Why I cancelled and then reordered a Leica M240 - and never buying Leica again

[hamey]

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Hello Leonil.

 

Also as an Australian, I wouldn't put up with that nonsence

 

Stick with your Canon 5D -3, the Leica M will never be in the same class.

 

I cancelled my Leica M a while back and went down the Canon route, couldn't be happier.

 

Good Luck.

 

Ken.

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[earleygallery]

Here you go, problem solved. Get in touch with this guy, buy your M's and arrange a swap!

 

http://www.l-camera-forum.com/leica-forum/leica-m-type-240/317296-take-silver-m240-wait-black-one.html#post2607061

[Leonil]

Here you go, problem solved. Get in touch with this guy, buy your M's and arrange a swap!

 

http://www.l-camera-forum.com/leica-forum/leica-m-type-240/317296-take-silver-m240-wait-black-one.html#post2607061

 

I cant - the dealer Foto Riesel still technically has my money - I cant buy anything until next week, and until then, I have begged the other store not to sell his silver until I get my refund.... Hes been waiting patiently for 2 weeks for me.

[jaapv]

Hello Leonil.

 

Also as an Australian, I wouldn't put up with that nonsence

 

Stick with your Canon 5D -3, the Leica M will never be in the same class.

 

I cancelled my Leica M a while back and went down the Canon route, couldn't be happier.

 

Good Luck.

 

Ken.

I particularly like the rangefinder on the Canon

[hamey]

I particularly like the rangefinder on the Canon

 

I particularly love the Auto focus and Image stabilization on the Leica M240.

 

Don't get me wrong, I like the range finder on my M7, it's fun to play with, but for modern technology and value for money you cannot beat Canon equipment.

 

So in the mean time we can play fondle or polish our expensive German masterpeice's, it's a pity my

Canon plastic body doesn't shine to well, but I don't have to worry about it, as long as it works who cares.

[Leonil]

I particularly love the Auto focus and Image stabilization on the Leica M240.

 

Don't get me wrong, I like the range finder on my M7, it's fun to play with, but for modern technology and value for money you cannot beat Canon equipment.

 

So in the mean time we can play fondle or polish our expensive German masterpeice's, it's a pity my

Canon plastic body doesn't shine to well, but I don't have to worry about it, as long as it works who cares.

 

I get what both you and jaapv are trying to say.

 

It will be a long time before I get anything new for my Leica - I have a 28 f/2 Voigtlander Ultron, a 50 summicron (chrome) and misc items waiting at home for the Camera.... so it will be a long time until I get anything related to a Leica...

 

In the mean time, it wont stop me saving for a FF Canon, and a 24-70mm 2.8L to eventually replace my 7D. I will always keep getting things for my Canon gear as its been my workhorse, its paid for itself and for the Leica.

 

But, It doesn't mean I hate Leica, I just cant see myself putting that amount of money up again in the hands of a dealer I had never heard of before. The experience has been far too disappointing - it will be a long time until I decide to start saving for a summilux or a new rangefinder.

 

Having said that, hasn't stopped me looking at ebay for second hand luxes, crons and rits for the future...

[farnz]

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… Stick with your Canon 5D -3, the Leica M will never be in the same class.

 

I cancelled my Leica M a while back and went down the Canon route, couldn't be happier.

…

Shame I can't use my Noctilux with the 5D 3. So, no, the Leica M will never be in the same class. Different horses for different courses.

 

Pete.

[hamey]

Leonil, I have been shooting with Leica equipment since 1973, still have 7 film bodies plus around 9 lenses.

Over the years they have given me a lot of pleasure, however whils't film is still around I will continue to use them.

 

Digital is a differant story, this is the relm of the Japanese they are the masters at it.

When Solms decided to discontinue the R line they give us 3 choices.

One.... was spend over 20,000$ + on the S system.

Two... get yourself a Digital M.

Three....go elsewhere, so I took Solms advice, knocked on Canon's door and they showed me the light.

 

I have been Swithed ON ever since, it's simply bloody good stuff.

 

Ken.

[hamey]

Shame I can't use my Noctilux with the 5D 3. So, no, the Leica M will never be in the same class. Different horses for different courses.

 

Pete.

 

There is NO need to use your very expensive low light lens on a 5D-3, Canon offer you much better

Alternatives simply by a bit of electronic hi-tech wizardry (AF + IS) at a cheaper price as well.

