready for the next shot. So that's three times the shutter opens, only one of which is to make an exposure. This doesn't occur on cameras without Live View, or CSC's that have the shutter 'open' all the time, and in which case the actual exposure count can be easily tallied. It occurs to me that Leica must have a way to know the actual exposure count, but perhaps this is to complicated to resolve as a number that an EXIF file can recognise.

 

 

Steve