Name this car....

[pippy]

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18 minutes ago, stuny said:

How about a car from the UK?

Yes, Stuart, it is from these shores!

Another crop;

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Philip.

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[IkarusJohn]

UK, 1950s, coupé, short overhang at the front, long(ish) bonnet … I was expecting the vent to be on the front “fender” (as the Americans call it).  It isn’t.  So … where is it?

I can’t name a marque, as I’m not that familiar with UK brands of that period.  A Humber?

PS - There was an Alvis from the 1960’s with a vent like that, but it didn’t have the side strip of chrome.

Edited December 28, 2022 by IkarusJohn

[a.j.z]

Bristol (although I could not find the vent)?

[wlaidlaw]

3 hours ago, a.j.z said:

Bristol (although I could not find the vent)?

I too was thinking of a 405 but as you say, no side vent. Ditto Gordon Keeble, Peerless, Warwick, Jensen and others. 

Wilson

[pippy]

Well; you are all thinking along the correct lines and it is a Bristol of some sort although considerably later than the 405.

Here are two final crops which will clear the matter up - both of which show the slightly unexpected position of the wing-vent...

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[a.j.z]

Bristol 411 (Mk I), ca 1970?

[pippy]

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Absolutely spot-on, Andreas, on all counts. She is a Bristol 411 Mk.1 from 1970.

View of the whole thing;

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Thanks to everyone for playing along. I trust you will appreciate why my internal Robin Goodfellow enjoyed playing-out the 'wing-vent' sleight-of-hand?!...

Over to you, Andreas, for the next conundrum.

Philip.

Edited December 29, 2022 by pippy

[IkarusJohn]

I’ve never got the whole Bristol thing - not wanting to offend anyone’s sensibilities, but they look very old-manish.  I get they have big engines and are finished like a gentlemen’s club inside, but when you compare to other cars of the era and earlier, and today, they just don’t have the visual appeal.

[a.j.z]

This was a good one, Philip!

Any idea, if this vent has a purpose?

Here is the next one:

 

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[wlaidlaw]

6 hours ago, IkarusJohn said:

I’ve never got the whole Bristol thing - not wanting to offend anyone’s sensibilities, but they look very old-manish.  I get they have big engines and are finished like a gentlemen’s club inside, but when you compare to other cars of the era and earlier, and today, they just don’t have the visual appeal.

When I set up my own company in the late 1990's, I no longer got a company car from my employer. The three partners who were setting up the company talked to our accountant and he said the most tax efficient way was to pay ourselves a car allowance but buy a car more than 10 years old, which reduced the benefit in kind tax. I was looking at getting a Bristol. When I mentioned this to a friend, he said: "Oh the man who looks after my Formula Junior historic racer, has someone working in the same premises who mends Bristols. Why don't you talk to him." 

I did and his opinion on Bristols was not repeatable on this forum. He said that the electrics were not so much designed as thrown on as an afterthought and that the components were just not matched to each other. He advised me to avoid them like the plague. I bought an 1989 635M BMW instead. 

Wilson

Edited December 29, 2022 by wlaidlaw

[pippy]

1 hour ago, a.j.z said:

This was a good one, Philip!

Any idea, if this vent has a purpose?

Here is the next one:

 

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As I owned one of these (although non flared-arch!) for 16 years I think it only fair that I take a back seat for this puzzle. I will, however, be intrigued to discover whether this is one of the factory-built examples...

Good luck trying to disguise the car, Andreas!

As far as the vent for the Bristol is concerned? No idea whatsoever!

Philip.

Edited December 29, 2022 by pippy

[Graham (G4FUJ)]

7 hours ago, IkarusJohn said:

I’ve never got the whole Bristol thing - not wanting to offend anyone’s sensibilities, but they look very old-manish. 

Understated luxury I think.

1 hour ago, wlaidlaw said:

I bought an 1989 635M BMW instead. 

Wilson

Sensible move!  I fancied one during my time with what had been a top of the range BMW - the 528 (a 1976) though it was already 6+ years old when I bought it).

[wlaidlaw]

36 minutes ago, Graham (G4FUJ) said:

Sensible move!  I fancied one during my time with what had been a top of the range BMW - the 528 (a 1976) though it was already 6+ years old when I bought it).

Graham,

The problem with all the 1980's and early 90's BMW's made at the Dingolfing Plant (ex Glas and Gogomobil), was that rustproofing was still at 1960's Glas levels and and not at the levels that BMW applied at that time in their main plants. My M635  was an unusual one, modified when new at BMW for the first owner, a Glasgow tobacco importer, who had lost a leg as a young man in the army. It was one of only 2 or 3 examples of a factory automatic M635. It used the 4 speed ZF automatic as used on 750 saloons but with modified change points. Apart from the rust at the top of the front wings and on the sills, the automatic M625 was also a bit lacking in the braking department and it would have been better if BMW had upgraded the brakes to those used on the competition versions of the M635, when changing to the automatic gearbox.

