The Sony A7 thread [Merged]

[stevelap]

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Hi Steve, thanks for your feedback. After an exchange of emails with LCE at Reading, i decided not to go, even though it is not too far from me. The reason being that primarily, they did not have the A7r or the zeiss lenses that i was interested in and finally, i did not manage to get the adapter that i wanted in time so would have been unable to test out for myself my leica lenses. Most of the 'issues' with non native lenses appear to be related to the use of wide angles. Thankfully, the results i have seen from the 50lux look great and i although i have not found any as yet with the 75cron, i am hoping they will also be equally as good. If i cannot use my 28cron then so be it, the 35 zeiss FE looks fabulous

 

I guess if you have an M8,9,240 and you look at any other camera, there is bound to be a bit of disappointment in comparative build quality and feel. But for me, the autofocus and a good zeiss lense in a small FF package is the primary attraction and as a bonus, you can use 'some' leica glass too.

 

Presumably, you were not so disappointed that you cancelled your order?

 

Actually I don't have one on order yet, but the mild hands-on disappointment won't necessarily stop me getting one if I decide to go down that route.........I'm sure the A7/A7R will be fine cameras, particularly with their Zeiss FE lenses, and, let's face it, they have no FF mirror-less competition at anywhere near their price point at the moment.

 

I'm not primarily looking for a camera that can take M lenses though, rather I'm looking for a smaller, lighter DSLR alternative and I don't mind taking my time over it (or could it be that I'm just indecisive ).

 

I had an EM-1 on pre-order with every intention of taking it, but when Sony announced the A7 twins I put that on hold in order to check out FF mirror-less (I wonder how many times that happened to Olympus). Nikon have also thrown the Df into the mix for me, as the smallest (but not by much) FF DSLR with an optical viewfinder (apples and oranges, I know) but I can't get to see that until the 28th. After that it will be decision time.

[dwbell]

So many opportunities to disagree!

 

I find my M so much better to use than my M9 in every way.

 

Well, it's opinions that make a market isn't it?

 

Not on this though - I have the M240 and it is everything the M9 should have been. Except it is a little heavier, and a little bigger 'in hand'. I can't shoot with the M9P now Im used to the M240 - Hence it's sale.

[}{B]

For UK forum members interested in the A7 and living in the north west I believe that Wilkinson cameras are holding a special event for the A7 at their Liverpool store on Friday the 22nd November. Anyone interested could give them a ring to confirm the time and what it will involve.

 

Liverpool Camera Store | Cameras Liverpool - Wilkinson

[jedi996sps]

I'm not primarily looking for a camera that can take M lenses though, rather I'm looking for a smaller, lighter DSLR alternative and I don't mind taking my time over it (or could it be that I'm just indecisive ).

.

 

Small and light like you is what i am after. It also has to be FF and if i can use my M lenses thats good, but also not an absolute. I cannot help to be a little saddened that although i was all set to have an M240, at least a years wait into a limited product life cycle is not something that i wish to live with. So the decision for the A7r was and is quite simple for me.

 

Not sure i 'get' the Df

[stevelap]

.....Not sure i 'get' the Df

 

You're not alone, not many people do it seems .

 

It's a Nikon thing I suppose.........over the years its been Olympus/Nikon/Leica for me.

 

I know it's irrational but I prefer to see those more traditional names on the front of my cameras, rather than Panasonic and Sony etc. I'm no stranger to high tech and I know of Sony's proud background in broadcast video and camcorders, plus the Minolta connection of course, but I stillI think of them as a consumer electronics company rather than a camera company .

 

Perhaps it's time to put old prejudices behind me by embracing the A7.......

[dwbell]

You're not alone, not many people do it seems .

 

It's a Nikon thing I suppose.........over the years its been Olympus/Nikon/Leica for me.

 

I know it's irrational but I prefer to see those more traditional names on the front of my cameras, rather than Panasonic and Sony etc. I'm no stranger to high tech and I know of Sony's proud background in broadcast video and camcorders, plus the Minolta connection of course, but I stillI think of them as a consumer electronics company rather than a camera company .

 

Perhaps it's time to put old prejudices behind me by embracing the A7.......

 

Atari, Nintendo, Jaguar, Amstrad ...........

 

tick tick tick

 

........ Sony, Microsoft.

 

Games industry. Didn't see it coming either.

[graeme_clarke]

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My particular interest will be to use R lenses with a good adapter on and A7R. That, in turn, begs two questions for me:

 

first, obtaining a good adapter because some of the lenses are heavy (280 f4, 180 f2.8, 28-90) - Novoflex, Metabones, Fotodiox, or from SRB in Luton UK - so any thoughts will be most welcome;

 

secondly, many of the comments above centre on using M lenses especially wide angles - but I wonder how the 21-35 R lens will work as the rear element to sensor distance is much greater than with an M21 or WATE. And, importantly, how will the body be with the longer focal length R lenses???

