papimuzo Posted March 10, 2014 Share #581 Posted March 10, 2014 Advertisement (gone after registration) :confused:The X-line has no interchangeable lenses… Not yet? As T-line... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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mjh Posted March 10, 2014 Share #582 Posted March 10, 2014 Not yet? As T-line... If it is T then it isn’t X. X are compact cameras; T … we will see. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjh Posted March 10, 2014 Share #583 Posted March 10, 2014 The X line has no M adapter and the T line won't need one to exist either. As far as the X line is concerned, I think no one had the guts to saw off the lens to attach an adapter. On the other hand, for every mirrorless system with a flange distance allowing an M adapter to be fitted there is an M adapter available – usually from third parties but sometimes even from the camera vendor. It would be seriously odd if Leica would introduce a mirrorless system and not offer an M adapter, provided that was technically possible. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Ash Posted March 10, 2014 Share #584 Posted March 10, 2014 .... provided that was technically possible. That is my point. I do not see the necessity that Leica limit all its designs to the requirement to ensure usability for M lenses. Steve Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lct Posted March 10, 2014 Share #585 Posted March 10, 2014 They would lose at least one client then. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlanG Posted March 10, 2014 Share #586 Posted March 10, 2014 On the other hand, for every mirrorless system with a flange distance allowing an M adapter to be fitted there is an M adapter available – usually from third parties but sometimes even from the camera vendor. It would be seriously odd if Leica would introduce a mirrorless system and not offer an M adapter, provided that was technically possible. Yeah I think it should be obvious to anyone paying attention that this is the way they'd go. On the other hand there is no reason why future M cameras couldn't have some kind of electronic linkage incorporated into the M mount so that additional features could be added to that system. As for whatever new system Leica has up its sleeve... I'm trying to think of anything special they could bring out that would have any significant impact on the camera market or photography world. (Other than providing some additional revenue for Leica. Which is OK of course.) After all Phase One and Hassy have MF CMOS sensor cameras now, Sony has the A7 and RX1 for small full frame, Panasonic, Fuji, Olympus, Sony and others have the APS and M4/3rds mirrorless markets covered, and Canon and Nikon are kings of FF and APS DSLRs. GoPro dominates the low end action camera market. Good lenses are being made by a number of companies. Cell phones are replacing basic p&s cameras. What's left and how is Leica in any position to innovate since they have to buy electronics from other parties? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjh Posted March 10, 2014 Share #587 Posted March 10, 2014 Advertisement (gone after registration) That is my point. I do not see the necessity that Leica limit all its designs to the requirement to ensure usability for M lenses. My point is that the adaptability of M lenses, even when it was never a design goal, is something you usually get for free with mirrorless system cameras. The engineers would have to go out of their way to prevent it and for Leica that would be quite perverse. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjh Posted March 10, 2014 Share #588 Posted March 10, 2014 On the other hand there is no reason why future M cameras couldn't have some kind of electronic linkage incorporated into the M mount so that additional features could be added to that system. Sure, if they thought it made sense to turn the M system into something else, like an AF EVIL system, for example. Chances are they have considered it. But will they go that route? I don’t think so. What's left and how is Leica in any position to innovate since they have to buy electronics from other parties? Most vendors are buying electronics from other parties, even Panasonic who usually take pride in sourcing everything within the company. Anyway, Leica has got some ideas what avenues to pursue. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlanG Posted March 10, 2014 Share #589 Posted March 10, 2014 Most vendors are buying electronics from other parties, even Panasonic who usually take pride in sourcing everything within the company. Anyway, Leica has got some ideas what avenues to pursue. I am sure they have a plan. I just can't see how it could be very innovative based on using readily available electronics. E.g without a significantly better sensor, EVF, or image processor, what kind of design or packaging can they do that will be so much better than what the other manufacturers can do? Do they have any exclusive access to certain technology? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lct Posted March 10, 2014 Share #590 Posted March 10, 2014 A better compatibility with M lenses would be enough for me but one or two small AF zooms of high end quality could be interesting as well. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