I sold it because of the rust and bought a BMW E34 3.8L 6 speed M5 Nurburgring Edition, which was a very brutal car and really needed a traction control. When the Nurburgring semi active oleo-pneumatic suspension struts started to leak and no spares were available, I sent the car to Birds who converted the suspension to Hartge conventional springs and hydraulic shock absorbers and removed all the hydrostatic oil plumbing and the large and noisy oil pumps under the back seat.  These modifications improved the car a fair bit but it was still a dangerous car. It had two position cam variators which changed at 4000 RPM. If you were joining a wet greasy motorway and you hit the cam change rev point, without moving the accelerator, you suddenly got a 20-25% uplift in power, which could be enough to break traction on both back wheels due to the very tight limited slip differential and suddenly you were going sideways rather than forwards. This caught me out on a couple of occasions and was pretty heart stopping. I swapped the E34 M5 with a director of the specialist local BMW garage who looked after it, for his Alpina E39 B10-V8S, which was a far nicer car but had left hand drive, which he hated. As I was in the middle of buying a house in France, it suited me perfectly. 

Wilson

Edited December 29, 2022 by wlaidlaw

[Ivan Goriup]

6 hours ago, a.j.z said:

This was a good one, Philip!

Any idea, if this vent has a purpose?

Here is the next one:

 

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That looks a lot like a Porsche 914-6 GT  - impossible to tell from the crop whether it's one of the 3000+ factory cars, or one of the multitude of 'standard' 914s that have been been made to look like the 911-engined model, with many of them also having been upgraded with various versions of the 911 six-cylinder drivetrain.

JZG

[pippy]

1 hour ago, Ivan Goriup said:

That looks a lot like a Porsche 914-6 GT  - impossible to tell from the crop whether it's one of the 3000+ factory cars, or one of the multitude of 'standard' 914s that have been been made to look like the 911-engined model, with many of them also having been upgraded with various versions of the 911 six-cylinder drivetrain.

JZG

Actually, John, the number of genuine 914-6 GT cars is very small. Bear in mind that there were only 3381 examples of the 'base' 914-6 produced in total in the first place.

Porsche only manufactured 12 'Works' 914-6 GT cars but they did build more to special-order for customer teams. It is, of course, possible to convert any 914 to -6 GT spec. In 1971/72 it was also possible to order, from the factory, a base 914-6 with the M471 Option Package whose main visual change was the fitment of the 'GT' wheel-arches.

FWIW the car pictured isn't one of the earliest 914-6 as these had the seam between front wing and screen apron filled and smoothed before painting.

Looking forward to seeing the whole thing - and reading any story which might accompany the pic!

Philip.

[a.j.z]

vor 1 Stunde schrieb Ivan Goriup:

That looks a lot like a Porsche 914-6 GT  - impossible to tell from the crop whether it's one of the 3000+ factory cars, or one of the multitude of 'standard' 914s that have been been made to look like the 911-engined model, with many of them also having been upgraded with various versions of the 911 six-cylinder drivetrain.

JZG

Correct! This was to be expected.

You turn!

I have no further information on whether it is original or modified and as John says this is difficult to tell from the outside.

 

 

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[a.j.z]

John, what happened to your original account?

[NigelG]

17 hours ago, IkarusJohn said:

I’ve never got the whole Bristol thing - not wanting to offend anyone’s sensibilities, but they look very old-manish.  I get they have big engines and are finished like a gentlemen’s club inside, but when you compare to other cars of the era and earlier, and today, they just don’t have the visual appeal.

Late to the thread (Happy Christmas to all!).

As a Bristolian you’ve nailed their idiosyncratic appeal. The 411 mk 1 or 2 is my next buy. 

I have the last 408v1 (no 73 of 73 built (in over 2 years production!)) from 1965 and I love it’s not-quite-glamorous-enough looks and it’s “hmm-not-quite-sure-what-that-is?” non-Aston/Alvis/Jag pedigree . It’s a lovely ‘mongrel’ of a traditional steel ladder chassis, massive 5.3L Chrysler Canada V8 autobox drivetrain and a hand-built full aluminium body that is decidedly framed in the pre-war coachbuilding tradition.

Not for everyone obviously - but since the total production of the company over its 70 year life was just over half the number of Porsches that were made in a week in 2021 (!) it should maybe get a bit of leeway?

[wlaidlaw]

35 minutes ago, NigelG said:

Late to the thread (Happy Christmas to all!).

As a Bristolian you’ve nailed their idiosyncratic appeal. The 411 mk 1 or 2 is my next buy. 

I have the last 408v1 (no 73 of 73 built (in over 2 years production!)) from 1965 and I love it’s not-quite-glamorous-enough looks and it’s “hmm-not-quite-sure-what-that-is?” non-Aston/Alvis/Jag pedigree . It’s a lovely ‘mongrel’ of a traditional steel ladder chassis, massive 5.3L Chrysler Canada V8 autobox drivetrain and a hand-built full aluminium body that is decidedly framed in the pre-war coachbuilding tradition.

Not for everyone obviously - but since the total production of the company over its 70 year life was just over half the number of Porsches that were made in a week in 2021 (!) it should maybe get a bit of leeway?

Nigel,

Make sure you buy one that has been rewired, preferably with a new professionally built loom. Bristol and Iso Rivolta must have been the last companies in the world still using cloth covered rubber insulated wire. 

Wilson

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Hallo,

Look here: Interesting Leica gear

[Ivan Goriup]

4 hours ago, a.j.z said:

John, what happened to your original account?

I am not quite sure what happened nor whom to blame, but I'll try to fix it and re-register under my original name, signature & avatar after the holidays. Until then I am using my 'birth name' as it appeared on my visa when I arrived in the US. 

For the next mystery car, I offer the attached,. and suggest that some "out-of-the-box" thinking might be helpful in nailing this historic automobile.

JZG

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