 

Has anyone so far got experience of using R glass on the body...

 

Best wishes,

 

Graeme

[algrove]

I'm not really prepared to sell the M9p for the A7r, I'd rather back the A7r and get the M240 or keep the M9p and A7r. As long as I can stand the depreciation on the M9p it's still a fantastic body at base ISO, and it's a rangefinder and compatibility with legacy glass is assured.

 

I see the A7r as a great body for low light, low weight applications and with longer lens lengths, macro etc. where the rangefinder is not so great. If you throw in an FE lens then you have autofocus for the times when you need it.

 

Of course it always depends on what the money means to you and selling the M9p might be important.

 

I will try one FE lens, the 24-70. As I have an RX-1 that will suffice for now.

 

However, no one seems to discuss using the sharp series of Contax G AF lenses. Like Ken Rockwell or not, at least he covers a very extensive number of products including the Contax G series. If my WA M lenses do not suffice, I have my Zeiss 28/2.8 and 21/2.8 to try on the a7r, not to mention the uber sharp 45/2.0.

[stevelap]

Atari, Nintendo, Jaguar, Amstrad ...........

 

tick tick tick

 

........ Sony, Microsoft.

 

Games industry. Didn't see it coming either.

 

That's true enough.

 

I don't see Canon or Nikon succumbing though, I think they will - eventually - respond, but others might not be so lucky. I expect Leica to continue too, as a small company with expensive and niche products, although they will almost certainly need something between the X Vario and M with which to face the brave new mirror-less world.

[dwbell]

That's true enough.

 

I don't see Canon or Nikon succumbing though, I think they will - eventually - respond, but others might not be so lucky. I expect Leica to continue too, as a small company with expensive and niche products, although they will almost certainly need something between the X Vario and M with which to face the brave new mirror-less world.

 

I have confidence that both Nikon and canon can react to the EVF and mirror less surge. It would cost less to invest in it than to play catch up and I'm sure that's what they're doing.

 

Leica? Not sure. Tough one. Being 'them' is what differentiates them at the moment. All the failings of the M240 can be dismissed with the uniqueness of the RF etc. If they try to compete directly with Sony, Nikon and canon, then we end up comparing the X Vario and the like with some extremely capable other brand models. Then you take into account the development speed, ability and funding required and it starts to look a bit difficult for Leica. But that's just my conjecture.

[algrove]

My particular interest will be to use R lenses with a good adapter on and A7R. That, in turn, begs two questions for me:

 

first, obtaining a good adapter because some of the lenses are heavy (280 f4, 180 f2.8, 28-90) - Novoflex, Metabones, Fotodiox, or from SRB in Luton UK - so any thoughts will be most welcome;

 

secondly, many of the comments above centre on using M lenses especially wide angles - but I wonder how the 21-35 R lens will work as the rear element to sensor distance is much greater than with an M21 or WATE. And, importantly, how will the body be with the longer focal length R lenses???

 

Has anyone so far got experience of using R glass on the body...

 

Best wishes,

 

Graeme

 

Not yet, but you and I are on the same page. I recently picked up the Metabones R-E mount adapter. It is quite heavy I must say, but what impressed me for the $99 was that it includes a very nice tripod mount that is already shaped for QR use. It looks removable should one want to do that.

 

I plan on trying every lens you mention including the 21-35 (which is on my M240 at this moment). If M wides do not work at least we have R lenses, unlike some. Either way one needs an adapter, but the R Metabones adapter is way more meaty than the M-E mount adapter they make and sell here for $89.

[naturephoto1]

Not yet, but you and I are on the same page. I recently picked up the Metabones R-E mount adapter. It is quite heavy I must say, but what impressed me for the $99 was that it includes a very nice tripod mount that is already shaped for QR use. It looks removable should one want to do that.

 

I plan on trying every lens you mention including the 21-35 (which is on my M240 at this moment). If M wides do not work at least we have R lenses, unlike some. Either way one needs an adapter, but the R Metabones adapter is way more meaty than the M-E mount adapter they make and sell here for $89.

 

Lou,

 

As to the Metabones adapter with the tripod mount, that is fine for using the camera in the horizontal orientation for larger and heavier lenses lacking a tripod collar. However, it is not so good for using those lenses in the vertical orientation on a tripod. You would have to orient the tripod head now for vertical orientation which would dramatically change the composition.

 

That is part of the beauty to the more expensive Novoflex Leica R to NEX adapter. Novoflex offers a rotating collar that fits the NEX adapters allowing the assembly to rotate for both horizontal or vertical orientation:

 

Novoflex ASTAT-NEX Tripod Collar for Sony NEX Lens ASTAT-NEX B&H

 

As to the 21mm- 35mm R WA lenses they will probably be fine on the A7/A7r. The question though is the resolution as you move away from the center and the curvature of field. This is part of my reason for looking for M mount WA RF lenses as an alternative.