IkarusJohn Posted March 10, 2014 Share #591 Posted March 10, 2014 On the other hand there is no reason why future M cameras couldn't have some kind of electronic linkage incorporated into the M mount so that additional features could be added to that system. Thanks for that. What's left and how is Leica in any position to innovate since they have to buy electronics from other parties? This is the interesting question. It just seems to be a shame that such questions don't seem to interest Leica at the moment. This is the company which came out with the 35mm camera, and was then near the lead in perfecting future developments - interchangeable lenses, rangefinder coupling, autofocus (abandoned), the full frame digital rangefinder, the S camera and the Monochrom. It would be great if they could find some new twist which allowed them to expand into a new market sector. As others have said many times here, Leica joining an already crowded market and trying to compete with the electronics companies is unlikely to result in much more than an overpriced "Meh!" camera. Take the X2 and X-Vario; people here who use them can't stop singing their praises, but how many people in that market sector will look for, let alone recognise, those camera's charms? They'll see the red dot and the price; and that will either turn them off or make it a must have camera. Why buy an ordinary APS-C made by Fuji, Sony or one of the other manufacturers which everyone else has when you can pay far more and have a red dot! Sadly, that seems to be the market sector Leica has targeted for its future. Cheers John Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
earleygallery Posted March 10, 2014 Share #592 Posted March 10, 2014 Leica are clearly going for that type of customer. They don't want the same as everyone else, they want something more 'designer' and exclusive. I don't think technical specification really comes into it, as they're trusting the badge and price tag to mean that it's 'better'. The lens/es may well be, but the basic camera won't be any better than most of the competition (if it's an X Vario clone). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick Posted March 11, 2014 Share #593 Posted March 11, 2014 Leica are clearly going for that type of customer. I agree, but I do hope "that type of customer" is someone like us, that appreciates fine optics and the simplicity of operation reminiscent of past Leica workhorses. Personally, I am not interested in competing electronic gadgetry, not in the least. My interest in cameras and photography lie elsewhere. My hope for Leica, produce cameras for photographers not techno-geeks. We have plenty of consumer electronics companies... none of which had the balls to make a Monochrom. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick_S Posted March 11, 2014 Share #594 Posted March 11, 2014 That is my point. I do not see the necessity that Leica limit all its designs to the requirement to ensure usability for M lenses. I tend to agree, who really cares today about compatibility with M lenses in an APS-C camera? Surely for its niche, all it needs is perhaps 3 or 4 nice small AF lenses optimised for the system. On the other hand, if Leica had bothered to implement the design as a full-frame mirrorless camera, with micro-lenses, then that would have been a worthwhile goal -- surpassing the Sony A7 and similar forthcoming cameras by allowing some superb low distortion ultra-wide angle lenses,both new designs or M-mount lenses. Nick Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lct Posted March 11, 2014 Share #595 Posted March 11, 2014 ...who really cares today about compatibility with M lenses in an APS-C camera?... R-D1 owners, M8 users missing an EVF, M and R users put off by the price of the M240, DMR users needing a smaller body, photogs regretting the demise of the Ricoh GXR, and yours truly. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted March 11, 2014 Share #596 Posted March 11, 2014 Users wanting a good backup camera too. And, most importantly, new customers working their way up in the Leica offerings. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bill Posted March 11, 2014 Share #597 Posted March 11, 2014 ...and old customers seeking a better, more compact, more reliable platform for their glass... Sent from another Galaxy Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuny Posted March 11, 2014 Share #598 Posted March 11, 2014 Alan G - Maybe one of the things Leica has in store for us, while using other manufacturer's parts, is enough different to warrant our attention even beyond the red dot. Remember the D2? It's still highly regarded while virtually all of its contemoraries have dropped in resale value to paper weight status. Let's hope. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
earleygallery Posted March 11, 2014 Share #599 Posted March 11, 2014 I agree, but I do hope "that type of customer" is someone like us, that appreciates fine optics and the simplicity of operation reminiscent of past Leica workhorses. We are already customers though. Leica are trying to sell to more people and (I think) aiming straight at the 'luxury' market with their new products. Those customers may have heard of Leica but certainly won't have used one before. We are not the people Leica have in mind for their new model. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
stunsworth Posted March 11, 2014 Share #600 Posted March 11, 2014 Excuse me for not reading all the thread, but it's going to be an 'X' type camera with interchangeable lenses and an EVF isn't it? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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