 

Yes you're right, horses for courses, so don't you think it's about time you placed yours out to pasture.

 

Ken.

[CalArts 99]

Leonil, I have been shooting with Leica equipment since 1973, still have 7 film bodies plus around 9 lenses.

Over the years they have given me a lot of pleasure, however whils't film is still around I will continue to use them.

 

Digital is a differant story, this is the relm of the Japanese they are the masters at it.

 

I hate to say it, but this is what happened to me too. I still use Leica for film and their optics are top notch. But after a brief relationship with a buggy M9, I decided that the Japanese are best for electronic photography. And more reliable (at least in my own experience.)

 

To spend 7k USD just to have a rangefinder wasn't worth it for me in the end. Sure, the sensor is good but it's nothing extraordinarily special. And at least with my film Leicas I can 'change sensors' .

 

The only downside is that I can't use my Leica lenses for electronic photography at the moment. But also the reality is that modern lenses of other brand names are becoming equally as good optically. Although Leica does still have the best optics in such a small size, and fully useable across all apertures. I find that's hard to deny.

[farnz]

Shame I can't use my Noctilux with the 5D 3. So, no, the Leica M will never be in the same class. Different horses for different courses.

 

Pete.

 

There is NO need to use your very expensive low light lens on a 5D-3, Canon offer you much better

....

Yes there is for shallow depth of field (and the unique character that the Noctilux offers). And no, Canon can't offer me 'much better' for that. I have a Canon 5DII for my R lenses but since I acquired the M the 5DII hasn't left the house. Not saying it never will again but …

 

Pete.

[jaapv]

I particularly love the Auto focus and Image stabilization on the Leica M240.

 

Don't get me wrong, I like the range finder on my M7, it's fun to play with, but for modern technology and value for money you cannot beat Canon equipment.

 

So in the mean time we can play fondle or polish our expensive German masterpeice's, it's a pity my

Canon plastic body doesn't shine to well, but I don't have to worry about it, as long as it works who cares.

I’m not interested in technology per se. I prefer to focus by hand using a rangefinder system, that way I get the images I want to get. Additionally I want to be able to fit two bodies, six lenses and the rest in a case the size that would hold one DSLR and two lenses. It helps with travel. I don’t find it fun to play with technology. I like taking photographs and what I don’t need I don’t want. Or, at worst, don’t want to use.

 

Image quality of the body is wholly uninteresting any more, it is safe to assume that it is excellent for any camera over 1000$ that you care to pick up.

 

Lenses, there are differences and it is incorrect to say brand A is as good as brand B nowadays.

Even within the brand. The Canon 50/1.8 LTM from Canon runs rings around the current EOS lens of the same specification….

 

So -be happy to use the camera that fits your needs, but do not fall into the Internet trap of loudly proclaiming superiority of your gear. It is superior, for you- but not for others.

 

Or are you one of those foolhardy persons that walks into the Arsenal’s supporter home loudly proclaiming that Chelsea is better?

[Archiver]

While the 5D Mark II produces wonderful images, and was the camera I carried everywhere for 2009-2010, I have hardly touched it for personal photography since getting the M9. Just before Christmas, I picked it up, snapped on the 35L, and took some photos. Gorgeous images. But the large size, the chunky handling, and that massive mirror slap, all reminded me of why I stopped using it for general shooting.

 

Leonil, I hope you get your refund from Foto Riesel soon. If you paid by credit card, why on earth are they making you wait so long to get a refund? 'Fraud' doesn't sound right, assuming that it is going back into the same credit card.

 

The Voigtlander 28/2 and chrome Summicron sound like a great way to get started with your new M! Nothing like a fast 28 and 50 for a two-lens combination.

[MarkP]

Nothing like a fast 28 and 50 for a two-lens combination.

 

+1

[Leonil]

While the 5D Mark II produces wonderful images, and was the camera I carried everywhere for 2009-2010, I have hardly touched it for personal photography since getting the M9. Just before Christmas, I picked it up, snapped on the 35L, and took some photos. Gorgeous images. But the large size, the chunky handling, and that massive mirror slap, all reminded me of why I stopped using it for general shooting.

 

Leonil, I hope you get your refund from Foto Riesel soon. If you paid by credit card, why on earth are they making you wait so long to get a refund? 'Fraud' doesn't sound right, assuming that it is going back into the same credit card.