 

Graeme,

 

As to the longer R lenses, we discussed that to some degree on Fredmiranda.com and the Suede who is quite knowledgeable indicated that he would expect no problems even when using the 1.4X and 2X Apo Extenders. The exception might be the 560mm f6.8 (and possibly the 400mm f6.8?) Telyt lenses where he thought that we may experience a small amount of vignetting of perhaps 1 to maybe 3mm of the frame.

 

Rich

[jedi996sps]

My particular interest will be to use R lenses with a good adapter on and A7R. That, in turn, begs two questions for me:

 

first, obtaining a good adapter because some of the lenses are heavy (280 f4, 180 f2.8, 28-90) - Novoflex, Metabones, Fotodiox, or from SRB in Luton UK - so any thoughts will be most welcome;

 

Hi Graeme,

I have been looking at the Voigtlander adapter, which is currently on sale here in the UK as is it being replaced by a new model, which allows for closer focusing for M lenses. Have not heard of SRB so will have a look at them also

[jedi996sps]

That's true enough.

 

I don't see Canon or Nikon succumbing though, I think they will - eventually - respond, but others might not be so lucky. I expect Leica to continue too, as a small company with expensive and niche products, although they will almost certainly need something between the X Vario and M with which to face the brave new mirror-less world.

 

I mustn't laugh.... what, you mean like their tee shirts ... am leaving now

[CheshireCat]

This exercise also taught me that my canon 200L prime also has some magenta cast in the corners, never looked for it before I was a Leica owner!

 

There are two 200L Canon primes.

The 200L f/2.8 is a nice cheap prime, but cannot compete with modern (and far more expensive) designs.

[dwbell]

It's the f/2, I was up at f/22 with Elinchrom packs, odd.

[johnwolf]

I have confidence that both Nikon and canon can react to the EVF and mirror less surge. It would cost less to invest in it than to play catch up and I'm sure that's what they're doing....

 

They seem committed to mirrored cameras and perhaps they don't see the case for playing "catch up" - Mirrorless and DSLR camera sales have decreased, CIPA says | Camyx.

 

Mirrorless seems to grab all the headlines, but I rarely see them on the street, where it's all camera phones and low-end DSLRs.

 

John

[IkarusJohn]

Looking at the A7r last night I thought there is no way Leica would make this camera. I don't think they could tame the edges of the 36mp sensor for legacy lenses either and I wouldn't be surprised if they already know that. On the other hand I think Sony will have an incredible success with this camera selling to people who can't or won't pay Leica prices.

 

I'm not so sure.

 

The 36 MP sensor is a bit of a pissing competition. 24 MP is plenty for handheld photography. Where Leica has an edge, and it seems to be Sony's Achilles heal, is in:

 

(a) taming the corners and edges of the short register distance with the 24 MP sensor, particularly with wides

 

( the quality of its lenses

 

The two hardest things for a compact, full frame camera, Leica has sorted. All it needs to do is to produce the smaller camera (without the rangefinder) and improving the electronics (something long overdue), with its existing sensor and mount.

 

Instead, hold onto your hats for ... the Hermes M(240), and the a la carte version to follow.

 

A large part of this forum has been asking Leica for what Sony has achieved for quite some time now. Granted, the Sonys will have compromises, but they deserve to succeed for listening, if nothing more.

 

Cheers

John

 

 

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

[CaptZoom]

I'm not so sure.

 

The 36 MP sensor is a bit of a pissing competition. 24 MP is plenty for handheld photography. Where Leica has an edge, and it seems to be Sony's Achilles heal, is in:

 

(a) taming the corners and edges of the short register distance with the 24 MP sensor, particularly with wides

 

( the quality of its lenses

 

The two hardest things for a compact, full frame camera, Leica has sorted. All it needs to do is to produce the smaller camera (without the rangefinder) and improving the electronics (something long overdue), with its existing sensor and mount.

 

Instead, hold onto your hats for ... the Hermes M(240), and the a la carte version to follow.

 

A large part of this forum has been asking Leica for what Sony has achieved for quite some time now. Granted, the Sonys will have compromises, but they deserve to succeed for listening, if nothing more.

 

Cheers

John

 

 

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

 

We're in general agreement.

I would add that Leica has the edge in taming and edges for their own lenses (and we shouldn't expect otherwise). It remains to be seen if Sony along with Zeiss can do the same with their native lenses built for the new FF mirrorless cameras.

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Hallo,

Look here: Interesting Leica gear

[Stealth3kpl]

Ermm, I'm sorry to tell you guys, the P-A-R-T-A-Y is O-V-E-R!

Craig Shipp's decision is in. You've been waiting for it, I've been waiting for it,

 

 

So, you can all go home. Good night.

Pete