farnz Posted January 2, 2015 Share #121 Posted January 2, 2015 Advertisement (gone after registration) ... But, I do know that, times of having a Leica and no money are better than times of having money and no Leica. Just saying, for the perspective... I think I lifted this from the Freak Brothers or something from reading Zap Comics. Yep, straight from the lips of Freewheelin' Franklin but with a twist. Pete. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted January 2, 2015 Posted January 2, 2015 Hi farnz, Take a look here A very hypothetical "what if?". I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
wlaidlaw Posted January 2, 2015 Share #122 Posted January 2, 2015 If you look at 1940's, 50's or 60's movies and someone is using a camera, there is a good chance it is a Leica. Now if you see someone taking a photo in a movie, with a few exceptions, they are using a phone. Wilson Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
CheshireCat Posted January 2, 2015 Share #123 Posted January 2, 2015 If you look at 1940's, 50's or 60's movies and someone is using a camera, there is a good chance it is a Leica. Now if you see someone taking a photo in a movie, with a few exceptions, they are using a phone. Egg of Columbus: Leica should make a great photo app for Android and iOS. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
colonel Posted January 2, 2015 Share #124 Posted January 2, 2015 If you look at 1940's, 50's or 60's movies and someone is using a camera, there is a good chance it is a Leica. Now if you see someone taking a photo in a movie, with a few exceptions, they are using a phone. Wilson Fun: http://www.shootingfilm.net/2012/12/celebrities-with-their-leica-cameras.html?m=1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
algrove Posted January 2, 2015 Share #125 Posted January 2, 2015 Egg of Columbus: Leica should make a great photo app for Android and iOS. Maybe after they finally get their M software worked out. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
DigitalHeMan Posted January 3, 2015 Share #126 Posted January 3, 2015 Holland is not a poor country and has quite a good electric vehicle infrastructure, yet I only saw one Tesla in the last year, in a charging station next to the one I was using. I would not not draw any conclusions from that. You haven't been to Schiphol recently then - every other taxi there is a Tesla now, there are literally tens of them in the stand at any one time. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted January 3, 2015 Share #127 Posted January 3, 2015 Advertisement (gone after registration) Indeed I haven’t. They are not doing too badly then , selling over 1100 a year. Anyway it proves that any comparison of rangefinders to electric cars is downright silly. That is a rapidly expanding market, rangefinder cameras is hopefully stable at best. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sunil Posted January 3, 2015 Share #128 Posted January 3, 2015 I don't think this is likely to happen any time soon, but what if another company created a digital rangefinder - a true one, not like Fuji's hybrid gimmicks - with the capacity to take M lenses, and priced it significantly lower than the Leica equivalent (currently the M)? Let's also assume that the rival company's electronics knowledge is superior and the camera consequently suffers fewer issues. This is entirely hypothetical, as the RD1 is pretty much history these days, and where I have seen them sold, they are very expensive for what they offer. Hm, not unlike Leica I could see several possible outcomes. a) Leica loses a little business to the new RF and responds by diverting their attention to their other lines, i.e. compacts, etc, trusting that most of their customers will stay loyal. The new company's RF fails to make even a challenge to Leica and are roundly mocked for trying. c) The new company takes some business away from Leica. Leica responds by upping their game. d) The new company takes some business away from Leica. Leica responds by raising their prices and playing the "exclusivity" card. e) None of the above, or some combination thereof. I can't see it happening, as I don't see any other manufacturer taking the financial risk. Nevertheless, you have to wonder if the brass at Leica don't have this at the back of their minds... Just an idle speculation, but would be interesting to hear what the Leica aficionados have to say. The digital RF is a niche market. Expecting a company to create a niche within a niche is unrealistic, especially when it requires a large capital investment. One of the first things I expect any potential competitor would do is look at the TAM (total available market) and they would quickly realize that it just isn't worth it. For better or worse, we're stuck for now with Leica DRFs. However, there will be alternatives to the DRF in a few years, other than the traditional SLR types, that will no doubt eat into Leica's top line and that is likely Leica's biggest worry. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
janki Posted January 3, 2015 Share #129 Posted January 3, 2015 As car vendors go Tesla is a small boutique manufacturer. At over $80,000 per vehicle, not inexpensive either, yet I frequently see them on the road almost every day. Although my tiny city officially is the world's smallest city with its own Porsche retail store, Porsche will obviously never become a regular car. But, in fact we've also have our own Tesla retail store. And, unlike Porsche, Tesla has become quite common, especially in Norwegian cities. During 2014, Tesla with only one model reached a market share of just under 6% of new car sales in Norway. Nissan Leaf sells even more, and BMW i3 is coming like a bullet. But then they cost to put it simply, just a third of a Tesla. At least one of the months in 2014, Tesla was the best-selling car in the country. During a short drive to my local shopping center and back, it is quite common to see a handful of Tesla, and at least twice as many Nissan Leaf. Here is some of the reasons for that; freely quoted from the country's largest newspaper: “In Norway Tesla is sold completely without VAT and other taxes. A Tesla is therefore in a way subsidized with hundred thousand $ US - at least. (Compared with taxes on corresponding American cars with a powerful petrol V8 engine.) And if that's not enough, the owner has: Free fuel, free public parking, free toll, free ferry, almost free annual fee, half company car tax, higher mileage allowance and free access to public transport lanes.” Is thus everything just fine? On You Tube there are of course amounts of film clips about TESLA. Here's a little different one where one sees with “oblique glance” on the challenges with this type of cars. Tesla is in a way the automotive worlds digital camera. (See the whole film clip if you choose to see it.) REGARDS:) PS: During 2014, I observed only one man with a Leica M9, here in my city. I think he was a tourist. During 2013 I Observed one man with a Leica M3. Both of these individuals were younger than what one member here described as the "rangefinder generation". It provides at least a little cause for optimism. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pico Posted January 3, 2015 Share #130 Posted January 3, 2015 I don't know about the stores and inventory and who buys all of these Leicas none of us see in the wild. But, I do know that, times of having a Leica and no money are better than times of having money and no Leica. Just saying, for the perspective... I think I lifted this from the Freak Brothers or something from reading Zap Comics. Rick Zap, the bible! ""Dope will get you through times of no money better than money will get you through times of no dope." Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
skuromis Posted January 3, 2015 Share #131 Posted January 3, 2015 I've seen 2 Leica M this autumn in the park before Yellowstone (sorry, keep on forgetting the name). Owned by apparently rich Chinese. Another one around Lac Leman (lake Geneva), around the neck of a (perhaps) tourist. And the local dealer here keeps on selling his stock (cameras and lenses). Judging from this, yes, Leica is small, not for everyone (my wife still thinks I'm stupid to focus manually when great AF systems exist), but seems to sell in good quantities. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
algrove Posted January 3, 2015 Share #132 Posted January 3, 2015 Another one around Lac Leman (lake Geneva), around the neck of a (perhaps) tourist. /QUOTE] That was me-a tourist. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
semi-ambivalent Posted January 4, 2015 Share #133 Posted January 4, 2015 I use Fuji as they are disposable cams Of course, cameras are just tools, and in a much different light for a working pro than as tools for an amateur or vacationer. But it occurred to me that to describe Fujis as 'disposable' smacks of the sort of financial arrogance usually reserved for Leica owners by their detractors. Not that you are. Really nice shots of some rather boring behavior. Good work. Happy <Please choose from the following>, s-a Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pico Posted January 4, 2015 Share #134 Posted January 4, 2015 [...] it occurred to me that to describe Fujis as 'disposable' smacks of the sort of financial arrogance usually reserved for Leica owners by their detractors. Not that you are. Oh, we can certainly top that. When in affluent company and the SD card fills, pocket it and throw the Leica into the bin. . Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
algrove Posted January 4, 2015 Share #135 Posted January 4, 2015 Oh, we can certainly top that. When in affluent company and the SD card fills, pocket it and throw the Leica into the bin.. Got snow yet? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pico Posted January 4, 2015 Share #136 Posted January 4, 2015 Got snow yet? Oh, yea. We have snow and the temperature is plummeting one degree F an hour. It will be about -13F when I get to bed. Why? Is my attitude showing? . Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaques Posted January 5, 2015 Share #137 Posted January 5, 2015 the digital rangefinder market is an EXPANDING market. Sales have probably steadily increased year by year from virtually nothing around 2006 to whatever Leica's yearly M production is today. I am fairly sure Leica hopes/plans for continued expansion in the sector. Add to that: manufacturing one has never been easier! Costs are down and technologies are/have been evolving rapidly. Leica used to say it was impossible- now they have a range of products. The Monochom is a niche within a niche. I still think it will happen. On this issue (for once) I am an optimist. I think there is a window of opportunity (created by Leica)- for a fast mover to shoot an entrepreneurial cheeky arrow into the fray. They could go to town on it with a special 'pro-photographers' gold-plated edition, and earn a lot of industry kudos amongst the historically camera literate cognoscenti... Might not make an absolute fortune - but could make a tidy bit of extra coin - along with the valuable publicity. A small swag from some new M lenses is in the offing as well (a niche within a niche that ALREADY exists and seemingly flourishes). yeah, yeah, yeah- 'it ain't gonna happen', multiple reasons, stale old arguments, harsh 'economic realities', and 'technical difficulties' etc. Heard it all before. Flat Earthers abound... Meanwhile some brave kid ignores all naysayers, makes one from an old film rangefinder- and raises 6000 UK pounds to develop a tiny niche of his own... Good for him say I! and If it really doesn't EVER happen:- well: I will keep predicting it will as long as I can be bothered!! and if it it ever does, well, I will be the first to come on hear and loudly post my "I !@#$'en TOLD YOU SO!" thread... C'Mon Fuji- you can do it! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted January 5, 2015 Share #138 Posted January 5, 2015 The digital rangefinder market is expanding as new technology takes over, the film rangefinder market is shrinking. The total rangefinder market? Let’s hope it is stable.... The question is not if another brand can do it, the question is does it make sense for any other brand to do so. If somebody were to enter the niche, how many cameras would they expect to sell, and how much would the R&D be(starting from scratch and avoiding patents) to be spread over sales? Those would be extremely expensive cameras... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaques Posted January 5, 2015 Share #139 Posted January 5, 2015 well let's face it: they could be half the price of the M cameras and still be 'extremely expensive'! 3500 USD is no cheap affordable camera for the masses. Lets not even mention lenses... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted January 5, 2015 Share #140 Posted January 5, 2015 Hoi Polloi are not interested in rangefinder cameras. The thing to have is a smartphone. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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