 

The Voigtlander 28/2 and chrome Summicron sound like a great way to get started with your new M! Nothing like a fast 28 and 50 for a two-lens combination.

 

Thankyou Archiver, I heard about the focus shift in the 28 Voightlander, but meh, I will deal with it and learn (like knowing that to open the back door in a particular way to get it to open, that only you know how.)

 

I hope I get my redund soon - its been more than 1 and a half weeks and they said a number of reasons why I didn't get my refund processed sooner. They changed their story - first it was fraud reasons, the bank wont let it happen, to, the eftpos machine only refunds 500 max, and then a just last Thursday, I called to check, and they said oh we switched banks and we had to find your old eftpos receipt etc so the new bank can do it... blah blah blah....

 

So they said it would take 3-5 business days.... Excuse me, you said that 7 working days ago, I have it in writing too.

 

As for the 35L, its too expensive for my liking - and now that Sigma has upped its game, I decided to get the 35 1.4 prime Art lens. Its gorgeous.

[hoppyman]

How did the thread end up as an opportunity to be negative about Leica?

I thought that it was all about the dispute between Leonil and his ex-dealer?

Despite his dispute there, Leonil has re-ordered his M (Typ 240) from another dealer and Leica Camera Australia are doing their best to support him.

[Leonil]

How did the thread end up as an opportunity to be negative about Leica?

I thought that it was all about the dispute between Leonil and his ex-dealer?

Despite his dispute there, Leonil has re-ordered his M (Typ 240) from another dealer and Leica Camera Australia are doing their best to support him.

 

Well said.

 

Leica has been above and beyond for me. I would expect great service from Canon, Nikon, Olympus, Panasonic and Sony etc, but the Leica GM took 40 mins of his time to chat to me about my issues, and offered me the best possible solution and even suggested I was free to leave my dealer but maintain a "pseudo queue" at my new dealer.

 

The most upsetting bit was, the GM has apologised for a dealer's action. That's not what I wanted, Leica had nothing to apologise for.

 

One thing I did learn from all this is, that doesn't matter how flashy a "boutique" looks, bad service is still bad service... I got my replacement from The New Camera House in Lismore who has no more people in the queue (except for people who wanted black - I wanted silver) and its a store in a country town, on a quiet street, with paint peeling off the walls and the street mall looks like its never seen a renovation in decades - but a talk to the manager, the staff and they way they treated all of its customers while I was there just to look, was absolutely amazing. They didn't know I was the guy ordering the camera they had in the back either.

[CalArts 99]

How did the thread end up as an opportunity to be negative about Leica?

 

My apologies in respect to my post about my own personal experience and personal opinions about electronic Leica (I still very much like using film Leica and their stellar lenses; I have for decades and will continue. And in the future will probably look again at the latest digital M attempt; they do improve with each iteration which is a good thing.)

 

Anyway, I came into the thread midstream and only replied to someone's comment about electronic Leicas (a post by 'Hamey.') However, the OP's thread has "and never buying a Leica again" in its title. And so it's pretty negative sounding already on the surface. One has to read the whole thing to realize it's really about a retailer and not about Leica as a camera. But unfortunately this sort of headline gets into the Google machine and with more 'Leica negativity' for Leica detractors to chew on and spit out. Maybe the thread title should be amended.

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[FlashGordonPhotography]

I'm sorry you're having a hard time getting your camera Leonil. I've spent far, far too much money at FR. Even worked there many many years ago. But between them and Camera Clinic I'll probably be out of Leica in the next few months, if I ever get my other M9 and two lenses back, again. I still have a perfectly working M9 and every time I pick it up I have a bad taste in my mouth. I have lost all enjoyment of using it.

 

Too bad because it's a great system.

 

Gordon

[Archiver]

I'm sorry you're having a hard time getting your camera Leonil. I've spent far, far too much money at FR. Even worked there many many years ago. But between them and Camera Clinic I'll probably be out of Leica in the next few months, if I ever get my other M9 and two lenses back, again. I still have a perfectly working M9 and every time I pick it up I have a bad taste in my mouth. I have lost all enjoyment of using it.

 

Gordon, that's too bad to hear. And just when I was thinking of sending my M9 to Camera Clinic because there's a problem with the rangefinder window coating, too.

 

I do hope that Leonil gets his refund soon! $8000 is not small change by any measure. It seems very odd that Foto Riesel would take so long to refund money that was paid by credit card!